Just flew a co-op mission and discovered I had no tank kills, even though I blasted them with guns and cannon...what is the secret?

Rockets and bombs.

I find rockets best but some of the lads can hit them with bombs. It is quite possible to kill them with 20mm canon but you will need repeated strafing runs on the same tank. Tempests, Beaufighers & Mosquitoes (and I think maybe one of the Corsairs) have 4x20mm canon. Three or four accurate bursts will kill most tanks. If you don't mind flying an IL-2 then one of them (Type M?? maybe) has huge canon which are effective against tanks.

You could also try flying the Ju-87G, it has a pair of 37mm cannons and it's IMO the most powerful of its class... Also, there's that Me-262/U4 which has a 50mm gun in the nose...

One of the loadouts for the Bf-110 also has a 37mm cannon, and it carries much more ammo than the Ju-87G. Quite useful for plinking T-34's.

The one thing I find most useful when going after tanks is to select a single tank as the target. Don't go for the "I'll plant a bomb in between all those tanks" line of thinking. Select one target and kill it. If you have ordnance for a second run, great. Do it again. If not, go home and rearm.

Tank killing with...

... bombs : The larger the bomb, the less pinpoint accuracy is needed. For instance, trying to bomb heavily armored tanks with 50kg bombs is pointless. Against light tanks or armored cars, 50kg can be used, but you must score hits within a couple meters to destroy them. My favorite tank killing bomb is the 500kg/1,000lb bomb. With a weapon that size you have a small margin for error, and it's quite effective on tight groups of tanks as well. Of course the "atom" bombs (1,000kg and larger) will be devastating to groups of armor, but those are not always available, and if they are it's usually way out of historical context to use them (a pet peeve of mine).

... guns : It's crucial to attack tanks from the rear when strafing. Determine the tank's orientation and attack from behind. Again, it's critical to select a single tank as the target. If you don't kill it on the first run, make additional runs on that one tank. It's useful to set a fairly long convergeance for your cannons as well, else you'll need to get dangerously close to the target to get the full effect of your cannons. I use 700-800m for convergeance when I know I'm going after tanks. Careful approach is needed, especially when using aircraft with the larger cannons (Ju-87G for example) with very limited ammo supply. The Ju-87G only has six or seven two-round bursts from it's cannons, you have to make them count! You should be flying a slight descent, properly trimmed so you're not skidding through the air, then open fire with mg's only (if possible) to range-in your target. When you see the mg's are on target, open up with the cannon.

... rockets : Rockets are useful, but rather erratic and not very accurate. Be sure to know what type of rockets to use if going against armored targets. There is a wide variety of rockets to select, some are simple HE (High Explosive) and relatively useless against tanks, while others are AP (Armor Piercing) but must score direct hits to be of any use. While rockets can be launched from longer range than guns, they don't seem to carry enough punch if launched a long way out. Accuracy is bad at longer ranges as well, a crucial factor if using AP rockets that have little blast effect. I find rockets are best against softer targets, and rarely select AP types at all.

I think we have a new video idea for Dart: Plinking Tanks. He has a nice instructional movie on general ground attack with various weapons, but nothing devoted solely to the art of killing tanks.

Killing armor in IL-2 is also more sophisticated than you'd think. The IL-2's 23mm cannons can take out tanks but only when attacking from the rear of the tank and from an angle (roughly 40 degrees). Its challenging but doable to take out tanks with larger size cannons if the angle and aim is correct. But try and hit the front armor at a low angle and you'll be shooting all day.

Heavy machine guns are worthless against most types of tanks. So are large calibre cannons with high explosive shells....worthless against a tank. People strafe tanks with the MK108 cannons only to be disappointed.

A direct hit with most types of rockets to the rear of the tank will usually get you a kill. But avoid the front.

Actually, Dart's "Ground Attack" video is pretty good. No need for dedicated tank-plinking video after all.

http://www.darts-page.com

My take...

Bombs:
- Anything under 50kg is unlikely to be effective. Many of these small bombs are ineffectual even if they score a direct hit. Some of them (such as the PTAB) are anti-tank weapons - although one has to drop a large number of them in order to score a direct hit.
- 50-70kg bombs are effective. They have to be delivered at the lowest safe altitude and with some skill in order to hit close enough to the tank to be effective. This leaves one vulnerable to anti-aircraft fire and also to other difficulties (such as the bomb bouncing off of the ground), but it does allow more passes to be made (necessary in some situations but generally a bad idea if one pass is acceptable). Alternatively, several of these bombs can be dropped from higher altitude.
- Larger bombs in the 250kg and especially 500kg class can destroy most tanks, even at a considerable distance from the mark. They both allow the pilot to drop them from higher altitudes and require the pilot to do so (so as to avoid getting caught in the blast).
- Large 1000kg-2000kg bombs are most likely too effective and should generally be avoided (as should the Ki-84 and the late models of the Spitfire etc.)

Rockets:
- Historical records seem to indicate that WW2 era rockets were much more inaccurate than in Il-2. The probability of hitting a tank with a pair of 60lb rockets was something like less than 5%.
- The BRS series of rockets are merely a later series production with a strengthened side walls and a few other changes (not anti-armour rockets as is widely reported).
- AP warheads on western rockets (eg. 60lb, 4.5" etc.) tended to be used against shipping and also allowed attacks against reinforced structures and earthworks.
- For the most part rockets seem to have been used to attack ships, soft vehicles, buildings and area targets, not specific vehicles.
- Footnote: The X-4 joystick controlled missile, as modeled in game, can be effective against medium tanks if it scores a direct hit.

Guns:
- Attacks from above, from the rear and from the sides are best (only the lightest armoured cars can be attacked routinely from the front)
- The 50cal can indeed be used against mid-war tanks sides and rear and occasionally destroy them. This is almost certainly unrealistic (as the tanks aren't disabled, which may be possible, but instead completely destroyed in the game).
- Higher powered 20mm cannons such as the 23mm VYa, especially when carrying AP belts, and the 20mm Hispano with a round that is almost twice as heavy as most other guns in its class, can and will penetrate the weaker areas of many early to mid war tanks. It is highly variable though. You'll find the 15mm AP rounds of the MG151/15 several times more effective than the 20mm MG-FF for instance,and that most 20mm cannons will be ineffective.
- 30mm and 37mm cannons again, depend on the gun and ammunition. The Mk-108 with its low velocity is relatively ineffective, the T-9/M-4 37mm found on the P-39 is only a bit better. The high velocity Mk-103's AP round is effective against medium tanks (but its high explosive round remains ineffective).
- The Soviet NS-37 (and slightly scaled up NS-45 with its 45mm round) have very heavy rounds do tend to penetrate that armour of most tanks if fired at close range. The Pak 3.7's AP round (available on the Ju-87G and Bf-110) is effective against vulnerable shots of tanks - even when fired at longer ranges. The 50mm BK-5 available on the Me-262 has a high rate of fire and is difficult to use accurately but is relatively effective. No player aircraft in the game have 75-90mm cannons, one can see that they are effective but that low rates of fire decrease the probability of scoring a hit.

Ramming:
- Works, almost surely much too well. Unlike with "Taran" tactics against enemy aircraft a ramming attack on a tank is almost certainly lethal and should be avoided.

In summary:
- Don't ram
- Don't use rockets or extremely large bombs. These are for area targets and especially ships.
- Only attack tanks from the top, the sides and the rear
- Use many small bomblets or low altitude 50kg bombs, or a single 250kg/500kg bomb dropped in a dive area bombardment from high altitude
- Guns are variable depending one whether a high explosive or armour penetrating round happens to hit
- Gun effectiveness depends on range (higher penetration if fired at close range) and luck (sometimes it takes several rounds before a weak spot is found).
- The best ones in their size classes are the 15mm MG151/15, 23mm VYa, 20mm Hispano, 30mm Mk-103, 37mm/45mm NS-37/NS-45 and the 37mm Bk 3.7

"- Historical records seem to indicate that WW2 era rockets were much more inaccurate than in Il-2. The probability of hitting a tank with a pair of 60lb rockets was something like less than 5%."

I think the main reason for this is the distance at which IL-2 players fire their rockets. I believe they get much closer to their targets than their real-life counterparts. I know I do...:)

Aviar

Tank killing from the air was not very effective in WWII and overclaiming was rampant. The main reasons were

- misidentification (a lot of trucks and halftracks get identified as tanks, but very few tanks get identified as trucks or halftracks)

- multiple attacks on the same targets (sometimes intentionally left in the open as decoys)

- the fact that aerial weapons produce a lot of flash and smoke, which makes it look like the target has been destroyed

Air attacks were very effective against other vehicles though.

Me too, and the reason is in all likelihood the monitor. Just like with aerial targets it makes seeing objects and judging distance harder than it is in real life. They also appear smaller than they are.

I think "realistic" A2G will have to wait for the next or next-next generation of sims.

Actually, those early war tanks were tiny!

I was looking at some scale models the other day of a Spitfire and an early German tank - it looked positively tiny next to the Spitfire! A Sherman isn't as long as the wing of a FW-190!

All true although I think the true impact against the tanks tended to be clogging up the roads with other vehicles damaged during the attack and the possibility for a soft kill. So in other words a proximity hit doesn't really kill the tank but blows off a tread or causes some sort of other damage...not to mention creating craters everywhere and that seriously bogs the tanks down. There are reports of crews fleeing from tanks as well...even when they were probably better protected inside.

This thread has got me thinking I need to start up an A/G career after a long stretch of A/A. I haven't tried the 262's 50mm out A/G yet, nor the 110's PAK 3.7 since it was re-boresighted to the gun cross several patches ago.

Has anyone else noticed the near-invulnerability of the Japanese half-track in the game? I've found most of the comments about targets vs. necessary weapons made above to be true, with this one exception. This thing seems to be armored way above its weight, especially for an open-topped vehicle.

Actually, yes!

Seems to be no point shooting them with anything lighter than a 0.50 cal / 12.7 mm, and even then it's not as easy as you might think! That's regardless of angle etc. and although similar open-topped vehicles are usually fairly easy to destroy even with smaller caliber ammo.

I always thought that the IL2 was the WWII version of the A-10 with it's tank-killing ability, but obviously I was wrong.

What about the IL2M...with it's 2 37mm cannon, will that do the trick?

Those 37mm pods on the JU-87G are great. The problem is that the ammo quantity is extremely limited. You have to be dead on with your aim.

Yes, those are effective against tanks, especially from the rear. You also want to try the PTAB cluster munitions. I've destroyed 3-4 tanks in one pass with those.

with rockets depending on the tank you have to hit it with exact convergence, you can have 10 planes hit it with 1 rocket each direct and nothing will happen unless its one convergence hit. olegs 500 and 1000lb bombs are much too weak. In real life there is footage of even 250lbers flipping alot of best german armor on thier back side with a near miss. Lots of footage out there flipping them in the air with the 500lb bombs with a miss. But that stuff is out of our control, all the ships are to strong as well.