TCanon put a poll in Racing Sim Central forum about a new version of well know BU0836,
this time a solderless (and diode-less) version:





Feedback here: Racing Sim Central

Out: http://www.leobodnar.com/products/BU0836X/
12 bits, encoder support.

Sokol1

Fantastic - my switch box is nearing the dreaded wiring stage (my soldering technique is rubbish!)

I was just about order the standard BU0836 - any idea how long it will be before this is available to buy?

No diodes and less soldering! Just what the doctor ordered - I'll take one!

That looks cool. Had that been available when I ordered my BU0836, I would have definately got one of them instead!

Aren't you still going to have to solder the other end to the switch? Plus, those snap in version type connectors weaken after time and the connections start to become iffy. There are other solderless version of I/O boards out there that use IDC type connectors that won't come loose. Plus for the same money, I can get 128 inputs from another I/O solution and still not have to solder. I can tell you from personal experience that trying to chase down one of these ghost connections can take days. Let's face it, building a pit is a daunting task and soldering is just a fact of life.

Jay

What controller does 128 inputs with no soldering for that price?

My bad, you are right. I was thinking of the Beta Innovations Gamma Ray I have, it has 256 inputs. However the Gammatron has 64 inputs and is only 9 bucks more. Plus, you can configure it to support encoders, a scan matrix (if you need that), master switches. You can expand the switch to 128 total with an addon card. Or, you can get a Plasma lite which does so much stuff it's not funny AND you can put a 64 switch addon card if you want.

Check it out:

Gamma Tron

Plasma Lite

99 bucks for each of them. I have nothing but Beta Innovations stuff running my pit. It does lights, swtiches, rotaries, instruments, flight axis. I run inductive loads, real avionics lights and controls. Plus there's an SDK so you can write your own programs if you like.

I've building and planning my sim for years and after looking at all the options, there isn't anything that comes close to what this stuff can do for as easy as it is to interface. Check out the build progress:

F-16 Build

Jay

I'm prepared to pay a little extra not to have to inline all those diodes!

I'm only building a simple box - I'd love to have the time/patience/money/skill to even contemplate that wonderful pit you've created.

None of the Beta Innovations stuff uses diodes...they are all direct input modules. However, you can ALSO activate a matrix type input IF you need it. I'm not insane enough to wire up a 256 input module with diodes. There are a couple things us viper guys need a matrix for...namely the ICP and the MFD bezels. Other than that we pretty much all use the Gamma Ray with 256 inputs. It costs more, but you can get a Gamma Tron with 64 inputs for 99 bucks. If you need more, you can add an expansion card.

Jay

Hello Jay,
Are you speaking from position of experience or just pure speculation?
These are industrial grade connectors made in Germany.
Thanks
Leo

I used an old IDE cable plugged into the BU0836 and connected the other end to a connection block, so I didn't do any soldering when I connected up my BU0836. The disadvantage of this is that the switches are connected in a 6x6 grid so if you have a lot of switches you can have up ti 6 wires going into one end of the connection block, which can get awkward. If I were building a new control box from scratch, I would probably go with this solderless version.

My plans for a contriol box are still just that; plans. But I think I would go with the solderless version if I happen to have the extra scratch at the time. The main reason is I can see myself adding to or making changes in a control box and having the ability to disconnect from the controller board without hitting it with a soldering iron is a big plus.

But now it's a great spring day and close to 70 deg. F outside so I'm heading out of the office and taking a leisurely walk to my house.
Later,
MudPuppy

Yes, the solderless connection is good if you want to make changes, no argument from me on that one. But any good interface solution should allow you to do this via the hardware/software interface with a click of the mouse. You should NEVER have to go and mess with it once you have assembled it unless you are adding more physical switches. It's been my experience with these types of connections that they invariably give you headaches and you spend hours trying to track down where the hell the problem lies because you can't see the issue, you only know it's there. Other crimp connections are the same as well unless you have the specific tool that crimps that specific connector.

Jay

It's hard to replace a switch with a new one in software.

Also, changing switch mapping and the like requires either a more complicated controller or a special driver layer. From what I've seen this chip just uses the standard USB HID drivers and has just enough logic on the chip to send the axis and button data up the USB cable.

Yeah, if the switch physically goes bad and you have to replace it. But then you are not dealing with the controller end of the circuit, it's the switch end. Chances are you still have to solder that end.
It's baffling to me that folks will go to great lengths to avoid a soldering iron. We are in the pit building section, you're going to need to know how to use a soldering iron at some point.

Curious, what other input solutions are on the market where you have to solder your connections to the input device itself? Please post a link.

And changing switch mappings does not require a special driver layer. Beta Innovations have had products on the market for years where you can go into the provided software and with a couple mouse clicks completely change the function of a switch. Oh, and they use standard USB HID drivers as well. No special drivers needed. And the logic on the chip is not "just enough", it quite robust, fast and capable of doing many things.

I've tried or personally known folks that have tried just about every interface on the market.

EPIC: Been there, sold that. Very capable piece of hardware...provided you can write code and configure everything yourself.
PHCC: Got all that stuff sitting in the drawer. Open source is the attraction to this. Downside is one needs to write their own interface or it just keeps sitting in the drawer. However, if they fall off the face of the Earth, all the stuff is there to make more.
OPEN COCKPITS: Need a fire extinguisher by the pit in case it starts burning. I like realism, but that's taking it a bit far.
REAL SIMULATORS: Had wonderful stuff, then went commercial and now there's no software support to speak of. Plus, if you buy it used, they won't talk to you about support or any help for that matter. Had this happen to a good friend where they refused to send him the software to drive it. Oh, I've owned all the stuff they put out at one time or another. Still have some of the stuf...sitting in a drawer collecting dust.
LEO BODNAR: Haven't owned any of this stuff but seems quite capable and those that do have them seem to like them.
BETA INNOVATIONS: What I am currently using and will continue to use. Does everything all the other stuff does (except catch fire). Did all this stuff long before anyone else did it. Has software to interface to Falcon and Racing sims. All you do is configure the software and you're off. Oh, and none of the stuff requires soldering to the interface. You can buy modules that initialize as windows joysticks if you like, but you'll need several of them for doing a bit pit. Better to go with one module.

That's my take on interface solutions. I've been around pit building, all be it on the viper side, since pretty much the beginning.

Jay

You forgot (IMHO) probably one of the more robust, easy to program, easy to set-up, and my personal favorite......Hagstrom Electronics.
(Although, they're no where near the cheapest!)

And while my Opencockpits USBKeys board has never caught fire either (Thankfully!!! ), I have to say I agree with the rest of your assessments.

crease-guard,,

You forgot X-keys, in particular their Matrix Board. Pretty cheap for two layers of 128 inputs each, although it requires diodes.

As for the solderless BU0836X, it looks very easy to use but the price (~$90) is pretty high. What's nice about Leo's products is that they are simple and cheap. Every product has its place in the pit builders' market, though.

A solderless version would be useful for anyone that doesn't like to handle a soldering iron at all, or that fears that his soldering may damage the circuit board. If you aren't worried of soldering things just once, you can always attach a ribbon cable to the standard circuit board and run all the wires to a strip connector.
Something like this:

(I just found the image with Google, it's not on my server and it may disappear in the future)
This is what I did for my arcade joystick: I ran a bunch of wires from an USB joypad board to a strip connector, and then individual wires from the connector to the joystick microswitches.

Actual BU's (non solderlees X) dont require solder into circuit pins.



He comes with convenient fitting connectors.
Six with 3 pin for each potentiometer (axis).
And two with 6 pin for the LINES and COLUMNS (buttons).

It is enough to weld one wire in each one of 6 pin of LINES and COLUMNS connectors,
and to combine these wires in the buttons, using a diode in one diode pin.

Then with 12 wires he connect 32 buttons. Very convenient in the case of rewire a joystick/throttle.

In solderless version it will be necessary to use 64 wires to connect the 32 buttons.
Very convenient for a panel or button-box.

But imagine pass 44 wires inside grip tube of (ex-gameporte) TM F22PRO/CH F-16 Fighterstick...
Well, you can reduce these 44 wires to 23 using a GND wire for all of grip buttons.



Sokol1

Well, now I understand because the solderless version is so wanted:





Edit.: For a better understanding of how to set up a semi-solderless (1) matrix:



Show only half of screw conectors bars. Use six for ROWS and six for COLUMNS.
Partial wiring, for clarity of the drawing.

(1) require wiring welding in diode cathode and in pins of fitting connectors bar.

Sokol1

I have the regular BU0836 and it looks like I will be using 30 of these: 1N4148 or 1N4004 diodes for my switches.

How should the diodes be positioned/wired? From the pic above there will be 6 diodes for each Row.

Questions:
1. Can I connect the diodes to the Columns instead of the Rows (I already have my Rows soldered and dont feel like undoing everything)?

2. Does the cathode connect to the switch and the anode connect to the Row(Column) or does the anode connect to the switch and the cathode connect to the Row(Column)?

Thanks for any help.