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#2253848 - 07/08/07 05:37 PM Lancaster WIP  
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Loki Offline
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Hey all,

So I think it's time to unveil this project.
I've been working on this for a few months now. My goal is to see the Lancaster flyable in SoW, and since the sim will be open for 3rd party development, I decided to get started early because this project is ENORMOUS. The plan is to have a Mk. I and Mk. III with fully modeled crew stations and the requisite Tall Boy, Grand Slam and Upkeep loadouts.

It is for this reason I am posting this now. With a full-time job, this project is too much for me to handle all alone in any reasonable time frame. I need a team of dedicated and experienced artists and I hope I can find some here. I'd rather work with people from the community, but will bring in non-simmers of necessary.

At the same time, I'm hoping this will stir up the 3rd party dev community once more, like back in FB days \:\)

And so, this is how she's looking right now:


I will post WIP's here as the project progresses (another way to keep myself motivated).

If you are an artist and are interested on working on this project, please PM me here or on UBI (tag: Agamemnon22) and we can discuss the business aspects.

Thanks!

P.S. I used to go by Agamemnon22, I'm the guy who modeled the Pe-2.

Last edited by Loki; 07/08/07 05:40 PM.
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#2253868 - 07/08/07 06:01 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Loki]  
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HenFre Offline
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Looking good so far Loki ..

How many tries does it concist of at the moment and whats the target? I believe the target for such bombers where set at some 20.000 tries or am I wrong.. I would also love to see some wireframe shots with texture!..

How much time have you put into this thing already? Are you a professional 3D artist? Was the Pe-2 that you made included in the Il-2 series? And are you using 3D Max?.. A lot of questions but just curious..

Good luck on the project in the future..

Regards

Henrik

#2253889 - 07/08/07 06:34 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: HenFre]  
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Loki Offline
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Hey Henrik,

Right now it's around the 26000 tri mark. It's a little on the heavy side, but its a complex model as well -- inside and out. I expect this to go down as well as I go through texturing and alpha-cutting where possible.

I've been gathering reference since last summer, when I spent 2 hours inside a Lanc in a museum. Actual modeling started in late January, but slowed down considerably in May when I started the new job. I am a professional 3d artist, I've been in games since 2004 and the Pe-2 cockpit project that started much like this, independent, turned into Pe-2: Stories of a Dive Bomber for FB.

I'm working in MAX, yep.

I should mention that this is not affiliated with Oleg or 1C in any way. 100% independent.

Wire and paneling layout (void, in FB lingo):

#2254054 - 07/08/07 11:12 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Loki]  
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No457_Squog Offline
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Bloody eck, Loki/Agamemnon!

I used to dabble in 3DSMAX, but haven't looked at the program in a few years...

I'll see if I can't drum up some support for your model ;\)


No457_Squog
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No. 457 Squadron vRAAF
#2254055 - 07/08/07 11:13 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Loki]  
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Chivas Offline
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Very nice Loki. Have you mentioned to Oleg that you were interested in building the Lanc's model. I've heard Oleg mention that the Lanc was one of his favorite aircraft and wouldn't doubt that he would like his crew to model it. I'm not saying either would do a better job. Just wondering.


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#2254290 - 07/09/07 08:52 AM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Chivas]  
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Asheshouse Offline
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Superb work,and excellent news that we may be able to look forward to a crewable heavy bomber in the future. Any plans for introducing "bouncing bombs" and spot lights for altitude guidance? Would the SoW code allow bombs to bounce on a water surface?

First operational use of the Mk1 was in August 1942 in a daylight raid on Augsburg so the add on may have to await the release of late war aircraft and maps. A map covering the Ruhr including the Mohne and Eder Dams would be about the same size as the SoW BoB map seems likely to be and could overlap with it. Will we be able to fly across map boundaries in later SoW series? I can see me staying up all night for this one.

PS: I bought the Pe-2 add-on when it was released. Still one of my favourite aircraft to fly in IL-2. Come to think of it I've now bought it twice.

Last edited by Asheshouse; 07/09/07 09:15 AM.
#2254328 - 07/09/07 11:12 AM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Asheshouse]  
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Guderian Offline
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Fantastic looking model. I hope we'll see it in the game some day.

As for bouncing bombs, isn't that already possible in Il2?


"I prefer to fly alone ... when alone, I perform those little coups of audacity which amuse me" - René Fonck
#2254371 - 07/09/07 12:40 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Guderian]  
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Hey, that's coooool!

Doing models for "that other game" I prefer not to imagine the quantity (and quality) of details you're adding to that baby \:\)

#2254441 - 07/09/07 02:09 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: KozheMkII]  
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No105_Archie Offline
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Beautiful work \:\)

Please corect me if I am wrong...but the Lanc did not come into service until well after the BoB ...maybe 1942 ?

So I can't imagine that Oleg & co would allow it to be included in SOW


Archie Smythe

carpe diem
#2254467 - 07/09/07 02:37 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: No105_Archie]  
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Well they are including an Su26 stunt plane......... \:\)

Seriously I can't imagine that the Lanc would get included in the first release, later I can't see why not. As AI ' I'd say deffo, as flyable the amount of work required would be enormous. We've already seen how detailed the cockpits crew stations are for BOB. To model the whole interior of the Lanc to that level of detail would be a huge undertaking.

I've said numerous times that I don't think flyable heavies are worth the modelling effort considering the number of punters that'll fly them in offline campaigns or online co-ops. On the other hand I have to say that I'd love to fly a perfectly modelled Lancaster in a Maddox sim. The Lanc is my favourite aircraft of all time, ever since being tiny and watching and listening to the RAF BOB flight Lancaster at airshows in the 70s. The sound of those 4 merlins just brings a lump to my throat every time. So its sort of a head versus heart thing, if that makes any sense.

Nice work Loki \:D

PS... Maybe you should get Olegs point of view on this one though, before people in here get too over excited?


Last edited by Mogster; 07/09/07 02:38 PM.

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#2254538 - 07/09/07 04:31 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Mogster]  
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Loki Offline
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Hey guys, thanks for the replies.

Firstly, relase time:
My initial projection was 18 months from start, but with the slowdown, I think we're looking at more like 20, if I can get back to the speed I was at before May. If I can find a good team, that time will naturally shrink. That is to say, that completion is aimed for about this time next year.

As someone pointed out, the Lanc really doesn't fit into BoB timeframe \:D However, Oleg's plan for the SoW series is to cover most theaters in turn, so the time will come for the Ruhr, Dresden, etc. However, it's a catch-22, if there are no strategic bombers, there won't be a map of these areas, if there is no map, there won't be any strategic bombers (one of the current arguments agaisnt them in FB). IMO, once we break the cycle, things will fall into place. This is also the reason I publicize this project so early on: something for mapbuilders to consider, get the gears moving... as soon as the tools are available \:\)

I have contacted Oleg numerous times about this, before starting the project, but there was never any reply. He's a busy guy, I can't blame him. However, with the 3rd party dev tools becoming available to people outside of 1C, a project can be independent.

I shared with them all 750 megs of my references, so for all I know they're building their own Lancaster, but without any info, I choose to assume that they're not, yet.

One thing we have to face with SoW development is that it's going to be slow. It's true, the Lanc didn't fly until 1942, and it'll take the series a while to catch up to 1942 in scenarios. But I want to make sure that when we get there, we will have a flyable heavy, especially one as interesting from a gameplay point of view as the Lanc (H2S, night/day applications, high alt. strategic/low level surgical strike). If the plane comes before any other 1942 expansions, we will at least have it for multiplayer until such time as the series catches up.

Mogster, like you say, it's a matter of head vs. heart. I think my heart's winning on this one \:\)

#2254570 - 07/09/07 05:11 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Loki]  
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SaQSoN Offline
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Originally Posted By: Loki

I shared with them all 750 megs of my references, so for all I know they're building their own Lancaster, but without any info, I choose to assume that they're not, yet.


They don't. And don't even plan to in the near future. They will need that reference to check your model, when you're done. \:\)

I've sent a letter or 2 some time ago to you, but got no reply. So, may be, they didn't reach you. I have some vital tech info for you, so please, contact me via mail from a valid address.


_ _ __ _ _

Best regards,


SaQSoN (Vladimir Kochmarsky)
#2254592 - 07/09/07 05:51 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Guderian]  
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Asheshouse Offline
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Originally Posted By: Guderian
Fantastic looking model. I hope we'll see it in the game some day.

As for bouncing bombs, isn't that already possible in Il2?


Wow! your right. I just tried it out with a B25 dropping from low level. Only two bounces though, but you dont really expect a 1000lb bomb to bounce.

Last edited by Asheshouse; 07/10/07 04:24 PM.
#2254613 - 07/09/07 06:32 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Asheshouse]  
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Mogster Offline
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I think skip bombings been in IL2 from the start. Really if the physics is there to land on the water then it'll also let you bounce objects off it.


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#2254748 - 07/09/07 08:59 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Mogster]  
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Avimimus Offline
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The most maneuverable of heavy bombers...

Good luck,

-Avimimus (IS-4!)

#2254887 - 07/10/07 12:52 AM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Avimimus]  
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Skip bombing's been in the from the get go. It seemed that was the only consistant way I could blow up bridges for a while.

Nice work, Loki. I hope it does get included into BoB sometime in the future.

Last edited by knightgames; 07/10/07 12:53 AM.
#2255112 - 07/10/07 08:58 AM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: knightgames]  
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Only 26.000 polies ? Great job to make it this good then!

#2255294 - 07/10/07 02:57 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Loki]  
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PAW1 Offline
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It IS a beautiful model. Been busting to get my hands on a sim that features allied mass formation strategic bombers for some time (especially one with a convincing set of cerw turrets). Nothing's really hit the mark so far, this could be it (I'll wait to see the interiors).

IL2's B25 came close but I never really felt like I was firing a whacking great pair of .50 cals. For one, the machine gun belts in the top turret don't move.

I know the Lancaster doesn't show till after the BoB but it would be awesome to have it none the less.

Good luck Loki

#2255651 - 07/10/07 11:17 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: Mogster]  
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Nice model there Loki, it should have been in IL2 a long time ago.
Have you seen the "prescription" for SOW models posted?
Is it the same as IL2, with heavier poly limit and same mapping rules and LOD rules? or are there new requirements?

BTW I see something funny going on inboard of both engines on port wing (a darker area there), seems like pinching or wrong smoothing, its around the area where the triangualar polys aound the nacelles meet the quads on the leading edge..

#2256475 - 07/11/07 08:28 PM Re: Lancaster WIP [Re: nils]  
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Great work Loki! Maybe you should put thumbs into this thread, linking to the real-size images, it is really painful to scroll down and try to read this thread because it is so wide.

I think you have started this project at a good moment, given the complexity of the model and all. It will be just in time for the future sims in the SoW series. A Lanc would indeed be great to have, even though night fighting will always be difficult to model in a flight sim.


My Il-2 CoD movie web site: www.flightsimvids.com
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