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#1533282 - 01/12/05 05:17 PM Looking around cockpitframes.  
Joined: Feb 2001
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jeroen Offline
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jeroen  Offline
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arnhem, netherlands
In sims the cockpit frame can obscure distant objects.
In real life the pilot can move his head to look around the frame.

While you could add controls to move the pilot's head in three extra dimensions, it could be too complex to do it manually.
But if you place the camera a bit infront of the pivot point then panning the view would automatically result in the camera moving.

The camera and pivotpoint in the same place:
[img]http://www.geocities.com/jeroen_huijben/noparallax.txt[/img]
The camera in front of the pivotpoint:
[img]http://www.geocities.com/jeroen_huijben/parallax.txt[/img]

Could this be implemented in JetThunder?
It can be configured by the user setting the distance between camera and pivotpoint.
0 would be the normal position and the greater the distance the greater the effect.


2147483647 angels can dance on the point of a needle.
Add one and they will all turn into devils.
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#1533283 - 01/12/05 08:48 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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scary_pigeon Offline
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britain
good post - we have this set up already - we can set its level quite easily and it could be a user setting.

eventually though, we'll have trackIR 6of put in.

what do you think of eye roll?

in real life when you rock your head sideways - your eyes roll along the roll axis to maintain the direction of perceived gravity.

in flightsims, this means at slow speeds - as in hoving especially, when you roll the plane, in real life the aircraft will appear to roll, the horizon stay more steady..

..but in flightsims you never get that - just that they eye behaves like a camera and rocks from side to side without the automatic comensation we have as humans.

I believe when I add in eye roll it makes things seem so damn real - whereas when dante see it its like UGH, thats aweful.

#1533284 - 01/12/05 08:57 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  

**DONOTDELETE**
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Man oh man, I just can't wait for this sim \:\)

Eye roll \:\) Yes please, optionable would be best I'm guessing although I have no idea how hard that is to implement.

Keep up the good work people \:\)

Dano.

#1533285 - 01/12/05 11:44 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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scary_pigeon Offline
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britain
http://fluffysteve.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/rolleyes.avi

i did a quick movie to show eyeroll.

flying slow in the hover the movie starts, i then mess about and we see that our body still feels most of the gravity earthwards, so the plane rolls around stationary eyes that compensate of tilt.

then we build up speed and do a hard turn. And the eyes stay more or less locked with the plane axis since the G force pulled is greater than real gravity.

#1533286 - 01/12/05 11:53 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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jeroen Offline
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:rolleyes: <- appropriate smiley ;\)

Looks good.
Will it only be an automatic transition as speed builds up or can we also manually switch between cocpit- and horizon-stabilized modes?


2147483647 angels can dance on the point of a needle.
Add one and they will all turn into devils.
#1533287 - 01/13/05 12:56 AM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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scary_pigeon Offline
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britain
at the moment it is automatic - to model how they eye behaves under different g forces- there will be a setting to switch it on and off.

#1533288 - 01/13/05 01:08 AM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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Goanna Offline
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Will the pilot be able to "look into the turn" like in LOMAC..??..or will it be a fixed straight ahead view..??

#1533289 - 01/13/05 01:11 AM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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Aladar Offline
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I like the way it kinda jerks the camera down in high-G turns.

#1533290 - 01/13/05 12:21 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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Keithb77 Offline
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Would adding a degree of transparency to cockpit frames be a simpler way of emulating 'looking around' them?

I remember all the fuss over 'head-bobbing' in Battle of Britain.........

Cheers,
Keith

#1533291 - 01/13/05 12:38 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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Dante-JT Offline
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Quote:
I believe when I add in eye roll it makes things seem so damn real - whereas when dante see it its like UGH, thats aweful.
:)
I don't mind the eye roll while the Harrier is hovering, it's even handy to keep in mind that banking too much in a hover is not a good thing to do.

Problem for me was eye roll at high speeds - as I've said, even in a high speed bike the human mind seems to adjust to the banking turns. But seems you fixed that, good job


-----
Jet Thunder Project
http://www.thunder-works.com
#1533292 - 01/13/05 02:54 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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Trident Offline
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Thanks for posting the video, that certainly convinced me! I does look strange initially, but the feeling of motion is excellent \:\)

#1533293 - 01/13/05 06:25 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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schurem Offline
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amen, that looks AWESOME!


Oh! I have slipped the surly bonds of Earth
And danced the skies on laughter-silvered wings,
Sunward I've climbed, and joined the tumbling mirth
#1533294 - 01/13/05 07:11 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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GoGamer.com - Jason Offline
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Redlands, CA
Jet Thunder Crew,

I work for NaturalPoint and would like to talk to you guys about adding TrackIR 3 with Vector support to Jet Thunder. Which I am pretty excited about! For those that don't know about TrackIR 3 with Vector, it allows View Control in 6DOF. It is already supported in several other current and upcoming sims. I would think that you guys would want it supported as well.

I am the new Marketing and Developer Relations guy and woud love to see 6DOF support in Jet Thunder. Can someone drop me a line so I can contact you more directly.

And good work on the sim guys. It's looking real good.

I can be reached at jason@naturalpoint.com

Regards,
Jason Williams
Marketing Director
NaturalPoint, Inc.

#1533295 - 01/13/05 08:46 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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Joe Offline
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This thread is a perfect example of new features, a hard working development team, and response to the community. Keep it up devs; thank you.

I am very excited to hear about TIR 6DOF.

I am missing a codec to view that video, and would really like to see it. What do I need to download?

#1533296 - 01/13/05 09:43 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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GoGamer.com - Jason Offline
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GoGamer.com - Jason  Offline
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Redlands, CA
Steve,

My reply email to you keeps getting bounced back for some strange reason. Can you check it out? Hmmm...maybe it's something I'm doing wrong.

I get this message.

Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.

Subject: RE: hello
Sent: 1/13/2005 1:32 PM

The following recipient(s) could not be reached:

'Steve *****' on 1/13/2005 1:32 PM
550 5.7.1 <*************.com>... Relaying denied

Jason

#1533297 - 01/13/05 10:31 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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scary_pigeon Offline
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britain
that is a strange thing. I emailed myself from other account and it worked.

I have no idea, except maybe our anti-spam filters are over excited? - perhaps you could try my other email address?

steven_dobbs@blueyonder.co.uk

#1533298 - 01/13/05 10:57 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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GoGamer.com - Jason Offline
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GoGamer.com - Jason  Offline
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Redlands, CA
Hey guys,

Ok I found out that it's our server failing to forward on my mail to you because I am currently at a remote location. I'll get in touch with you guys on Monday if it's ok. Sorry about the hassle. Thanks for taking a look though :-)

Jason

#1533299 - 01/14/05 11:03 AM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  

**DONOTDELETE**
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I like the eye-roll too. By the way, I noticed a fast sun reflection on the canopy frame in the last part of the movie. Never seen anything like it, nice touch!

#1533300 - 01/16/05 06:21 AM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  
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Joe Offline
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Ok, I checked out that video.

I like the eyeroll - keep it. The hovering flight reminded me of a helicopter sim, which I think is a good thing.

#1533301 - 01/16/05 12:42 PM Re: Looking around cockpitframes.  

**DONOTDELETE**
Unregistered
Anonymous
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Great feature - looking forward to this sim.

If I recall correctly TFX used to have an eye-roll effect in the virtual cockpit - impressive even with the limited graphics back then.

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