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New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images)

Posted By: citizen guod

New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/04/12 09:12 PM
































Posted By: dsawan

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/04/12 10:24 PM

can you play as infantry?
Posted By: EinsteinEP

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/04/12 11:15 PM

Sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet
Posted By: Genbrien

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/04/12 11:18 PM

Originally Posted By: dsawan
can you play as infantry?

nop, but you can ''control'' them
Posted By: dsawan

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/04/12 11:37 PM

This is a must have
Posted By: kludger

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 01:32 AM

Nice!

When will it be available?
Posted By: Avimimus

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 01:49 AM

Originally Posted By: Genbrien
Originally Posted By: dsawan
can you play as infantry?

nop, but you can ''control'' them


'Drop team' had the best way of playing as infantry in a game like this! Of course, it helped that your squad had jump jets...
Posted By: citizen guod

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 03:09 AM

Originally Posted By: kludger
Nice!

When will it be available?


Open Beta expected in the next few weeks.
Posted By: Magnum

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 03:50 AM

Ok, now I'm impressed, and getting excited... I had my concerns at the idea at first.
Posted By: Pooch

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 03:55 AM

I have A-10C. What do I do to become part of this?
Posted By: kludger

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 04:00 AM

Originally Posted By: guod
Originally Posted By: kludger
Nice!

When will it be available?


Open Beta expected in the next few weeks.


Excellent, ready to join in.
Posted By: Cadmium77

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 06:06 AM

wow, those look awesome. The thing I particularly like about them is that the operations are taking place on a full scale battlefield. All other military games (save perhaps Steel Beasts Pro PE) seem to shrink down their maps and that has the effect of making them feel somewhat toylike. I suspect with the full mapping of Limnos in 1 to 1 scale that this will no longer be an issue.

This is going to feel very realistic.

I can't wait.

Thanks for sharing that with us.
Posted By: trindade

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 07:56 AM

Originally Posted By: Pooch
I have A-10C. What do I do to become part of this?


+1

Edit: I guess the answer is here:

http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/news/
Posted By: RSColonel_131st

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 08:49 AM

Well, the terrain is a bit flat for tank combat - but the whole environment is awesome enough to make up for it I guess.
Posted By: bengo

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 09:18 AM

Originally Posted By: RSColonel_131st
Well, the terrain is a bit flat for tank combat - but the whole environment is awesome enough to make up for it I guess.


I think real-life Iraq was flatter, no ?
The aim here is not to bring a tank battle simulation on the market. I think they are aiming to expand their flightsim with human-controlled ground battle. And ED's focus will, for now, stay mainly on the flighsim-side of things.

B
Posted By: Silver_Dragon

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 09:23 AM

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/3601807/1.html

Others images and prerelease video
Posted By: Smithcorp

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 09:30 AM

Yes, it doesn't appear to have the detailed relief that SB Pro:PE has, that tank combat would really need. I imagine the main fun in this sim will be the air to ground war and vice versa. I'm much looking forward to this...
Posted By: Silver_Dragon

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 10:02 AM

For now, Combined Arms will be the basis for the concept of ground control units and battlefied command structure, which is going to be adding new features in the future. At this point, does ED not fit the idea of creating a sim type SBPro or similar for now, but leaves the door open for 3rd Parties can join to the project and create ground units.
Posted By: bengo

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 10:06 AM

Here's what DCS Combined Arms aims at :
http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1473292&postcount=1
Posted By: RSColonel_131st

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 12:58 PM

I wonder if there may be smaller maps with higher mesh resolution in the cards for the future. I understand that right now it can be tons of fun especially with the air side involvement, but yeah, as Smithcorp said, detailed relief data is very important for tank fighting. It seems like there's almost "unlimited LOS" into the flat distance.
Posted By: Talon

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 06:20 PM

At first glance I thought I was looking at Steel Beasts Pro. This could in effect be an alternative to SB Pro, IMHO.

I've always been a fan of the electronic battlefield as it was envisioned by Spectrum Holobyte. Now it looks like our dreams will be finally realized. Here's hoping someone decides to model a Tornado (in the spirit of that golden oldie).


Gotta say, I love the direction DCS is headed.

--T
Posted By: Wags

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 06:33 PM

Just to manage expectations, please do not expect ground vehicle control to be at the level of SB Pro. In this first iteration, it would be more akin to the Battlefield series. However, where it dramatically differs from BF3 is operational scale, inclusion of online JTAC controllers (an outgrowth of some of our military projects), interaction with DCS air units, indirect fire systems, and the 2D Command Map. While 1st person control of many ground units is possible, it will not be possible yet to act as a FPS leg unit.

While the first release of CA will be a big step for us in the direction of the digital battlefield, it is just the first step and there are many areas we plan on fleshing out in coming years (control of AI air and naval units, FPS role, higher detail terrain, different types of artillery rounds, improved dust and smoke, etc.).

Thanks
Posted By: SkateZilla

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 06:33 PM

no more BF3 for me.. lol
Posted By: citizen guod

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 06:39 PM

Originally Posted By: Maj_Alvega
Originally Posted By: Pooch
I have A-10C. What do I do to become part of this?


+1

Edit: I guess the answer is here:

http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/news/


EinsteinEP and Magnum are doing a feature on capabilities in land and air, and how A-10 and Combined Arms work together.
Posted By: bogusheadbox

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 06:51 PM

Wags, if your could indulge me.

I know the vehicles will be "simplistic" in comparison to DCS craft. But will key elements of these vehicles have correct items like engagement times and cycles. With a Surface2air asset, will (though the systems simplistic) simulate a corect time to attack simulating detection times, IFF times, and weapon deployment times.


Also, i am really keen to know more about the asset tracking and will this involve the creating of supply lines limiting available ordinance at a base. E.g. At the moment, any craft can load up on max effective weapons. so if 15 warthogs spawn in with max mavericks and all crash on take off and spawn again with max mavericks, will they deplete a current store of availble weapons thus limiting others to different ordinance until resupply?

Just interested in how it will work.
Posted By: TankHunter

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 07:07 PM

It could be entertaining, but it is no SB Pro. It does not appear to have much in terms of FCS.
Posted By: tusler

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 07:33 PM

I can't wait to get in a mobile SAM duckhunter , go to the edge of the forest next to the battle and tag some A10's whenpigsfly and the KA50 will not have a hope attack .
At least the first time I fire, if they spot my position after that...the story might not have a good ending for me help
Posted By: trindade

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 08:18 PM

Originally Posted By: guod
Originally Posted By: Maj_Alvega
Originally Posted By: Pooch
I have A-10C. What do I do to become part of this?


+1

Edit: I guess the answer is here:

http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/news/


EinsteinEP and Magnum are doing a feature on capabilities in land and air, and how A-10 and Combined Arms work together.


thumbsup
Posted By: GrayGhost

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 08:18 PM

I'm not Wags, but I can probably answer some of that for you with the caveat that stuff isn't final yet, AFAIK.

The reaction time required for various SAM systems depends on detection capability (how many radar sweeps do I need to call something a track?), to operators having to track the target, to missile gyros spinning up, etc. Since the modeling of these SAMs is fairly simple (plus, they're small rapid-reaction SAMs, I believe the larger SAMs will not be playable), you will not have to deal with all this, so in that respect, engagement times should be shorter for a player. IFF isn't a real factor here.
This much you can probably glean from the screenshots anyway.

Originally Posted By: bogusheadbox
I know the vehicles will be "simplistic" in comparison to DCS craft. But will key elements of these vehicles have correct items like engagement times and cycles. With a Surface2air asset, will (though the systems simplistic) simulate a corect time to attack simulating detection times, IFF times, and weapon deployment times.



I think the intent is to accomplish as you describe, but for now, no comment - ED will properly explain the feature when it is completed.

Quote:
Also, i am really keen to know more about the asset tracking and will this involve the creating of supply lines limiting available ordinance at a base. E.g. At the moment, any craft can load up on max effective weapons. so if 15 warthogs spawn in with max mavericks and all crash on take off and spawn again with max mavericks, will they deplete a current store of availble weapons thus limiting others to different ordinance until resupply?

Just interested in how it will work.
Posted By: Genbrien

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 09:29 PM

is there a difference in speed if you drive on road compare to fields/grass ?

Is there something like in Wargame: European Escalation to tell the ground unit to drive by road instead of direct point to point ?
Posted By: 3instein

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 09:41 PM

Originally Posted By: Genbrien
is there a difference in speed if you drive on road compare to fields/grass ?

Is there something like in Wargame: European Escalation to tell the ground unit to drive by road instead of direct point to point ?


When routing ground forces, you can either set multiple waypoints to reach an end destination, or command units to follow roads.

Taken from here-
http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/series/combined_arms/ notworthy

Mick.
Posted By: EtherealN

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 09:47 PM

Also displayed in the trailer. wink
Posted By: Genbrien

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/05/12 11:01 PM

Originally Posted By: 3instein


When routing ground forces, you can either set multiple waypoints to reach an end destination, or command units to follow roads.

Taken from here-
http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/series/combined_arms/ notworthy

Mick.


guess I skipped that line... banghead duh


and what about speed ?
Posted By: 3instein

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/06/12 12:11 AM

Originally Posted By: Genbrien
Originally Posted By: 3instein


When routing ground forces, you can either set multiple waypoints to reach an end destination, or command units to follow roads.

Taken from here-
http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/series/combined_arms/ notworthy

Mick.


guess I skipped that line... banghead duh


and what about speed ?


According to the ED forums,you can set your speed,formation and route,you can see this when you look at the screenshot of the map view,but how this will be done I'm not so sure.
Mick.
Posted By: Genbrien

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/06/12 03:08 AM

I was talking if units are rolling on dirt/grass/fields
are they rolling slower than on roads
Posted By: Mr_Blastman

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/06/12 05:20 AM

It just needs Battlemechs and dropships in it to make it 100000 times better. smile
Posted By: Chug

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/06/12 02:01 PM

Lookin' good!
Posted By: Patrocles

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/06/12 02:55 PM

muy bien!
Posted By: shadowze

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/06/12 06:37 PM

I wonder what will come first
CA beta being released
OR
BS1 -> BS2 "upgrade" people being included in the DCS World beta ?
Posted By: CTR69

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/07/12 02:02 PM

Originally Posted By: shadowze
I wonder what will come first
CA beta being released
OR
BS1 -> BS2 "upgrade" people being included in the DCS World beta ?


Getting the World out of beta, me thinks
Posted By: Chris2525

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/07/12 05:05 PM

The Georgia terrain seems a little flat and featureless for good land based gameplay. But i imagine the Nevada terrain will be a different story. Even the version included in the Beta seemed to have a much more detailed terrain mesh. And besides that, the flat openness is consistent with desert environments. Should be pretty good!
Posted By: Scoobe

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/07/12 05:29 PM

Great shots,

Im really looking forward to this!

Rob
Posted By: Chris2525

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/07/12 05:35 PM

Originally Posted By: Wags
While 1st person control of many ground units is possible, it will not be possible yet to act as a FPS leg unit.


Nice!

Here's a thought. (and i'm sure i'm not the first one to have it)....

Is it possible to have different elements (land, sea and air) running different versions of the same environments (higher res for ground units, lower res for air units) but interacting with each other in the same game?

For instance, take a small map with a high level of detail (similar to what you'd see in say, BF3, or CoD), then put that town or village down inside the larger DCS map, only with a much lower resolution - one that's suitable for that type of play.

If you took, for example, a village from BF3 as an example (but not actually a BF3 map, i'm not suggesting combining maps across different titles to be clear), you could easily place a village like that in DCS, only with a fraction of the detail provided. Same number and placement of buildings, walls and large objects, just that the buildings are hollow, there's no micro-terrain on the ground, and no small ambient objects. What i mean to say is, you could represent a higher or lower resolution version of the same environment for different players using different roles. And the land based players load up the higher-res version when they play, but are restricted to that particular AO when they play online.

I think that's been the limiting factor in ALL combined arms games thus far. Environments that are detailed enough for infantry are inherently too small for aircraft to play realistically in, and environments that are big enough to accommodate realistic aviation gameplay are far too low-res for land based gameplay. I mean, the aircraft gameplay in BF3, and even ArmA2 is far too restrictive. Likewise, you wouldn't want to play as infantry in DCS given the huge, low detailed environment.


I think the problem is that developers have been trying to do multiple things at the same level of detail when different levels of detail are called for. The world is much smaller to a fighter pilot than it is to an infantryman, and this fact isn't addressed by current all arms sims. The fighter pilot doesn't need to see park benches and empty soda cans, so why not have players using different versions of the same environment based on what they're doing? Is there any reason why players can't be represented in each others environments even though they're running different versions?

Posted By: toonces

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/07/12 08:23 PM

Here's my wallet....just take whatever you need out of it and give me this now!
Posted By: XMAN1

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/07/12 09:13 PM

Someone tell me that StarForce or whatever the company has become is not infecting this thing. I still have a dead Plextor from that waste of a DRM.

I so want this, but StarForce has left a bad taste in my mouth.

-X
Posted By: Silver_Dragon

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/08/12 11:44 AM

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1498186&postcount=167
Quote:
Some night shots.

Depending on if the open beta is available next week, I will try to do some short videos in the next few days.

Thanks








Posted By: magicalflyer

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/09/12 06:14 AM

Amazing screenies.. What supercomputer I need to run this sim with that kind of graphic quality without having a slideshow?
Posted By: Mace71

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/09/12 06:52 AM

A nugget of purest green! smile

Posted By: Ssnake

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/09/12 07:22 AM

Originally Posted By: Chris2525
Is it possible to have different elements (land, sea and air) running different versions of the same environments (higher res for ground units, lower res for air units) but interacting with each other in the same game?

...

I think that's been the limiting factor in ALL combined arms games thus far. Environments that are detailed enough for infantry are inherently too small for aircraft to play realistically in, and environments that are big enough to accommodate realistic aviation gameplay are far too low-res for land based gameplay. ...


I think the problem is that developers have been trying to do multiple things at the same level of detail when different levels of detail are called for.

You forgot to count all the combined arms simulations that have NOT been done to date, because of this. Achieving terrain correlation with different terrain geometries is by definition impossible. Working with variable terrain geometry would probably require an engine tailor made for this purpose. Not saying that it is impossible, but typically you develop an engine of your own, you do it for a specific application case that you have in mind. If that first application is commercially successful you expand it. But then you're already boxed in, due to the implicit design decisions that you made years before when developing the engine itself.
So the challenge is to find a way to finance the development of at least two, better three titles with fundamentally different scope that share the engine, (parts of) the terrain, weapon effects, and network code.

The PC market isn't lucrative enough for such a massive investment (thank you, pirates!), and simulation games aren't popular on consoles. There goes your commercial motivation to try it.

This leaves the military as a possible source for such an engine. But the demand for true combined arms virtual simulations there is limited. It might work as a DARPA project - but then you won't get to see the results on the computer game market, I guess.
Posted By: xmozartx

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/10/12 01:21 AM

i believe this is all private.
outerra
cant wait for DCS to be placed in something like this.
Posted By: LukeFF

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/10/12 08:21 AM

Originally Posted By: xmozartx
i believe this is all private.
outerra
cant wait for DCS to be placed in something like this.


You're gonna be waiting a long time.
Posted By: Ssnake

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/10/12 09:10 PM

Outerra is magnificent in some ways, and utterly useless in other areas (unfortunately, game requirements usually are somewhere in the middle, leaning towards the "useless" end of the spectrum).

What good is a planetary sized game world devoid of civilization?

It only makes sense if you want to simulate the starting and landing of spacecraft in the planetary range. If they figure out a way to procedurally generate cities, if they can actually populate this virtual Earth - well, there'd be just too much space to explore ... unless you make it a somewhat aimless sandbox type of a game (in which case it could just as well be a procedurally generated fantasy world). Outerra may have a future as a basis for Google Earth, but then you want geospecific terrain in Google Earth where Outerra is all about procedurally generated, geotypical terrain.

It looks stunningly beautiful. It's a marvelous tech demo. I just don't see a practical application of it unless you want to just fly around in an empty world.
Posted By: Wodin

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/11/12 12:32 PM

Are there any Infantry?
Posted By: Nate

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/11/12 12:56 PM

Yes but AI only.

Nate
Posted By: AggressorBLUE

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/11/12 01:30 PM

Originally Posted By: Ssnake
Outerra is magnificent in some ways, and utterly useless in other areas (unfortunately, game requirements usually are somewhere in the middle, leaning towards the "useless" end of the spectrum).

What good is a planetary sized game world devoid of civilization?

It only makes sense if you want to simulate the starting and landing of spacecraft in the planetary range. If they figure out a way to procedurally generate cities, if they can actually populate this virtual Earth - well, there'd be just too much space to explore ... unless you make it a somewhat aimless sandbox type of a game (in which case it could just as well be a procedurally generated fantasy world). Outerra may have a future as a basis for Google Earth, but then you want geospecific terrain in Google Earth where Outerra is all about procedurally generated, geotypical terrain.

It looks stunningly beautiful. It's a marvelous tech demo. I just don't see a practical application of it unless you want to just fly around in an empty world.



It makes sense insofar that its now a modular platform that can be populated, eg FSX and ORBX scenery. Also, as I understand it, the world is only 'empty' because they're making a scenery engine. my guess is 'life' is a secondary priority. The key to building out the world lies in the after-market, where companies like ORBX can fill in the gaps.
Posted By: Ssnake

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/11/12 10:59 PM

May well be. At least I told them a year ago or so that without the ability to inject real-world elevation maps and textures and custom buildings and other man-made objects the utility value of it would be very limited. Back then they balked at the idea of superimposing fixed-resolution textures on their beautiful fractals, that it would be anathema to the very concept of a procedurally generated world. I would even go so far to say that you don't have to work with real-live textures etc. for a game, only for applications with real-world relevance. But there it's indispensable. Maybe they changed their minds.

Still, the fundamental problem is that if you have a planet-sized playground, you'll need to find a way populate that planet. I saw a video of a guy demonstrating the Anteworld beta in the area of San Francisco's Presidio park. Beautiful sunset, waves licking the shore - the usual Outerra goodness. The only problem was, there's no San Francisco around it. No Golden Gate bridge. No Alcatraz building on Alcatraz island. So, even if you can manually place any building of their (limited) object library with just a few clicks, there's tens of millions of buildings, streets, cable cars, people, billboards, powerlines, satellite dishes, bus stops, trash containers, park banks etc. to be placed. How much of that can you create procedurally, or derive from geo information systems' real-world data sets?
Because manual placement is NOT the answer.
Posted By: cameni

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/12/12 06:02 AM

Originally Posted By: Ssnake
Because manual placement is NOT the answer.

Of course, we would not expect from anyone sane to recreate cities building by building. Certain dominants that everybody knows must be created and placed manually because people are more sensitive to them, but the rest is indeed a work for procedural systems. Just because now there are just some primitive tools for manual object placement, doesn't mean it's supposed to stay so.

There are two different procedural systems in Outerra (in various degree of evolution) - one for the natural world, driven by available global datasets, and another for the "civilization" layer, driven by vector data. The former is going to create a believable natural world with consistent detail at all scales, the latter to impose the effect of human activity atop of the world in a way that still naturally blends with the underlying natural world, effectively renders level of detail, and should even allow for adjustable level of decay of the man-made changes back to the natural state. Obviously, the natural layer goes first and must be more complete, so that's why there's a certain disparity between them currently.

We "balked" at the idea of superimposing imagery because that's not the way it could work for the goal we have in mind. The imagery itself is not algorithmically refineable in a reasonable way, it has all kinds of lighting issues etc etc. It needs to be vectorized and classified it, in order to be able to use procedural generators to create the detail. But that's basically what OpenStreetMap is doing.

Vector data with attributes attached can be then used to generate most of the civilization phenomena - fields, pastures, roads, railroads, urban areas. In OSM you can often find outlines of individual buildings, sometimes with the height attribute present, but the generator can also produce whole city blocks or cities from outlines, respecting the street networks. The less original detail is provided, the less resemblance and more random noise is introduced (as can be expected).
Posted By: Ssnake

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/12/12 06:30 AM

Sounds like you have a plan. smile
Posted By: Trident

Re: New Combined Arms Screenshots (32 images) - 07/12/12 11:48 AM

Originally Posted By: cameni
We "balked" at the idea of superimposing imagery because that's not the way it could work for the goal we have in mind. The imagery itself is not algorithmically refineable in a reasonable way, it has all kinds of lighting issues etc etc. It needs to be vectorized and classified it, in order to be able to use procedural generators to create the detail. But that's basically what OpenStreetMap is doing.

Vector data with attributes attached can be then used to generate most of the civilization phenomena - fields, pastures, roads, railroads, urban areas. In OSM you can often find outlines of individual buildings, sometimes with the height attribute present, but the generator can also produce whole city blocks or cities from outlines, respecting the street networks. The less original detail is provided, the less resemblance and more random noise is introduced (as can be expected).


I believe this is, in basic terms, what X-Plane 10 is already doing, albeit with mixed success so far. On paper it certainly seems to be the gold standard approach to the issue.
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