#3033342 - 06/17/10 08:32 AM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Bwaze]
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,499
VF-2 John Banks
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Maybe you can shot Mr. Hofmann from SIMPED an email. He could give you tips how to do that. But i think he is going to do an adapter by himself when he has some time left.
Intel Core I7-4790K @ 4x4GHz (oc'ed to 4x4,5 GHz on air) be quiet! Dark Rock Pro 3 CPU Cooler (250W TDP) ASUS Z97-C motherboard ASUS STRIX-GTX970-DC2OC-4GD5 ASUS ROG Xonar Phoebus Solo Soundcard, PCIe 2 x 4GB GEIL DDR3 Value RAM ANTEC PSU (750W) Toshiba 37" LCD TV (1920x1080x32) Win 7 Home Pro (64bit) 240 GB Corsair SSD (Force Series 3) TrackIR4 Pro HOTAS Cougar + "Uber NxT advanced" gimbal mod SIMPED F-16 Pedals SAITEK Throttle Quadrant A2 leather jacket & leather gloves
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#3033534 - 06/17/10 03:29 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: VF-2 John Banks]
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,508
Teej
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Maybe you can shot Mr. Hofmann from SIMPED an email. He could give you tips how to do that. But i think he is going to do an adapter by himself when he has some time left. Again, I don't own simpeds at this point, so I could have the names and background wrong...but I thought Mr. Hoffman was Dieter...who left this world a year or three ago. If there's any truth to someone considering making such an adapter, I'm not going to start working on it...although I may spec out some parts. Even if I chose to sell it as an open source kit, I dunno if i could get the parts & boards for the prices of an established vendor. If nobody steps up, I'll see if I can get something designed so people aren't left out in the cold, unable to use the rudders. I've already done all the "little pieces" in the past (making a device plug in to USB and get recognized as a game controller, digitizing analog inputs, etc)...but the USB work was ~ 5 years ago. I've got time to look into it since the sticks aren't expected to be out until, as guod mentioned, September.
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#3033567 - 06/17/10 04:33 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Teej]
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 38
Bwaze
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Kamnik, Slovenia
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Although it is a nuisance Thrustmaster Warthog doesnt' have gameport rudder connection, it's not really surprising, since Thrustmaster doesn't offer rudders themselves. I also don't play games that don't support more than one controller, so this is another non-issue for me. It's even easier to find axes if they are only two or three under one controller, instead of 8. I have sent mail to DHS Electronic, asking if there is an adapter in the planning, or if they can provide pin-out diagram. Their site clearly states that the connection is not the same as gameport: 15pol Sub-D connector for HOTAS (no gameport!) So I have no idea if they are simple analogue devices or if they have more complex digital connection to Cougar. But I doubt it, since they are third party device, and I don't think Thrustmaster took any part in development. I believe they simply have a bit different pin-out than gameport. Mr. Dieter Hoffman sadly died in 2008, but I think his family continues the DHS Electronic company. They have all their rudders in stock except F-16/C and F-16/USB.
Pezzer Ritter Wenne Knecht!
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#3033619 - 06/17/10 05:22 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Bwaze]
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,508
Teej
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Bwaze:
I agree you're correct in that the simped won't work directly on a game port. I can see a few potential reasons for why - the cougar uses a couple of pins that are either slightly different from, or not used on, gameport connectors, so it's not as simple as plugging one into the other.
However, the key outputs we're interested in (rudder & toes) absolutely must be analog - because the Cougar is expecting analog inputs and you simply can't jam a digital signal onto an analog input and expect it to work.
The differences lie in things like the above diagram where Pin 5 is pulled down to allow detection of toe brakes. That pulldown is not part of the gameport spec and results would not be predictable.
However, you can see the Cougar expects the analog inputs on pins 11, 13 and 14, based on the resistance of 100K pots. Therefore, while the Simpeds may operate digitally, they've got to be using some sort of digital to analog conversion on the output side so that those analog equivalents are presented to the cougar.
Thus, it may be a very simple matter of making a custom DB15 to DB15 adapter from radio shack parts and wiring, and using a gameport adapter that is capable of reading 4 axes (dual joysticks...because the Cougar is basically looking for the inputs from 1Y, 2X and 2Y). 5 wires plus perhaps a jumper or two (the 3 axes, +5v and ground) ought to do the trick.
If such a gameport adapter (dual joystick to USB) doesn't exist...then someone will need to make one which isn't a big deal for anyone who's worked with USB and microcontrollers.
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#3033754 - 06/17/10 07:27 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Teej]
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,499
VF-2 John Banks
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DHS electronics is still up and running and they keep producing the pedals. I think even the Cougar pedals but waiting times are long. They produced a small batch at the end of the last year.
Intel Core I7-4790K @ 4x4GHz (oc'ed to 4x4,5 GHz on air) be quiet! Dark Rock Pro 3 CPU Cooler (250W TDP) ASUS Z97-C motherboard ASUS STRIX-GTX970-DC2OC-4GD5 ASUS ROG Xonar Phoebus Solo Soundcard, PCIe 2 x 4GB GEIL DDR3 Value RAM ANTEC PSU (750W) Toshiba 37" LCD TV (1920x1080x32) Win 7 Home Pro (64bit) 240 GB Corsair SSD (Force Series 3) TrackIR4 Pro HOTAS Cougar + "Uber NxT advanced" gimbal mod SIMPED F-16 Pedals SAITEK Throttle Quadrant A2 leather jacket & leather gloves
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#3034189 - 06/18/10 08:30 AM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Brandano]
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Joined: Jul 2005
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Panther
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if you want to make an adapter you can probably hack a cheap USB joystick and rewire its analog channels to the simped pedals. the problem you may have is in assigning the proper axes in the simulator, though It was mentioned before but maybe it hasn't sunk it. The HOTAS Cougar is detected & programmable by the T.A.R.G.E.T. software. So this allows you to leave the Simpeds connected to the Cougar stick base and program the rudder and toebrakes axes via T.A.R.G.E.T. My plan is to take the Cougar Stick board out of the base and place it inside of a smaller box, issue solved.
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#3034658 - 06/18/10 08:12 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Panther]
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Teej
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I think the implication was that some wanted to sell their Cougars for whatever they could to offset the upgrade. This does, however, somewhat raise the value of a ragged out Cougar. ( HOTAS Cougar, that is. )
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#3036329 - 06/21/10 02:12 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Teej]
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Joined: Aug 2002
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Dachs
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Teej, if you get an adaptor put together, I would be very interested in buying one! I have absolutely no intentions of relegating my trusty ÜIInxt Cougar to a simple (and very expensive!) relay box, thats for sure..
Fortes Fortuna Juvat
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#3037989 - 06/23/10 03:42 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Teej]
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Joined: Jun 2010
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Bwaze
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Kamnik, Slovenia
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I have received answer from DHS Electronic to my questions. These are his replies: We had a lot of questions about this topic. We do not plan to make an adapter on our own because there will be a lot of them and we will only test which one will be the best solution for our pedals. If we found one we will offer it in our web-shop soon. But as far as I can tell the precision will get a little bit lower by using such an adapter because digital ones re-calculate the values and to keep up the operation speed not every value is taken. So is my impression so far but I hope we will find an adapter that works well. Our Gameport pedals are mainly digital ones (all versions with minimum one LED in base plate). Therefore you need an active adapter and the majority on the market are analogue adapters. We have some here to test but my time is very limited to test it well (due to 3 jobs...;-) ). The one that worked the best so far is called "SuperJoyBox7". But I think there will be some modifications to let it work correctly. If it works well I will write a short manual how to use it and offer it in our e-shop. Hopefully I can write more to you in one month and I will find some more time to handle this topic because its getting close now. It looks that it's not simple analogue connection, so hooking to Leo Bodnar's board is not an option. But the good news is that DHS Electronic are testing available digital gameport to USB adaptors. I have googled mentioned "SuperJoyBox7", and it looks an inexpensive Chinese adapter (under 10 $ or EUR): Super Joybox 7 - Gameport to USB ConverterAnother option is the mentioned use of the Cougar stick base (or even just a board from it) and configuring it in TARGET. But that's a bit pricey for an adapter.
Pezzer Ritter Wenne Knecht!
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#3038019 - 06/23/10 04:13 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Bwaze]
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,499
VF-2 John Banks
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That's what he told me last year. The analogue stuff wont work. But this time he cleary stated that they wont make their own adapter but test the available ones. Doesn't matter anyway. With or without an adapter, i need an extra USB port, so i can keep my Cougar stick plugged in and hide it behind the tower.
Intel Core I7-4790K @ 4x4GHz (oc'ed to 4x4,5 GHz on air) be quiet! Dark Rock Pro 3 CPU Cooler (250W TDP) ASUS Z97-C motherboard ASUS STRIX-GTX970-DC2OC-4GD5 ASUS ROG Xonar Phoebus Solo Soundcard, PCIe 2 x 4GB GEIL DDR3 Value RAM ANTEC PSU (750W) Toshiba 37" LCD TV (1920x1080x32) Win 7 Home Pro (64bit) 240 GB Corsair SSD (Force Series 3) TrackIR4 Pro HOTAS Cougar + "Uber NxT advanced" gimbal mod SIMPED F-16 Pedals SAITEK Throttle Quadrant A2 leather jacket & leather gloves
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#3110270 - 10/08/10 02:47 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Dachs]
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 102
Vierzinger
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Teej, if you get an adaptor put together, I would be very interested in buying one! I have absolutely no intentions of relegating my trusty ÜIInxt Cougar to a simple (and very expensive!) relay box, thats for sure.. Same here! I plan on keeping my Evenstrain Cougar as a backup. Unfortunately, I have no idear what all this components on the inside do.
Will we EVER get a real Rainbow Six game again. One for the real Tactic fans? A WWII sim with a dynamic campagn. Games with deept?
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#3111665 - 10/09/10 11:55 PM
Re: Simped Cougar / Gameport
[Re: Teej]
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Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,955
Sokol1
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Since Thrustmaster T.16000M can be integrated by T.A.R.G.E.T with Warthog, I think that USB Circuit of this stick (~35$)is the natural option to rewire old RCS (CubPilot offer HALL kit for this) or D.I.Y Rudder Pedal. Sokol1
Last edited by Sokol1; 10/10/10 12:04 AM.
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Exodus
by RedOneAlpha. 04/18/24 05:46 PM
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