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#4435888 - 08/26/18 05:09 PM Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup COMPLETE - PHOTOS ADDED  
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Hi All,
After a short break I've found myself drawn back to WWI, and the sheer quality of WNW kits. This is the second of the kits RSColonel_131st gave to me, a very generous gift. I'm hoping to put what I learnt building the Pfalz to good use and build a better model the second time round. I'm at the stage of another build where I'm looking for things to do while paint or filler is drying, so this WIP might come in fits and starts initially. No idea which markings I'm going to paint yet, but there are some lovely schemes, but as total Japanophile I'm tempted to do the (beautifully simple) box decals machine flown by Lt. Kawaida in 1921.

The lovely WNW box art.
[Linked Image]


A little model in it's own right is the Le Rhone rotary engine. This is painted with Alclad colurs, and Humbrol copper for the fuel pipes. I only added wiring to the sparking plugs.
[Linked Image]


Although it's a complex piece of engineering it's stunningly primitive compared to today's internal combustion engines. There's no filter over the air intake, and no collection from the exhaust valves. As far as I can tell, the whole engine rotated around a fixed crank shaft, carrying the propellor with it. The gyroscopic forces must have been enormous, and I believe modified rudder / elevator control to be totally counter intuitive at high power settings. Scary stuff..
[Linked Image]

This is the cockpit floor and control column, with EZLine control cables installed.
[Linked Image]

And the port side of the cockpit area framework, with rigging internal using Bob's Buckles.
[Linked Image]

I think I'll pose the model in a simple scene, with the lower part of the engine cowling off, with this figure, and perhaps another, working out why it's 'not quite firing right'. (A good excuse to learn some figure painting skills.)
[Linked Image]

Last edited by goon; 01/01/19 03:32 PM.

cheers
Gareth

UNDERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the front wing.
OVERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the back wing.
HORSEPOWER - is how fast you hit the wall.
TORQUE - is how far you can take the wall with you.

Read my scale modelling blog at www.latibuliser.com or mfhmazda787.com
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#4435909 - 08/26/18 07:41 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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The offset crankshaft gave a totally smooth circular movement to the cylinder heads, with no abrupt acceleration/deceleration cycle, on a different centre to the centre of the crankcases.

This lead to a much higher power to weight ratio for rotary engines compared to inline or radial engines of a similar technology level.

The effect of the rotating crankcase eliminates the requirement for a flyweight to smooth the engine speed, and the overall impact of the rotating mass is no more than that of the bare propeller, so it is approximately double that of a radial of the same power. This is significant, but not nearly to the extent that is sometimes suggested.

Control issues come as much from the control and aerodynamic configurations as from the minor impact of gyroscopic pitch/yaw coupling. Torque is often very high and even when engineering solutions eliminate all gyro effects (as with the Siemens Halske rotary, where the propeller rotated opposite to the crankcase at half the nominal 1800 rpm each), the control in turns or the climb is affected by the large torque of the slow rotating large diameter propellers.

#4435912 - 08/26/18 08:00 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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That's really interesting Lieste, thanks. Does my memory play tricks on me, or did early engines of this configuration have only a full throttle / tick over 'buzz' switch? If so, were they properly throttleable by this time?


cheers
Gareth

UNDERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the front wing.
OVERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the back wing.
HORSEPOWER - is how fast you hit the wall.
TORQUE - is how far you can take the wall with you.

Read my scale modelling blog at www.latibuliser.com or mfhmazda787.com
#4435923 - 08/26/18 09:51 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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They were pretty much “on” or “off”. You could get some minor control on some of them with the fuel/air mixture, but it wasn’t like true throttle control. Also of note was the oil loss.


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#4435953 - 08/27/18 04:53 AM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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Dart Offline
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Total oil loss. A very nice fine spray of castor oil was unavoidable for the pilot. Mmmmm, tasty!

On air filters for aircraft, I've come to the notion that they're placed on carburetors for the main purpose of keeping bugs and critters out while parked in a hangar.


The opinions of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

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#4435962 - 08/27/18 09:57 AM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Originally Posted by oldgrognard
They were pretty much “on” or “off”. You could get some minor control on some of them with the fuel/air mixture, but it wasn’t like true throttle control. Also of note was the oil loss.


Some had intermediate position(s). Iirc this was achieved by disconnecting the mags from the cylinder spark plugs..


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4435968 - 08/27/18 11:25 AM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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Last edited by KraziKanuK; 08/27/18 11:33 AM.

There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4436063 - 08/27/18 09:37 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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That dude has the biggest camel toe i've ever seen, no wonder he is confused biggrin and damn rotaries, the bane of my existence back in the day at the drags. Nothing worse than getting beaten by a little blat!blat!blat! engined car when you're running 5.7 litres. Mongrels. Looking forward to another lovely WWI kit Goon.


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#4436122 - 08/28/18 09:37 AM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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There were many different ways of managing the engine as engineers attempted to get the best performance and convenience from their installations by experimentation and incremental change.

The simplest was the magneto switch, but related was the coupe/blip switch which would cut a proportion (or all) of the ignitions, with reduced power in proportion, but also increased fire risk in extended use as fuel and oil were still supplied, and would pool inside the cowling. (There was always a lot of oil here and under the fuselage as the total loss oil system continually released castor oil in operation, but the amount of fuel and oil lost outboard increases by at least 7-8 times when the engine is turning without ignition, if the fuel cutoff isn't also used).

For later installations there was also the possibility to vary fuel and air supply by two throttles. (e.g with the DR1). A typical idle would then be ~800 rpm, with 1200-1250 rpm the rated rpm, and an rpm at maximum speed of around 1300-1350 rpm, where power exceeds the rated one by some significant amount.

The Pup used a Monosoupape engine, which as far as I can tell only has a very limited ability to control power with throttles, and used the coupe switch as it's primary moderation of power. The two port Clerget and LeRhone engines (and their derivatives) were more flexible in operation.

#4436823 - 09/02/18 02:40 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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Interesting discussion everyone, thanks.

I've been cracking on with the Pup. Here is the instrument panel, which I dressed up with Yahu instruments. I lost a bezel and replaced it with some flattened lead wire. I little thicker than it should be, but it looks OK.

[Linked Image]

And Barracuda's replacement wicker seat. Amazing to think that not much more than 40 years later this would have evolved in to a seat that's almost an aircraft in its own right.

[Linked Image]

This is the internal structure of the cockpit before installation.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

And a couple of shots of it in the starboard fuselage half before closing up.

[Linked Image]

Here you can see the 'blind' end of the control cables for the rear flying surfaces. These are very delicate and giving me fits whenever I handle the model, but it's the only way I could think of to avoid the mess I made of them on the Pfalz.

[Linked Image]

I've started the wings also, here is the masking I've had to do so I can prime with white to make the rib tapes lighter under the RFC PC10 Green. I had to do this for the upper and lower surfaces of both wings and the horizontal tail. It took bloody ages and almost a whole roll of tape!

[Linked Image]

Thanks for looking in, more soon,
Gareth


cheers
Gareth

UNDERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the front wing.
OVERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the back wing.
HORSEPOWER - is how fast you hit the wall.
TORQUE - is how far you can take the wall with you.

Read my scale modelling blog at www.latibuliser.com or mfhmazda787.com
#4436847 - 09/02/18 05:39 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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Looking Good !

#4436888 - 09/02/18 10:37 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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Beautiful!


My il2 page
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#4436898 - 09/03/18 12:34 AM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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More true artistry from Goon.

Saves me money I can't afford to spend, just like listening to Carlos Santana keeps me from buying a guitar. Museum quality stuff IMO.


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#4436921 - 09/03/18 03:26 AM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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Dart Offline
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Yep, it's decided. I hate you and your insane attention to detail.


The opinions of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

More dumb stuff at http://www.darts-page.com

From Laser:
"The forum is the place where combat (real time) flight simulator fans come to play turn based strategy combat."
#4436942 - 09/03/18 10:11 AM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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Scary really. A wicker seat and a lapbelt as the only thing holding you into an airplane when you fly loopings...

#4437044 - 09/03/18 09:45 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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Lieste Online sigh
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In a loop, you should have positive 'g' on all the way over, so inertia holds you in... I would expect that a failure of the seat during the pull out was more of a risk than falling out at the apex.

#4437046 - 09/03/18 09:56 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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MilSpec wicker...whoud'a thunk!


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Look for me on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook or Tic Toc...or anywhere you may frequent, besides SimHq, on the Global Scam Net. Aka, the internet.
I am not there, never have been or ever will be, but the fruitless search may be more gratifying then the "content" you might otherwise be exposed to.

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#4437801 - 09/08/18 03:22 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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goon Offline
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A very small update. (Pupdate?) Most of the green is on, still the top and sides of the fuselage to do, but I've had to stop painting for the day as Ted is insisting on keeping me company in the shed. He's about the size of small wookiee so I can't get to the spray booth. He usually lies outside but it's very wet today. I'm not too bothered. I've got beer, Hankook 24hrs of Barcelona stream and umpteen projects to think about and plan. A lovely way to spend the afternoon.

[Linked Image]

Last edited by goon; 09/08/18 03:23 PM.

cheers
Gareth

UNDERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the front wing.
OVERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the back wing.
HORSEPOWER - is how fast you hit the wall.
TORQUE - is how far you can take the wall with you.

Read my scale modelling blog at www.latibuliser.com or mfhmazda787.com
#4439446 - 09/17/18 08:41 PM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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Hi All,
Here's an update showing the main colours going on.

After a primer coat I masked off the wing rib tapes, and sprayed them white. I also did this for the main spars. The thickness of the paint has raised it the markings slightly, but this will look fine when it's flatted back and the wing in the correct orientation. (Almost a whole roll of Tamiya tape was used!)

[Linked Image]


I also did this on the fuselage, where the ribbing is represented in the moulding. The tape lifted some of this off but it was easily touched in after this was taken.

[Linked Image]


After adding some low lights to the upper leading edges it was out with the Xtracolour RFC Natural Doped Fabric for the undersides. This is built up slowly to just leave the impression of the white stripes.

[Linked Image]


After that I masked off the entire underside again, excepting a narrow strip around the edge that the RFC PC10 Khaki wraps around to. This had to be done for both wings and the horizontal tail. I've put on the top cockades because I want to avoid handling too much once the wing anchor points are in.

[Linked Image]


You can just see that here.

[Linked Image]

Thanks for looking in, more soon,
Gareth


cheers
Gareth

UNDERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the front wing.
OVERSTEER - is when you hit the wall with the back wing.
HORSEPOWER - is how fast you hit the wall.
TORQUE - is how far you can take the wall with you.

Read my scale modelling blog at www.latibuliser.com or mfhmazda787.com
#4439505 - 09/18/18 10:52 AM Re: Wing Nut Wings 1/32 Sopwith Pup WIP [Re: goon]  
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I echo Dart, amazing attention to detail.

Now when you are done that I need a small spray job done on one of my cars... got a whole bodyshell that needs a complete respray, will you manage with your airbrush? wink


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