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#4439315 - 09/17/18 02:16 AM Gettysburg Address  
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Lifer

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Been reading some more on the US Civil War and was reading and thinking about Lincoln’s Gettysburg Address. A magnificent oration.

What interested me was the final portion of the ending sentence “- that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.“ in particular where the stress should be placed on the words. As I see it there are three ways to do it.

“that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.”



“that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.”


“that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.”


It may seem a insignificant thing, but I was wondering how Lincoln had stressed it when he made the speech. While it expresses the same meaning regardless, it intrigues me because if you really read it and apply the stress in each of the three ways, you can get a different feel each way. The second and third are close, but do have a difference. Try each very sincerely and forcefully and you can feel a different resonance.

From all that I know of Lincoln, I believe that the third way is most in keeping with him.

Does this interest anyone else ?


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#4439317 - 09/17/18 02:42 AM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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#4439318 - 09/17/18 03:28 AM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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I may be obtuse, (probably am) but what exactly is the difference between the three? All are plain in their intent. We'll never know exactly how Lincoln enunciated the lines.


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#4439319 - 09/17/18 04:21 AM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: Mad Max]  
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Originally Posted by Mad Max
I may be obtuse, (probably am) but what exactly is the difference between the three? All are plain in their intent. We'll never know exactly how Lincoln enunciated the lines.


Almost nobody that was there could have told us. The President was preceded at the podium by a General that droned on for four hours, and he made almost no impression on people other than he was the last to speak.

It was only weeks later, when papers printed the written copies they had been provided, that it was noted.


The opinions of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

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#4439484 - 09/18/18 04:41 AM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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It's a shame that the ability to record his speech didn't exist yet.


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#4439488 - 09/18/18 07:53 AM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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OG Over the course of my years I had the honor of visiting Gettysburk close to 20 times.To me it is truely hallowed ground ..I stand at several places in awe of what the men did there.and hoping for one more visti using the U.S. Army college guide to Gettysburg a walking tout of the battle with after action reports of each stage of the battle.I have a book by Garry Wills part of the Lincoln Library collection "Lincoln at Gettysburg The Words that remade America",,Yes I'm one who this matters..He took stewardship when our nation was torn apart and had the wisdom to pursue a path to bring it back whole and his adress not only adressed our ideals as a nation but paid tribute to the men who died doing just that.Words that should be rememberd as well as the men who fought there

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.
Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.

But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate—we can not consecrate—we can not hallow—this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us—that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion—that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain—that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.

I can recite it from memory something I learned as a young pup..OK back to the thought The last part "that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain—that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth." should be required reading for our legislators who seem to have lost sight of what our nation was meant to be..I still believe in what he said that day about our nation and and hope we can rediscover those ideals


Russ
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#4439507 - 09/18/18 11:14 AM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: wheelsup_cavu]  
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Originally Posted by wheelsup_cavu
It's a shame that the ability to record his speech didn't exist yet.


Wheels



The earliest known recording of a human voice,




This was 3 years before the Gettysburg Address too!



Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 09/18/18 11:14 AM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4439516 - 09/18/18 01:35 PM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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rwatson, very good. I’ve been to Gettysburg about 5 times. One of those was with the Army WR College guides and we did the whole staff ride of the battlefield. It was excellent. I was also there for that major re-enactment about 15 years ago. Big event. One of the things I took from that re-enactment was how much the black powder weapons obscured the visibility. After a couple volleys you saw nothing but smoke. It reinforced how difficult it was for command and control.

Which of the three emphasis do you prefer ?


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4439537 - 09/18/18 03:08 PM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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OG I was at a huge reanctment back in the late 90's not sure of the year and it was great..walked down to some reanactors camps and met the men so decidacted to the memory and as a Vet was moved deeply and I agree after seeing a few cannon vollys and the last charge how much the smoke would have had an effect,,Hell car alarms were even going off half a click away..The intrest in the Civil War had lead me to want to be a history teacher years ago but got lost coming home from my own war for around 15 years,,but now just read a lot
To me all three send the sa,e message but as to empathis the second one is best "THE PEOPLE" is the most important to me ,,If THE PEOPLE just kick back and let our country go we have given up the Liberty so many have fought to protect and I fear that's what hqas happened today too much complaining and not enough involvement to make our country and lives better,,,Guess this will be headed to PWEC...But have spent the morning readin some of Garry Wills book as a matter of fact have 6 books on the battle ..good I'm getting long in the tooth on WW II..
Have a daughter who lives about 5 miles from Sharpsburg Maryland might be time to take a visit and go to Antietam and a short trip over the mountains to Gettysburg she knows I'm a studient of the War and she is always glad to help..Like she says she is always amazed at the look on my face,,I can always appreciate the level of devotion to their cause no right or wrong there just honor


Russ
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#4439539 - 09/18/18 03:16 PM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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You will find the Antietam battlefield much different than Gettysburg. The terrain at Gettysburg is understandable. Antietam just seems incomprehensible. A jumble of undulating ground. Hard to see where the supporting Federal artillery could have been properly located. The horrible casualties are understandable because you just stumbled right into the enemy at point blank range. Attack and counterattack all at close range without knowing that they were there until close combat.


Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Someday your life will flash in front of your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.
#4439540 - 09/18/18 03:23 PM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Both Antietam (Sharpsburg) and Gettysburg are on my “places I must visit” list.

I’ve been to Fredericksburg and Chancellorsville though. Those were quite amazing experiences.

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 09/18/18 03:24 PM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4439541 - 09/18/18 03:26 PM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Yes OG what impressed me at Antietam was the sise of things like Millers cornfield where so many died it was tiny but have to remember back the all was horse plowed and by todays standards a field was tiny...And to set Burnsides bridge it had to be suicide to cross it as you say just charge ahead and hope for the best Just like at Fredisburg but that was 1800's type warefare Napelonic tacticts in a different era imagine if they had just one M60 would have been a massacre..but those were the days that made us as one


Russ
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#4439542 - 09/18/18 03:31 PM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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PM a trip you won't regret Go to Gettysburg and if you are driving it's a short hop over South Mountain to Antietam both places will move you as to our history don'y know if it's still there but used to be a great Colt arms store down town,,haven't touched a weapon since 1969 but loved some of the ones they had for sale there


Russ
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#4439552 - 09/18/18 04:09 PM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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PM if you ever get there I'd advise do the walking tour..the driving one stinks..you just park near Little Round top but get out head into the woods and find The Place of Souls where the 20TH Main stood and here's the book i followed
https://www.amazon.com/Army-College...ords=us+army+college+guide+to+gettysburg


Russ
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#4439553 - 09/18/18 04:10 PM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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PM if you ever get there I'd advise do the walking tour..the driving one stinks..you just park near Little Round top but get out head into the woods and find The Place of Souls where the 20TH Main stood and here's the book i followed a good read even if you don't get there
https://www.amazon.com/Army-College...ords=us+army+college+guide+to+gettysburg


Russ
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#4439556 - 09/18/18 04:24 PM Re: Gettysburg Address [Re: oldgrognard]  
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Thank you for the tips rwatson!! I'll be sure to do the walking tour when I finally do go to Gettysburg.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”

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