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#4434980 - 08/20/18 09:25 AM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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High over the Front
Ah. I did see the 2nd pic you added but yours is much better quality then the one I saw. Thought the upper wing was blurred out from bad photography. I see now it’s hanging canvas!

#4434981 - 08/20/18 09:41 AM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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I always enjoyed flying the N28... 94th Aero sqn career flown in the past.

#4434990 - 08/20/18 10:15 AM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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High over the Front
Huzzah!

#4435001 - 08/20/18 11:30 AM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Polovski]  
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Originally Posted by Polovski
Correct the upper wing was the canvas problem was just following on from the comments above and didn't stop to think. WOTR work has broken my mind - that's my excuse.

Good news! Doesn't seem to be your mind that's the problem:

Originally Posted by Nowi
...I started to turn with a Fokker, and the fabric on my lower wing started tearing off. I limped back to a forward airfield and landed, thankful to be alive...

If this is actually what the OP saw, then it would seem the failure modeling is actually inconsistent with available historical record. As the actual pictures all show, it's the top wing that disintegrates, not the bottom.

Maybe it would be worth trying out to see...so little time.

#4435012 - 08/20/18 01:08 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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Thanks wink

I added upper wing failure but there's obviously a possibility that other wings can break - or possibly a mistake. I'll reserve judgement for now. I have no time to fly WOFF at the moment.


Regards,

Polovski,
OBD Software, developers of immersive flight sims;
Wings Over Flanders Fields and Wings Over The Reich
http://www.overflandersfields.com
http://www.wingsoverthereich.com
#4435029 - 08/20/18 02:25 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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The airplane is awful in ROF, too. The reason is...well...the plane was awful. The French didn't like it at all. When it came time to loan some equipment to the Yanks, they said, "Hell yeah! Give em this crap!" I don't recall reading of a single French squadron flying Noop 28s.


"From our orbital vantage point, we observe an earth without borders, full of peace, beauty and magnificence, and we pray that humanity as a whole can imagine a borderless world as we see it, and strive to live as one in peace."
Astronaut William C. McCool RIP, January 29, 2003 - Space Shuttle Columbia

#4435033 - 08/20/18 02:53 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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Well, in real life, quite a few pilots wanted to keep their N28's and protested when the French wanted them to move onto the Spad 13...

#4435038 - 08/20/18 03:39 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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Trooper:
I read the same thing as you, in that they wanted to keep their N28's versus the SPAD 13's.


CPU = i9 9900K, GPU = RTX 2080 Ti, Monitor = 32" 4K G-sync
#4435040 - 08/20/18 04:01 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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I have a book detailing the French fighter force in WW1.
I don’t have any numbers (been a while) but the Spad XIII, while the bulk of the later war equipment (IIRC) did not equip everyone to my minor surprise. Especially in 1917 up to mid 1918. Don’t recall N28’s equipping French fighter escadrilles - and there were a lot - but I wouldn’t trust my memory with anymore then the above.

#4435046 - 08/20/18 04:25 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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"Well, in real life, quite a few pilots wanted to keep their N28's and protested when the French wanted them to move onto the Spad 13..."

I'm sure it was more a case of simply having gotten used to something. There were units during the Second World War that weren't happy to hear that they were giving up their trusted P-47's for the new P-51 Mustangs. It was an untested entity to them. But once in it, and once they realized what this airplane was capable of, they didn't want to go back.


"From our orbital vantage point, we observe an earth without borders, full of peace, beauty and magnificence, and we pray that humanity as a whole can imagine a borderless world as we see it, and strive to live as one in peace."
Astronaut William C. McCool RIP, January 29, 2003 - Space Shuttle Columbia

#4435068 - 08/20/18 06:17 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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This excellent book will give you a full understanding of the capabilities of the N28... It also gives the full reasons why the American pursuit Sqn's used them, political, economical and industrial reasoning at the time.
Pilot accounts, full reports on why wings failed with detailed photo's and drawings, specifications and performance details in comparison to other types it fought against, plus comparison with the Spad which replaced it.
I bought this book a few years ago, it is a worthwhile read for anyone interested in WWI aviation... in fact a must have...

[Linked Image]


Last edited by Trooper117; 08/20/18 06:18 PM.
#4435069 - 08/20/18 06:20 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Pooch]  
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Originally Posted by Pooch
"Well, in real life, quite a few pilots wanted to keep their N28's and protested when the French wanted them to move onto the Spad 13..."

I'm sure it was more a case of simply having gotten used to something. There were units during the Second World War that weren't happy to hear that they were giving up their trusted P-47's for the new P-51 Mustangs. It was an untested entity to them. But once in it, and once they realized what this airplane was capable of, they didn't want to go back.



My perspective its that it's probably more about being 'used to' a particular method of combat. You have to remember we're not talking about what kind of shirts you prefer to wear...this is life-or-death. As I mentioned above, the N28 is more a turn fighter, where the SPAD is obviously more known for 'boom n zoom' tactics. The pilots/outfits that didn't really want SPAD replacements probably felt (as I do) that although they might be fast and sturdy, they fly like bricks (and let's not forget the horrible visibility).

When your life is hanging in the balance, I suspect you're far less likely to just drop a long period of fine-tuned experience fighting a certain way based on the performance of a machine. TBH, a change like that could mean a death sentence.

So, just as one has to learn to 'fight' a given machine, I suspect this would've been more about skills that were already developed, more so than plain old comfort or habit. I don't think it's a matter of simple preference between two machines that were otherwise the same.

#4435082 - 08/20/18 08:16 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Trooper117]  
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Originally Posted by Trooper117
This excellent book will give you a full understanding of the capabilities of the N28... It also gives the full reasons why the American pursuit Sqn's used them, political, economical and industrial reasoning at the time.
Pilot accounts, full reports on why wings failed with detailed photo's and drawings, specifications and performance details in comparison to other types it fought against, plus comparison with the Spad which replaced it.
I bought this book a few years ago, it is a worthwhile read for anyone interested in WWI aviation... in fact a must have...

[Linked Image]



Thanks. Due for a new book order.

#4435256 - 08/22/18 02:23 AM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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That is a great book! Look what he is chasing!!! His buddy on the left is oblivious which is a predicament in which I often find myself! Blasted 'wingies'!

#4449378 - 11/18/18 11:28 PM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Pooch]  
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Originally Posted by Pooch
"Well, in real life, quite a few pilots wanted to keep their N28's and protested when the French wanted them to move onto the Spad 13..."

I'm sure it was more a case of simply having gotten used to something. There were units during the Second World War that weren't happy to hear that they were giving up their trusted P-47's for the new P-51 Mustangs. It was an untested entity to them. But once in it, and once they realized what this airplane was capable of, they didn't want to go back.


if this was a squadron that did a lot of close air support and ground attack missions I wouldn't blame them! the Mustang had that huge liquid cooled engine and a radiator... on the BELLY of the fuselage. American ace John Meyer once said that you shouldn't be flying a P51 on the deck anyways - since it was meant to be a high-altitude escort fighter. now, if they were doing high-altitude long-ranged escort work then the P-51 was literally king of the world.

I think he said that 30% of all their squadron losses was due to small arms fire while flying at ultra low level.

if they'd been flying P47s earlier... it would explain a lot. since that bird had a tough air-cooled engine could take a licking and keep on ticking. using the same tactics with the more vulnerable Mustang with it's belly radiator could be a recipe for being a POW.

Last edited by Waldemar_Kurtz; 11/18/18 11:32 PM.
#4449386 - 11/19/18 12:37 AM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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Actually, I have come to love my Nieuport. My reaction, posted above, was written when I was trying to fly the thing like it was a Albatros, or a Focke Wulf. I've since learned to better appreciate the qualities of the Nieuports, and look forward to giving the 28 another try in the future.

Mea Culpa!


Nowi
#4449389 - 11/19/18 01:08 AM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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Now that you are getting 'warm and fuzzy' with the 28 go jump in a DH-5 or a Pfalz D-III. The DH-5 has decent roll rates which is better than nothing like in the nag... I mean... Pfalz! Seriously though, the Pfalz is a lot of fun to fly and if you can survive in it that is a plus! When I fly Pfalz I am the biggest 'fraidy cat' on the planet. Any aircraft seen in the sky at my height or above and I fly away sometimes even diving while doing that! My guy lives a long time and manages to get the better of the enemy, though.

#4449558 - 11/20/18 03:22 AM Re: Discovered the worst POS aircraft [Re: Nowi]  
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I'm playing very early in the war, and if there's one plane I've come to hate with a passion it's the Aviatik B.I. It wants to take off and climb like a rocket, which would be great if it had the power to do so. Unfortunately it doesn't. The rusult is that the nose comes up and rather than climbing the plane is constantly on the verge of a stall. I find myself fighting that tendency from take-off to landing. It's a beast to handle, and I thoroughly hate it.


Some people are born stupid. I've had to work hard my whole life to get this way. I'm proud of the job I've done
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