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#4403218 - 02/03/18 04:21 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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You folks were making my head hurt with the technical talk but knowing AnKor is involved with a super secret, need to know only addition is better than 2 BC powders!


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#4403246 - 02/03/18 09:26 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: Raine]  
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Originally Posted by Raine
Ace, I'm not newer but definitely dumber. Any tweaking advice would be gratefully accepted.


I'm just using the recommended settings posted here (In a thread somewhere, I just googled "WoFF performance tweaks") for WoFF and nVidia control panel.


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#4403525 - 02/05/18 11:35 AM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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I've just got an idea, but I'm really busy and don't have time to test it.

As I mentioned the performance hit most likely comes from DXT3/5 textures which support semi-transparency.
However my shaders use dithering instead of transparency to render trees. This dithering is still based on alpha values from textures, so without alpha trees will look ugly, but I can probably do something about it.
Now, what I'd like to test.
What if DXT3/5 textures for trees are changed to DXT1 with on/off alpha or even solid ones?
Would it improve the performance?

I don't have time to test it, but it is not too difficult if you know what you are doing smile

You need to find **your WOFF folder**\WOFFScenery\Textures\Sum Spring Tex\ sub-folder. There are 10 textures like Deciduous*.dds and 4 textures like Coniferous*.dds. These are DXT3.
Make a backup copy of them and store it somewhere outside WOFF folder.

Then use your favorite image editor which supports DDS and resave them as DXT1 (preferably with mipmaps). Or, you can just take any solid DXT1 texture 256x256 (or any size) and use it instead of these existing textures. It can be just solid black, we are not testing image quality smile

Then test it on a tree-heavy airfield. Obviously you must select spring or summer season for these updated textures to show up.

If it indeed improves the performance I can probably update my shaders to keep using the alpha for these textures, while CFS3 engine will be tricked to believe that they are solid and thus will use faster rendering.

#4403529 - 02/05/18 12:21 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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Thanks for that Ankor. I may just have a look into that and report back.


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#4403564 - 02/05/18 03:59 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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Ankor;

I did as you suggested but used an existing mod.

I copied the WOFFScenery\Textures\Sum Spring Tex\ sub-folder into my mod and then used DXTBmp to save it as a DXT1 with alpha.
I then tested it on two of my modded airfields. Roucourt and Izel/Filescamp. Both have heavy tree coverage. The Filescamp Farm is by far the most populated with trees.

The test was with QC in Summer.

My findings were that there was no improvement.

Should I try anything else?


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
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Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
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#4403571 - 02/05/18 04:40 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: Robert_Wiggins]  
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Thanks. Maybe there is indeed no effect. It was just a guess.

However I'm not sure I understood this part:
Originally Posted by Robert_Wiggins
I copied the WOFFScenery\Textures\Sum Spring Tex\ sub-folder into my mod and then used DXTBmp to save it as a DXT1 with alpha.

Are you sure your modified textures were actually picked up by WOFF?
Maybe you can paint some markings on them to be sure.

CFS3 will load textures from any sub-folder, but if there are two textures with the same name I don't know which one will be loaded.
When WOFF starts simulation it copies tree textures specific for current season from WOFFScenery\Textures into OBDWW1 Over Flanders Fields\assets\WW1Texture. The latter is what actually used by cfs3.

But maybe performance drop is not related to textures, maybe it is just the number of facility objects which is too big for cfs3, or maybe it is something else.

#4403586 - 02/05/18 05:35 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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Ankor;

I can confirm that the .dds textures in "OBDWW1 Over Flanders Fields\assets\WW1Texture" are the correctly modified ones (DXT1 with alpha).

Let me explain the part you are not sure you understand.:
I created a mod that contains the "WOFFScenery\Textures\Sum Spring Tex\" and when implemented, it overrides/replaces the stock trees .dds files with my modified ones. When I swap the JSGME mod out, I am back to stock .dds textures.


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#4403592 - 02/05/18 06:05 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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I see. Somehow I didn't figure out you can simply use JSGME to mod WOFFScenery files. I thought you were speaking about something more elaborate smile

Well, it is something else then.

Thanks for testing!

#4403638 - 02/05/18 09:34 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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Ankor, I spent a little more time on the mod and reduced the texture size from 256 x 256 to 128 x 128 and there was no performance difference in FPS. It was identical. It was a surprise to me, as I thought I might see some improvement.

Just thought you might like to know, and thanks for your contribution here.

Best Regards;


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
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OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Primary ASUS PG27AQ 4k; Secondary Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4403758 - 02/06/18 01:20 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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I believe that the big difference between the normal trees and the ones used as objects around the airfields is the number of polys that are used to make them. It's like having a small forest of trees standing all in one place with a lot of intersecting surfaces needing z sorting and transparency anti-aliasing.


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#4403852 - 02/06/18 06:20 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: Robert_Wiggins]  
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Originally Posted by Robert_Wiggins
Ankor, I spent a little more time on the mod and reduced the texture size from 256 x 256 to 128 x 128 and there was no performance difference in FPS. It was identical. It was a surprise to me, as I thought I might see some improvement.

Just thought you might like to know, and thanks for your contribution here.

Best Regards;


The problem lies with the game engine being incredibly old, inefficient and bursting at the seams. You could make the textures 2048x2048 and I doubt you would see any difference in fps on any graphics card made in the last 10 years as long as the card has more than 2GB of Vram.

The textures in this game compared to anything modern are absolutely miniscule in comparison. The problem you are facing with your trees etc around airfields are the way the the game engine calls the objects, this is where the bottleneck arises.

Modern game engines use things like Speedtree for vegetation or use Tesselation for better efficiency at rendering of the environment, but the CFS3 engine is just too old and long in the tooth I'm afraid.


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#4403854 - 02/06/18 06:24 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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You may very well be spot on with your assessment 4L, unfortunately I don't have enough knowledge to comment.


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Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
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#4408851 - 03/04/18 07:13 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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JFYI, it seems I've found a solution for facility trees performance.
I'm still testing it, but hundreds of trees for a single facility should no longer be a problem.

#4408854 - 03/04/18 07:25 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: AnKor]  
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Originally Posted by AnKor
JFYI, it seems I've found a solution for facility trees performance.
I'm still testing it, but hundreds of trees for a single facility should no longer be a problem.


Whoopee!! You are the man Ankor. You always seem to work the magic for us! partything bananadance


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Primary ASUS PG27AQ 4k; Secondary Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4408856 - 03/04/18 07:41 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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Ankor, don't know how you do it and wouldn't understand if you told me, but thank you!!!!

#4408857 - 03/04/18 07:48 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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AnKor, out of curiosity, do you know if the terrain textures are able to read the specular maps? I’m thinking of the river tiles being able to reflect sun, like the ocean does. I know it’s not the same, but if one could apply a specular map ... who knows? I’ve tried to do that with making the river portion white and the ground black and adding the “_s” suffix at the end of the .dds, but I couldn’t see any effect taking place. Is there a specific directory where these textures would have to be placed to work?


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#4408868 - 03/04/18 08:46 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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Fullofit, no, currently it is impossible to add specular map for the terrain.
However some time ago I did a bit of research in this direction and may get back to it, but no promises.

#4408876 - 03/04/18 09:42 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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Thanks AnKor, no worries. Just needed to know if it was me or CFS3.


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The connecting rod out of my brain, my brain,
From out of my arse take the camshaft,
And assemble the engine again."
#4408889 - 03/04/18 10:24 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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Ankor that sounds terrific!

#4408956 - 03/05/18 01:27 PM Re: A question for the devs and other computer gurus here [Re: RAF_Louvert]  
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AnKor, this will be outstanding if you can make the magic happen! Can't wait to see your results and try them out in my latest mod project. salute

.

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