I didn't say that either, you just made it up.

Did I say that you said it? Read the quote again.

You say ED has not told the whole story, so that implies you know more of the story than we do, if not the whole story. So.... source? Put up or shut up, GrayGhost.

Reading over the whole thing again and not just how it effects me and my working habits, but how it effects others too, best compromise would seem to be 30 days and the most realistic balance if this is how DCS ED wish to go forward ... I really dont think they have much of a piracy issue, one of my *ahem* work friends is the biggest pirate since Blackbeard and he says he is aware of DCS and nobody in his scene as he calls it bothers with it ... I honestly do not condone that crap, I pay for my software and expect others to do so too.

So my vote for what its worth would be 30 days., that's basically a month and is that not roughly how long any used up activations would renew on old system?, it does beg the question why does this need to be changed in the first place though? 3 days seems ridiculously short ... was not a fan of the original activation thing to start with, but so long as I remembered to de-activate before upgrading PC it always worked and even on rare occasion I had computer crash and re-install, was it not a month before a lost activation came back? something like that, its always been complicated with ED DCS and they are one of the few Sim Companys I need to seriously consider before upgrading my FS rig that I like to do often enthusiast wise.

Hopefully they will do the right thing, but sometimes, when something just works (and even if not popular) perhaps its best to leave it alone and concentrate on what does need fixing ... if its not broke, please dont try fix it springs to mind.

To be honest and for reasons I can not fathom, ED have built up an Us and Them culture and it might have been easier for them to recognise customers for what they are worth (their income or at least part of it given the military contracts) I'm not saying who I am over on their boards, but I'm clinging on, its not a good atmosphere there at all.

Do enjoy DCS with its limitations and ongoing promises, its not all bad, but its not an ideal situation here or over there.

Would be great if we had some sort of mediating body between ED and the Community, because there is a lot of bad blood flowing ... had hoped Mudspike might be, but they seem to want to stay out of any such issues, indeed one of the ED DCS mods presides there, so thats not gonna happen I guess?

I'm ok with copy protection, it's just about mandatory nowadays. However, it feels like ED assumes that all of us are thieving bastards from the get go. Doesn't make me feel all warm and fuzzy with this latest shot at copy protection.

I would be okay with that. But if they insist on connecting to the internet once every 30 days, then can the hardware checks outside of the motherboard be removed? I recall changing my RAM/SSD and loosing an activation or two. The whole deactivate/reactivate thing is a pain each time you make a minor hardware change. If they're adding an online check they should remove the hardware check, IMO.



Maybe I not reading that in the correct context (I have only skimmed the thread) but do you seriously think that is a fair policy? Ban a suspected key, and if a legitimate owner accidentally gets screwed over they can open a support ticket to appeal after the fact? I disagree and cannot get behind such a scheme at all. Unless they are very, very lenient with what they define as a "suspect key" I can't see that being anything short of a disaster.

Regarding the keys they did ban, those grey market sites bought the keys via stolen credit cards. That isn't exactly piracy, but rather is outright theft. Unlike piracy this directly hurts the developers financially. There was a good article some months (or a year or so) back about another developer who explained the situation in more detail. Never went to those third party grey market sites (G2A ect.) but after reading how a lot of the sellers operated on them, I will certainly never take my business there. Ubisoft started doing similar but the backlash was so big that they re-instated the keys if I recall due to the backlash. Being a bigger publisher they were likely able to adsorb the costs.

Eurogamer on Ubisoft.

I went a bit off topic and if I misinterpreted you then I apologize.

I was responding to the discussion about keys and IP addresses. Explain to me why you think it's unfair? Where are the holes?

As for grey market and keys from those sites, this does not seem to be included in the current DRM discussion so no sense in going there.

In general pirates will entirely remove the DRM, so ED will not even be able to flag IPs. In other words, if an IP keeps popping up in different locations, it will be a legitimate key. I don't see how it will be helpful aside from flagging customers who change their IP (travel, ect.) frequently.

I apologize if I misunderstood what you were referring to.

If I am understanding you correctly, personally (this is just an opinion) I find it too harsh. But I feel the same for ED's current plan.

Agreed. I was more referring to GrayGhost's post:


So in your example, your key might show up in the USA, then a day later in Germany, then maybe 2 days later in the UK. So long as it's one location at a time, that's fine.... maybe even two locations in one day.... you could've started the day in Germany then hopped on a flight to the UK. Showing up from many IPs from very improbable or many locations and this happening often can be an indication that that particular key has been "shared" and so I was suggesting the policy that you've highlighted in bold above. Still think it's unfair? Where are the holes?

Has ED decided yet what the time limit will be? Read they might announce it this week after some review.

I am not sure I understand this. This new protection means you have to log on within every 3 days or what happens? I also don't understand why ED is having such bad Piracy problems but no other Flight sims have this kind of protection(3 days). I have been drifting away from ED and not buying any modules lately after the disappointing optimization of the Normandy map, but this may be the last nail in the coffin for me, as I only log in when an update is happening. Between BOX, CLOD, ROF and WOFF UE I think I can find my Flight Sim fix without ED anymore.

S!Blade<><

I do not think they have such bad problems but when sales are going down the easy way out as a producer is to tell everyone this product is still very very popular but there are so many pirates out there stealing it so THAT's why sales are down through the floor.

We've all learnt by now that we, DCS consumers, are not what ED makes their business from but we are rather a side income from contracted work (hence the insane delays on already announced stuff that would have had any producer in the world sacked in a frigging second) so there is nothing to gain from putting retarded DRM's on us but we are most probably guniea pigs for some tools they plan to use for their real customers.

Sorry Oden, but that's backwards thinking IMHO and should not be accepted in any shape or form, but for a moment, lets assume ED as you say treat us as (guinea pigs) for real customers ... then who are the real customers? we all know ED have military contracts, so basically what you are saying is ... we are public people are testing for the military, please get a grip ..... ??? ...... Since when has a general gaming audience ever become the beta testing for a real military contract, please think about what you say before you type in future.

But going back to my MO, have ED in their infinite wisdom and despite the overwhelming sway in the poll they put up, have they decided yet or not how to make it more painful for their customers, to punish them more?

Just how difficult is it to decide (or back down?) when needed? ED really are the worst, they treat customers like garbage and wonder why they get back lash.

It's not just military...it's private contracts as well. The YAK-52 is a good example. It's an "outgrowth" from a professional model sim that is being brought to us. What on Earth would the military want with a high fidelity, professional YAK52 simulator?

Nobody ever said it was a military contract. IIRC, the statement indicated that it was a private contract. Aside from that, I still agree. Who, that could afford it, would want to contract for that aircraft?

From what I understand, if it's been more than 3 days since authentication and you use the module and it cannot connect to the internet to phone home, the module will not work and you will be unable to play that module.



Because only ED has recognized this to be a world class copy protection system and all the other flight sims have no idea what they're doing.



No need to assume. ED has shown its backwards thinking many times now.... constant delays, 3 dev streams, aircraft selection....



You misunderstand.... and it's funny how you use phrases like "please get a grip".... maybe you should understand the message first. We are a side-income group for ED. There was nothing about us testing for the military.



Please read the message clearly and don't put words in people's mouths then responding to your misinterpretation when you make a reply in the future.



What were you saying about backwards thinking now?



Let's just stop for a moment and realize that ED has decided on this DRM scheme and has decided on a 3-day phone home time limit and decided to announce it right after Harrier release. They are now looking like idiots talking about compromise and unobtrusive protection.... which means to say they never considered those points BEFORE now.

The biggest issue with how ED handled this new DRM ...... they never told the customer until AFTER they had suckered them in

Very nice of them too!! They can tell us and tease us for YEARS regarding a new module or a new version of DCS, but DRM? No, that's hush-hush and then SURPRISE!!!