Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
#4383341 - 10/05/17 05:58 PM Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling.  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
TerribleTwo Online content
Hotshot
TerribleTwo  Online Content
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
I don't really care how accurate the fm is, rather, how it feels to just fly around, the sense of flight. So, DCS ww2 fighters, RoF, and Il-2 BoS have great feeling of flight. I can also live with a fm that is akin to FSX. So how does WoFF feel in this category?

And if anyone is kind enough, or have knowledge of, Aces High 3 is free to try and fly a couple WW1 fighters. In particular, how does the DR1 in WoFF compare to the AH3 Dr1? That would give me an idea.

Last edited by TerribleTwo; 10/05/17 05:59 PM.

"College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life" - Paul Ryan
#4383346 - 10/05/17 06:37 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 43
FalkeEins Offline
Junior Member
FalkeEins  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 43
After 250+ hours of ROF using Pat Wilson's Campaign Generator, WOFF's FMs feel... well... bad... There isn't much of a feeling of flight, side slipping is unexpectedly confusing and seems to result in a flat horizontal turn (no roll tendency like one would expect and slipping doesn't seem to carry forward momentum) and doesn't seem to help much with decelerating and that's aside from the fact that there is very little sensation of speed in the first place.

No experience with AH3 so I can't compare. I would say that FM are akin to vanilla FSX's feel/quality. I mean... It was born from MS CFS3... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

That being said, although not relevant to the question, between ROF and WOFF as WWI "immersion/experience simulation" goes WOFF beats the pants off of ROF every day of the week and then some.

Last edited by FalkeEins; 10/05/17 06:38 PM.
#4383352 - 10/05/17 07:02 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 347
Ace_Pilto Offline
Livestreamer/YouTuber
Ace_Pilto  Offline
Livestreamer/YouTuber
Member

Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 347
Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
Why are you wasting people's time asking them to spell out the obvious for you. WoFF is based upon CFS3. The FM's are improvements/modifications on that base.


Let's pretend I got the BWOC badge to embed here.
#4383360 - 10/05/17 07:19 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
TerribleTwo Online content
Hotshot
TerribleTwo  Online Content
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
Wasting time Ace? And I was assuming WoFF's community was the best around..

I have no experience with CFS3 or have any clue how it flew. I also have no idea how much improvement was put into the fm by the WoFF team. So, therein lies the origin of my question. I'm absolutely clueless on how it flies.

Thanks FalkeEins for your detailed analysis.


"College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life" - Paul Ryan
#4383370 - 10/05/17 08:00 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Robert_Wiggins Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Robert_Wiggins  Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Lindsay, Ontario, Canada
I will chime in here with my experiences.
I don't subscribe to FalkenEins analysis of the FM.

I frequently side slip on landings and force quick deceleration. It definitely works and I can sustain it.
I don't see why he can't too.
Flat turn in the DR1 is possibly and I can do it but it does bleed of speed if done to the max.

I don't fly other sims but the FM in WOFF is miles above native CFS3


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4383371 - 10/05/17 08:17 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 172
matmilne Offline
Member
matmilne  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 172
UK
I get the distinct impression this thread follows the 'why is it suspiciously good' line. Put bluntly, it has the better team, people who actually care about ww1 and flying. If you want the bland arcade experience, go play RoF and il2. If you want something better that's made with passion...well, that's why you're here isn't it.


Demo Reel https://soundcloud.com/matt-milne-8/sets/demo-reel-full

Composer - games, films, and tv. Rise of Flight, Wings Over flanders Fileds, Over Flanders Fields 2&3.
#4383376 - 10/05/17 08:39 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 481
Stache Offline
Member
Stache  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 481
Michigan, USA
I would differ with FalkeEins assesment of the sensations of speed.
I get plenty of sensation of speed while tree hopping in a DVIIF trying to run away from an angry pack of Spad XIII's.
Flying in a 757 at 30000 feet, there is little sensation of speed even though i know I am doing 550mph.

I have read countless times of this "sense of flight" and so far, while sitting in a chair staring at a monitor, have not found anything that compares to the real thing.

Even should the FM, be not 100% and might have some quirks, any of those are easily forgotten when I become immersed due to all the other aspects of WOFF.

Last edited by Stache; 10/05/17 08:48 PM.

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. A. Einstein

(System Specs:)

I7-6700k OC 4.4GHZ, 16GB DDR4 3200Mhz; Gigabyte Gaming 7 MB, G1 OC'ed GTX980ti; Three-Acer XB271HU WQHD Gsync 144Mhz; Samsung 950-512GB NVMe SSD; WD 2TB-7200rpm; Cooler Master HAF XB EVO, Nepton 240M cooler, V1000 PS; Windows 10 PRO; VKB GunfighterPro Stick; Saitek Pro Flight Pedals & Throttle; Dual TM MFD panels; TrackIR 5; home grown cockpit, � la RogerDodger.net
#4383382 - 10/05/17 09:14 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
TerribleTwo Online content
Hotshot
TerribleTwo  Online Content
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
Yes I completely understand the other aspects of the game, that's why it's considered one of the best single player aerial combat experiences of all time.. That's the selling point so I don't need that persuasive factor. I really do need a comparison somehow on the fm, and it's "feel". I'm one of those weird cats that dismiss all other aspects of aerial flight if the fm doesn't feel "good".... Doesn't have to be accurate, just good.

I can't play IL-2 FB because it's got a bit too much artificial feel to the fm.

I appreciate the detailed responses. I'd scoop it up right away, but $45 is enough for DCS Normandy, or the BF109k, or even upgrading Steel Beasts to version 4...


Last edited by TerribleTwo; 10/05/17 09:17 PM.

"College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life" - Paul Ryan
#4383384 - 10/05/17 09:18 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Robert_Wiggins Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Robert_Wiggins  Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Lindsay, Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
Yes I completely understand the other aspects of the game, that's why it's considered one of the best single player aerial combat experiences of all time.. That's the selling point so I don't need that persuasive factor. I really do need a comparison somehow on the fm, and it's "feel". I'm one of those weird cats that dismiss all other aspects of aerial flight if the fm doesn't feel "good".... Doesn't have to be accurate, just good.

I can't play IL-2 FB because it's got a bit too much artificial feel to the fm.

I appreciate them detailed responses. I'd scoop it up right away, but $45 is enough for DCS Normandy, or the BF109k.




I don't know how to alleviate your concerns. I have no idea what your expectation levels are and whether or not you would like the FM's. I can generate a video to demo the side slip and speed drop with extreme rudder on but that would only give you the visual and not the full experience.
If there is something you would like to see demo'd any one of us can provide it for you. I certainly am willing.


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4383395 - 10/05/17 09:53 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: Robert_Wiggins]  
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 43
FalkeEins Offline
Junior Member
FalkeEins  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 43
Originally Posted by Robert_Wiggins

-snip-

I frequently side slip on landings and force quick deceleration. It definitely works and I can sustain it.
I don't see why he can't too.

-snip-


My experience has been that when my flight lead slows down and I *attempt* to put the plane in a slip it ends with me flat turning towards the lead and blowing past him anyway. Instead of slowing down in a slip I've had to cut engine power to a sputter in these situations.

I also don't have to counter the attempted slip with much aileron because there seems to be no roll tendency and since slipping results in a flat turn I don't maintain much forward momentum... Too busy flat turning.

With all of that aside, while the FM isn't what I'm used to I'm really enamored with everything else OBD has managed to do with WOFF. I've never had such a positive SP experience. The AI is engaging, the world is full of life, lots of replayability with the massive amount of content, lots of great community made mods.

When I caught wind of WOFF I asked the same question as OP and the answers I received have been accurate to my experience. I didn't come with the expectation of FM fidelity like ROF or IL-2 BOX and I'm therefore completely happy with my purchase and my experience.

Originally Posted by matmilne
I get the distinct impression this thread follows the 'why is it suspiciously good' line. Put bluntly, it has the better team, people who actually care about ww1 and flying. If you want the bland arcade experience, go play RoF and il2. If you want something better that's made with passion...well, that's why you're here isn't it.


While bland is entirely accurate as far as ground/air life I can't say I agree with the "arcade" part. The guys at 777 certainly do have a passion for what they do. Anybody in the business of creating consumer flight simulators does.

Last edited by FalkeEins; 10/05/17 09:58 PM.
#4383396 - 10/05/17 09:54 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: Stache]  
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 43
FalkeEins Offline
Junior Member
FalkeEins  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 43
Originally Posted by Stache
-snip-

Even should the FM, be not 100% and might have some quirks, any of those are easily forgotten when I become immersed due to all the other aspects of WOFF.


This.

#4383398 - 10/05/17 10:06 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 43
FalkeEins Offline
Junior Member
FalkeEins  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 43
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
-snip-

I can't play IL-2 FB because it's got a bit too much artificial feel to the fm.

I appreciate the detailed responses. I'd scoop it up right away, but $45 is enough for DCS Normandy, or the BF109k, or even upgrading Steel Beasts to version 4...



To be completely honest I would compare the WOFF FM to modded IL-2 1946.

I never played CFS3 but I'm sure WOFF's FM improved things. Modded 1946 is an upgrade from vanilla FB but it still "is what it is."

I own all of the DCS stuff but it's always been a little too sandboxy for me and the poor DM (as it applies to the WWII planes) was kind of a turnoff. Systems modeling is obviously the best of the best but past that I always felt like there wasn't much to do.

Last edited by FalkeEins; 10/05/17 10:07 PM.
#4383404 - 10/05/17 10:39 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: Robert_Wiggins]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
TerribleTwo Online content
Hotshot
TerribleTwo  Online Content
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
Originally Posted by Robert_Wiggins
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
Yes I completely understand the other aspects of the game, that's why it's considered one of the best single player aerial combat experiences of all time.. That's the selling point so I don't need that persuasive factor. I really do need a comparison somehow on the fm, and it's "feel". I'm one of those weird cats that dismiss all other aspects of aerial flight if the fm doesn't feel "good".... Doesn't have to be accurate, just good.

I can't play IL-2 FB because it's got a bit too much artificial feel to the fm.

I appreciate them detailed responses. I'd scoop it up right away, but $45 is enough for DCS Normandy, or the BF109k.




I don't know how to alleviate your concerns. I have no idea what your expectation levels are and whether or not you would like the FM's. I can generate a video to demo the side slip and speed drop with extreme rudder on but that would only give you the visual and not the full experience.
If there is something you would like to see demo'd any one of us can provide it for you. I certainly am willing.




If you're willing to download Aces High 3 (its free and requires no registration,and relatively small), go into offline arena and take the Dr1 for a spin. Before you do that be sure that "stall limiter" is off in options - flight menu. If you can do that, compare the two, I'd be much obliged. That way I could get a "feel" for how WoFF handles flight.

Last edited by TerribleTwo; 10/05/17 10:40 PM.

"College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life" - Paul Ryan
#4383409 - 10/05/17 10:53 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,229
Rick_Rawlings Offline
B.O.C. Challenger
Rick_Rawlings  Offline
B.O.C. Challenger
Member

Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,229
Not being an actual pilot, this is all very subjective. I find the feeling of closure to be similar between RoF and WOFF, as well as the difficulty in holding a steady firing position. I think that the inline engine craft do pretty well but the rotary craft lack some of their idiosyncratic character. The camel doesn't seem to cause it's historical handling problems, for example. The ground handling is also fairly simplistic. With the later wind modeling added and improved upon in the Ultimate Edition, I think it has gotten a lot better in the feel department. I haven't flown RoF much lately, there isn't enough to do once I get in there to justify the hard drive real estate, but another thing to keep in mind is how the feeling of combat builds from the feeling of flight, and there WOFF really does a good job. Most RoF flights seem to turn into descending races to the deck, whereas in WOFF, you tend to get more opportunity for the individual plane characteristics to matter. Hope that helps somewhat and hope to see you in the skies!

salute

#4383417 - 10/05/17 11:12 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: FalkeEins]  
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 172
matmilne Offline
Member
matmilne  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 172
UK
Originally Posted by FalkeEins

While bland is entirely accurate as far as ground/air life I can't say I agree with the "arcade" part. The guys at 777 certainly do have a passion for what they do. Anybody in the business of creating consumer flight simulators does.


Unless you're a pilot, you haven't encountered the 'feeling of flight' yet. Real pilots play WoFF all the time, and it comes with a Royal Aeronautical Society recommendation.
please understand, I did some work with 777, for RoF and BoM, and they were almost totally disinterested behind the scenes. The guys at OBD were a completely different matter, the interest and focus was there from the start, an almost opposite work environment.


Demo Reel https://soundcloud.com/matt-milne-8/sets/demo-reel-full

Composer - games, films, and tv. Rise of Flight, Wings Over flanders Fileds, Over Flanders Fields 2&3.
#4383428 - 10/06/17 01:04 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 481
Stache Offline
Member
Stache  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 481
Michigan, USA
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
I really do need a comparison somehow on the fm, and it's "feel". I'm one of those weird cats that dismiss all other aspects of aerial flight if the fm doesn't feel "good".... Doesn't have to be accurate, just good.


Sounds like you are very particular.

Originally Posted by TerribleTwo

If you're willing to download Aces High 3 go into offline arena and take the Dr1 for a spin. That way I could get a "feel" for how WoFF handles flight.


We have all been telling you it is "good" enough for us.
I have no interest in trying to do a comparison to AH3 in one particular plane model - that's no comparison at all.
Maybe someone else will, but whatever we "feel" will be what we "feel" and may not correlate to what you would feel at all.

The only way for you to "get a feel" is for you to fly WOFF yourself.


Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. A. Einstein

(System Specs:)

I7-6700k OC 4.4GHZ, 16GB DDR4 3200Mhz; Gigabyte Gaming 7 MB, G1 OC'ed GTX980ti; Three-Acer XB271HU WQHD Gsync 144Mhz; Samsung 950-512GB NVMe SSD; WD 2TB-7200rpm; Cooler Master HAF XB EVO, Nepton 240M cooler, V1000 PS; Windows 10 PRO; VKB GunfighterPro Stick; Saitek Pro Flight Pedals & Throttle; Dual TM MFD panels; TrackIR 5; home grown cockpit, � la RogerDodger.net
#4383433 - 10/06/17 01:31 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
TerribleTwo Online content
Hotshot
TerribleTwo  Online Content
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
Not necessarily Stache. The reason I suggest Aces High 3 and not RoF is because AH3 is not state of the art flight modelling. So if WoFF exceeds AH3, then that's good enough for me. I like the feel in Aces High. So it provides an excellent baseline for forming an opinion. We all know RoF is great and WoFF doesn't match that level. But I don't need or want that. I simply would like for someone, and I was assuming Mr Wiggins was volunteering to go a step further in helping me out.

I can't just throw out $45 to see what it's all about. With tight money, it's not my style.

Last edited by TerribleTwo; 10/06/17 01:32 AM.

"College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life" - Paul Ryan
#4383437 - 10/06/17 01:46 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Robert_Wiggins Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Robert_Wiggins  Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Lindsay, Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
Not necessarily Stache. The reason I suggest Aces High 3 and not RoF is because AH3 is not state of the art flight modelling. So if WoFF exceeds AH3, then that's good enough for me. I like the feel in Aces High. So it provides an excellent baseline for forming an opinion. We all know RoF is great and WoFF doesn't match that level. But I don't need or want that. I simply would like for someone, and I was assuming Mr Wiggins was volunteering to go a step further in helping me out.

I can't just throw out $45 to see what it's all about. With tight money, it's not my style.


Well I took your suggestion and downloaded AH3, flew the DR1 as you suggested and I can tell you that my impression was the FM sucked big time. I have to say WOFF FM is hands down way ahead of AH3.
That is my personal opinion and other may not agree for what ever reason. If you like AH3, you will find WOFF absolutely amazing!

Cheers mate!


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4383439 - 10/06/17 01:48 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 496
OvStachel Offline
Member
OvStachel  Offline
Member

Joined: May 2012
Posts: 496
Long Island, NY
LOL... I LOVE these conversations...

Here, I'll give you a good example of how silly some of this gets.

I work for a major international carrier that happens to be based at LHR and fly to JFK on a daily basis... for 25 years now... I have an FAA A/P and I carry 3 EASA licenses (B747, B777 and B767). OK... so I know a thing or two about being hands-on with very large planes.

I have Prepar3dv4, and PMDG's 747-400 and 777-200/300ER along with countless other planes installed.

For the fun of practicing my job, I load-up the 747-400 and "break it" based on what I know about the plane... well... it doesn't quite 'feel' right to me when it breaks. The CMC (Central Maintenance Computer) fails to give me the correct FIM (Fault Isolation Manual) codes.. so I can't clear messages the way I could normally... I can't flip the 'Ground Enable' swith on the P441, so I can't do the correct ground tests when I need to... I can't get into the Lower 41 to pull the breakers I normally would pull for No Land 3 status messages... I can't pull the P6 breakers for the "Pack" status messages... All I can do is a pack reset on the P5. AND there's NO MEL so I can't ADD anything!!!! Oh yeah... where's the the Tech Log??? How can I release the damn plane out without a Tech Log?!?!?!

Get what I'm saying?? ... it's a damn simulator... hence the term 'simulation' meaning... not real... meant to seem like real... meant to be kinda real.... meant to have fun with...

Not selling the game... but we broke our collective asses for over 10 years to bring to the community the best possible work as we could. The only pilots I have ever met that have flown these era planes were at Rhinebeck and The VA in New Zealand and they all said the same thing... quirky as hell to fly and a real work out after one hour you're ready for bed. So take that for what it is, a Jumbo (747-400) at cruise altitude of FL390 will turn on the pressure from breathing too hard on the yoke (actual quote from a Captain I'm friends with) .... and no one simulates that in any simulator either.

Just enjoy the skies over Flanders ... I'm happy as hell I can.

OvS


The Black Baron of Boistrancourt returns!!

I'd rather die fighting, than live for nothing. - Gen. G.S. Patton
#4383442 - 10/06/17 02:05 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 481
Stache Offline
Member
Stache  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 481
Michigan, USA
I was trying to state that just comparing a single aircraft FM is not a reasonable comparison for the entire simulation.
We all know that there are a great many people who do not like the FM of certain RoF planes. (any say nerfed Camel?)

Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
Not necessarily Stache. The reason I suggest Aces High 3 and not RoF is because AH3 is not state of the art flight modelling. So if WoFF exceeds AH3, then that's good enough for me. I like the feel in Aces High. So it provides an excellent baseline for forming an opinion. We all know RoF is great and WoFF doesn't match that level. But I don't need or want that. I simply would like for someone, and I was assuming Mr Wiggins was volunteering to go a step further in helping me out.


But wait... you already state that AH3 is not state of the art FM, but you like the "FEEL".

Glad Robert went the distance and tried AH3, but all he told you was the FM sucked, nothing about how it "FEELS".

Can you describe why you like the feel AH3?

Last edited by Stache; 10/06/17 02:08 AM.

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. A. Einstein

(System Specs:)

I7-6700k OC 4.4GHZ, 16GB DDR4 3200Mhz; Gigabyte Gaming 7 MB, G1 OC'ed GTX980ti; Three-Acer XB271HU WQHD Gsync 144Mhz; Samsung 950-512GB NVMe SSD; WD 2TB-7200rpm; Cooler Master HAF XB EVO, Nepton 240M cooler, V1000 PS; Windows 10 PRO; VKB GunfighterPro Stick; Saitek Pro Flight Pedals & Throttle; Dual TM MFD panels; TrackIR 5; home grown cockpit, � la RogerDodger.net
#4383443 - 10/06/17 02:08 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: Robert_Wiggins]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
TerribleTwo Online content
Hotshot
TerribleTwo  Online Content
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
Originally Posted by Robert_Wiggins
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
Not necessarily Stache. The reason I suggest Aces High 3 and not RoF is because AH3 is not state of the art flight modelling. So if WoFF exceeds AH3, then that's good enough for me. I like the feel in Aces High. So it provides an excellent baseline for forming an opinion. We all know RoF is great and WoFF doesn't match that level. But I don't need or want that. I simply would like for someone, and I was assuming Mr Wiggins was volunteering to go a step further in helping me out.

I can't just throw out $45 to see what it's all about. With tight money, it's not my style.


Well I took your suggestion and downloaded AH3, flew the DR1 as you suggested and I can tell you that my impression was the FM sucked big time. I have to say WOFF FM is hands down way ahead of AH3.
That is my personal opinion and other may not agree for what ever reason. If you like AH3, you will find WOFF absolutely amazing!

Cheers mate!



Thank you Mr. Wiggins, that is very nice to hear. Appreciate your time doing this.


"College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life" - Paul Ryan
#4383449 - 10/06/17 03:08 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Robert_Wiggins Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Robert_Wiggins  Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Lindsay, Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
Originally Posted by Robert_Wiggins
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
Not necessarily Stache. The reason I suggest Aces High 3 and not RoF is because AH3 is not state of the art flight modelling. So if WoFF exceeds AH3, then that's good enough for me. I like the feel in Aces High. So it provides an excellent baseline for forming an opinion. We all know RoF is great and WoFF doesn't match that level. But I don't need or want that. I simply would like for someone, and I was assuming Mr Wiggins was volunteering to go a step further in helping me out.

I can't just throw out $45 to see what it's all about. With tight money, it's not my style.


Well I took your suggestion and downloaded AH3, flew the DR1 as you suggested and I can tell you that my impression was the FM sucked big time. I have to say WOFF FM is hands down way ahead of AH3.
That is my personal opinion and other may not agree for what ever reason. If you like AH3, you will find WOFF absolutely amazing!

Cheers mate!



Thank you Mr. Wiggins, that is very nice to hear. Appreciate your time doing this.





thumbsup


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4383476 - 10/06/17 11:20 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,722
RAF_Louvert Offline
BOC President; Pilot Extraordinaire; Humble Man
RAF_Louvert  Offline
BOC President; Pilot Extraordinaire; Humble Man
Senior Member

Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,722
L'Etoile du Nord
.

It's been noted before that while ROF is an excellent flight simulator featuring WWI aircraft, WOFF is a fully immersive WWI combat experience featuring the war in the air.

.


[Linked Image]

Three RFC Brass Hats were strolling down a street in London. Two walked into a bar, the third one ducked.
_________________________________________________________________________

Former Cold War Warrior, USAF Security Service 1974-1978, E-4, Morse Systems Intercept, England, Europe, and points above.
"pippy-pahpah-pippy pah-pip-pah"

#4383486 - 10/06/17 11:42 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: OvStachel]  
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,347
Trooper117 Offline
Hotshot
Trooper117  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,347
UK
Originally Posted by OvStachel
LOL... I LOVE these conversations...

Here, I'll give you a good example of how silly some of this gets.

I work for a major international carrier that happens to be based at LHR and fly to JFK on a daily basis... for 25 years now... I have an FAA A/P and I carry 3 EASA licenses (B747, B777 and B767). OK... so I know a thing or two about being hands-on with very large planes.

I have Prepar3dv4, and PMDG's 747-400 and 777-200/300ER along with countless other planes installed.

For the fun of practicing my job, I load-up the 747-400 and "break it" based on what I know about the plane... well... it doesn't quite 'feel' right to me when it breaks. The CMC (Central Maintenance Computer) fails to give me the correct FIM (Fault Isolation Manual) codes.. so I can't clear messages the way I could normally... I can't flip the 'Ground Enable' swith on the P441, so I can't do the correct ground tests when I need to... I can't get into the Lower 41 to pull the breakers I normally would pull for No Land 3 status messages... I can't pull the P6 breakers for the "Pack" status messages... All I can do is a pack reset on the P5. AND there's NO MEL so I can't ADD anything!!!! Oh yeah... where's the the Tech Log??? How can I release the damn plane out without a Tech Log?!?!?!

Get what I'm saying?? ... it's a damn simulator... hence the term 'simulation' meaning... not real... meant to seem like real... meant to be kinda real.... meant to have fun with...

Not selling the game... but we broke our collective asses for over 10 years to bring to the community the best possible work as we could. The only pilots I have ever met that have flown these era planes were at Rhinebeck and The VA in New Zealand and they all said the same thing... quirky as hell to fly and a real work out after one hour you're ready for bed. So take that for what it is, a Jumbo (747-400) at cruise altitude of FL390 will turn on the pressure from breathing too hard on the yoke (actual quote from a Captain I'm friends with) .... and no one simulates that in any simulator either.

Just enjoy the skies over Flanders ... I'm happy as hell I can.

OvS


Absolutely! smile

#4383505 - 10/06/17 01:38 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 172
matmilne Offline
Member
matmilne  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 172
UK
You know I remember (must be about 8 years ago!) when off 3 was just out. People were worried that RoF was going to be better (we got the usual arguments of newer engine, better graphics, multiplayer etc), but after a few months it was clear that it was a very different product. Having just failed to beat Off BHaH in reviews and awards, we then released WoFF, which has dominated since. off vs rof was settled with off3 beating it on the whole, then came WoFF which has stayed on top. And now, coming soon will be WotR, a ww2 combat experience, It's a great time to be involved in flight sims.


Demo Reel https://soundcloud.com/matt-milne-8/sets/demo-reel-full

Composer - games, films, and tv. Rise of Flight, Wings Over flanders Fileds, Over Flanders Fields 2&3.
#4383611 - 10/06/17 09:53 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
TerribleTwo Online content
Hotshot
TerribleTwo  Online Content
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
Ok so I bought it and had my first aerial combat. I'll say that the sense of flying is better than I was assuming. Beautiful scenery as well, in spite of being an old engine.

I'm always the first to try to find an exploit in combat, so please enlighten me on one thing I found quickly. I notice that the planes tend to hang vertically too well with full power despite speed being nearly zero. I am also able to give some full rudder opposite of the way the plane wants to fall and able to keep in hanging. I do have the fm set on realistic. Is there a setting somewhere that can prevent this, or is it simply a part of the fm?

Last edited by TerribleTwo; 10/06/17 09:54 PM.

"College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life" - Paul Ryan
#4383627 - 10/06/17 10:35 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Robert_Wiggins Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Robert_Wiggins  Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Lindsay, Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
Ok so I bought it and had my first aerial combat. I'll say that the sense of flying is better than I was assuming. Beautiful scenery as well, in spite of being an old engine.

I'm always the first to try to find an exploit in combat, so please enlighten me on one thing I found quickly. I notice that the planes tend to hang vertically too well with full power despite speed being nearly zero. I am also able to give some full rudder opposite of the way the plane wants to fall and able to keep in hanging. I do have the fm set on realistic. Is there a setting somewhere that can prevent this, or is it simply a part of the fm?


The way you describe it, the plane hangs vertical at zero air speed indefinitely. I have never experienced that. Are you sure you are not falling tail down for some time?


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4383643 - 10/07/17 12:11 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
TerribleTwo Online content
Hotshot
TerribleTwo  Online Content
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
It's not gaining in altitude, but kinda hanging tail down at an angle. I notice it most with the Nieuport models. It's not indefinite but seems to have very powerful rudder response with little to no airspeed. Other planes seem to keel right over.

BTW, love the combat. A DVII got tired of turning with me and just decided to rocket for home. Couldn't catch him. Love it.

Last edited by TerribleTwo; 10/07/17 12:11 AM.

"College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life" - Paul Ryan
#4383667 - 10/07/17 07:17 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 344
AnKor Offline
Member
AnKor  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 344
Russia
I'll be honest and say that the rudder is the bane of WOFF flight models. And it was the same in OFF:BHaH.
The problem is not in the game engine but in the way FMs are configured. Some aircrafts are very good, some are in OMG WTF IT IS A HELICOPTER category.

#4383675 - 10/07/17 10:49 AM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: AnKor]  
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Robert_Wiggins Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Robert_Wiggins  Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Lindsay, Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by AnKor
I'll be honest and say that the rudder is the bane of WOFF flight models. And it was the same in OFF:BHaH.
The problem is not in the game engine but in the way FMs are configured. Some aircrafts are very good, some are in OMG WTF IT IS A HELICOPTER category.


Ankor, that is a pretty broad statement without much explanatory detail. I have made an FM mod before and would be willing to try and address your concerns if you would kindly PM me with details on specific aircraft. I can make changes and send them to you for testing.

How do you feel about that.


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4383680 - 10/07/17 12:15 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 344
AnKor Offline
Member
AnKor  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 344
Russia
I've tried your mod some time ago (sorry I didn't comment on it back then). It improves the behavior but didn't solve the main problem with the rudder.
I'm still wondering if I'm the only one who is bothered by the issue or maybe it just doesn't happen for other players.

Here is a couple of videos about DH4 I recorded some time ago

Here I apply full right rudder and then struggle to actually fly to the right without much success (of course I could just roll right and use the elevator, but I wanted to do a flat turn).


Here I line up with a line of trees then apply full left rudder, aircraft turns left but flies... to the right. And with increased ground speed (+20 km/h with the rudder).



Albatros DII suffers from similar issues, but at the same time D.Va is quite good if I recall correctly.

#4383682 - 10/07/17 12:29 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
TerribleTwo Online content
Hotshot
TerribleTwo  Online Content
Hotshot

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,795
Ankor, those aren't the issues I see. The rudder is too powerful at high angle of attacks and low speed (pulling up to high rate of climb, keep stick back all the way, and use rudder to keep nose pointing skyward, full throttle). If anyone is familiar with remote control 3D flying, this is what I'm talking about.

I've noticed, especially with the Nieuports, that if you do the above, the plane will maintain nose pointing up, and you can use the engine and rudder to hold that position for a good while, constantly using the controls to keep upward direction. Even gaining altitude.

Also, while doing this, I noticed my speed NEVER gets below 30 or so knots, so you can essentially gain altitude by doing some 3D flying.

Now, if you cut the engine off, the plane will fall over as normal. So the prop is holding the plane up like a helicopter.


So I'm not sure if this is something that is part of the hardcoded fm, or if there is a setting I can adjust. In my newbie opinion it seems like there too much power to weight ratio going on in certain planes, like the Nieuports. In RC 3D flying, it's all about power to weight, that's what you need to do this: right about the 30 second is what I'm referring to:



"College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life" - Paul Ryan
#4383686 - 10/07/17 12:53 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 344
AnKor Offline
Member
AnKor  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 344
Russia
I've seen one mention of the same behavior and I believe it is likely the same issue. I just don't expect the cfs3 engine to behave well outside normal flight envelope smile
But a problem specific to WOFF is that for some aircrafts applying rudder greatly reduces the drag (especially sideways) and allows all kinds of weird stuff to happen.

#4383689 - 10/07/17 01:35 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 280
BuckeyeBob Offline
Member
BuckeyeBob  Offline
Member

Joined: May 2016
Posts: 280
Ohio, USA
"The Dr1 is porked!"

Er, sorry. For a moment I was having a flashback to one of the RB3d FM flamewars on the Delphi flightsim forum. Has it really been almost 25 years ago now?

Seriously, it is nice to have some new blood on the forum to spice things up a bit. Welcome to the forum, TerribleTwo! New lad buys the drinks!

#4383690 - 10/07/17 01:58 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 280
BuckeyeBob Offline
Member
BuckeyeBob  Offline
Member

Joined: May 2016
Posts: 280
Ohio, USA
A few points regarding the WOFFUE FM's:

1. As mentioned above, the FM's are individual for each aircraft, so there does tend to be some variability in FM's for different plane types.

2. Beginning, I think, with WOFF3, OBD took away the ability to directly modify some FM variables contained in the CFS3 .cfg and .air files, such as induced drag and parasitic drag. While you can alter these coefficients in the WOFF UE .xfm file, I have been unable to observe any effect on the FM when I manipulate these variables. If I recall, you could also fiddle around with engine settings such as hp and cylinder compression settings in the old files, but I could be mistaken.

Note: I am NOT trashing OBD's decision to remove these settings from our direct control, as I am sure this is a design issue, and I am confident OBD has very good reasons, most likely unknown to us, for doing so.

3. On the other hand, some settings, such as rudder effectiveness, roll damping, roll aoaReduction rate, and aoaZeroSpeed_mph, among many others, ARE available to us, so we do have some control over some aspects of flight. Perhaps tweaking these variables might address some of TT's concerns, although I am afraid the cure to his specific issue most likely lies around the aircraft drag and engine settings.

Last edited by BuckeyeBob; 10/07/17 02:39 PM.
#4383708 - 10/07/17 03:37 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 280
BuckeyeBob Offline
Member
BuckeyeBob  Offline
Member

Joined: May 2016
Posts: 280
Ohio, USA
Looking at the FM for the Nieuports, I would concentrate on two variables: the aoaReduc_frac and the rudder propEffec_frac.

For all planes, the aoaReduction_frac ranges from .12 to .35, with the N11 and the N16 at the lowest setting of .12. Other Nieups are at .29.

The rudder propEffec_frac varies between 1.0 to 1.95, with an average of 1.16. Most of the Nieuports are set to 1.22, slightly higher than average, and perhaps a little too high for their relatively weak engines.

Therefore, try increasing the aoaReduction_frac and decreasing the rudder propEffec_frac a bit as a start.

#4383714 - 10/07/17 04:23 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,609
Polovski Offline
Polovski  Offline

Hotshot

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,609
Here we go again...

BTW some craft for example the Fok DVII could actually hang on the prop.
Nieuports are extremely light compared to some other a/c.

Also the a/c are well balanced and fit within their historical position relative to other craft.

For anyone who wants to create new FMs hope you have a lot of time, there's 80+ aircraft smile


Regards,

Polovski,
OBD Software, developers of the fabulously immersive
"WINGS: Over Flanders Fields" WW1 Sim.
http://www.overflandersfields.com
#4383720 - 10/07/17 05:04 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Robert_Wiggins Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Robert_Wiggins  Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Lindsay, Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by TerribleTwo
Ankor, those aren't the issues I see. The rudder is too powerful at high angle of attacks and low speed (pulling up to high rate of climb, keep stick back all the way, and use rudder to keep nose pointing skyward, full throttle). If anyone is familiar with remote control 3D flying, this is what I'm talking about.

I've noticed, especially with the Nieuports, that if you do the above, the plane will maintain nose pointing up, and you can use the engine and rudder to hold that position for a good while, constantly using the controls to keep upward direction. Even gaining altitude.

Also, while doing this, I noticed my speed NEVER gets below 30 or so knots, so you can essentially gain altitude by doing some 3D flying.

Now, if you cut the engine off, the plane will fall over as normal. So the prop is holding the plane up like a helicopter.


So I'm not sure if this is something that is part of the hardcoded fm, or if there is a setting I can adjust. In my newbie opinion it seems like there too much power to weight ratio going on in certain planes, like the Nieuports. In RC 3D flying, it's all about power to weight, that's what you need to do this: right about the 30 second is .....



Can you vid capture this effect for us in WOFF while occasionally showing airspeed and post it here. Please identify which Newport models.

Tnx


(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

#4383729 - 10/07/17 05:54 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: BuckeyeBob]  
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,123
JJJ65 Offline
Member
JJJ65  Offline
Member

Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,123
Czech Rep.
Originally Posted by BuckeyeBob
Looking at the FM for the Nieuports, I would concentrate on two variables: the aoaReduc_frac and the rudder propEffec_frac.

For all planes, the aoaReduction_frac ranges from .12 to .35, with the N11 and the N16 at the lowest setting of .12. Other Nieups are at .29.

The rudder propEffec_frac varies between 1.0 to 1.95, with an average of 1.16. Most of the Nieuports are set to 1.22, slightly higher than average, and perhaps a little too high for their relatively weak engines.

Therefore, try increasing the aoaReduction_frac and decreasing the rudder propEffec_frac a bit as a start.

+1

#4383734 - 10/07/17 06:54 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,490
dutch Offline
Member
dutch  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,490
EURO-zone
Just try this mod for the Albatros DV and the N17
https://combatace.com/files/file/14657-alb_dva_n17_fm_mod/

#4383741 - 10/07/17 07:35 PM Re: Don't "sell" the game, be honest about the flight modelling. [Re: TerribleTwo]  
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Robert_Wiggins Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Robert_Wiggins  Offline
BWOC Survivor!...So Far!!
Hotshot

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,044
Lindsay, Ontario, Canada
Terrible Two;

the following is a vid capture of the N23 in a power climb until stall occurs. It seems fine to me. It doesn't seem to hang on the prop as you described your experience. I also was unable to hold vertical when stall started. She forces over and there is no way to determine if there is any vertical slide back in the process. What do you think?

Last edited by Robert_Wiggins; 10/07/17 07:35 PM.

(System_Specs)
Case: Cooler Master Storm Trooper
Pwr Sup: OCZ, GameXStream,1000-Watt
MB: Asus Maximus VI Extreme
Mem: Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB), PC3-12800, DDR3-1600MHz, Unbuffered
CPU: Intel i7-4770K, OC to 4.427Ghz
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Seidon 240M Liquid CPU Cooler
Vid Card: ASUS GTX 980Ti STRIX 6GB
OS and Games on separate: Samsung 840 Series 250GB SSD
Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster BX2450L
Periphs: MS Sidewinder FFB2 Pro, TrackIR 4

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  Polovski, Sandbagger 

Quick Search
Recent Articles
Support SimHQ

If you shop on Amazon use this Amazon link to support SimHQ
.
Social


Recent Topics
What a difference the correct language makes
by PanzerMeyer. 10/23/17 04:40 PM
Japanese Carpentry
by F4UDash4. 10/23/17 04:09 PM
Bernie Madoff seeks redemption
by Ssnake. 10/23/17 06:53 AM
Tom & Jerry live orchestra
by Blade_RJ. 10/22/17 06:16 PM
Mafia now on GOG
by WangoTango. 10/21/17 05:38 PM
Parental discretion is advised
by U-96. 10/20/17 11:07 PM
Endeavour, the whole story
by Mad Max. 10/20/17 10:23 PM
Chinese construction
by KraziKanuK. 10/19/17 11:08 PM
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0