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#4358957 - 05/23/17 02:08 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: DM]  
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You learn stuff in school, then forget what you're not interested in or don't need, right?



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#4358959 - 05/23/17 02:14 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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people forget the details but tend not to forget the "concepts" presented which is generally even more important in terms of someones education


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#4358961 - 05/23/17 02:18 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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Even in companies with an international presence, a vast majority of their staff have no interaction outside of their locale. Relevant skills are what companies pay, and hire, for not geographical knowledge that is not applicable to the specific job.

I spent several years working at the help desk for UPI (United Press International). When a problem occurred, I might end up on the phone with various people in locations all over the world but it still did not matter if I could find their location on a map.

Last edited by cichlidfan; 05/23/17 03:56 PM.

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#4358964 - 05/23/17 02:25 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
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+1 cichlidfan


The "well rounded" humanities education concept started back when it was only members of the aristocracy or the wealthy class who attended universities. Having a well rounded education that included things like classical languages, history, geography, the arts, etc. enabled these high standing members of society to engage in intellectual conversations with their peers. It had nothing to do with getting a job because they didn't need one.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4358967 - 05/23/17 02:28 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
MarkG's post perfectly illustrates my point. Let's be honest, knowing where a country is on a map in this day and age really does not matter. If you have to get that info, all you do is load up Googlemaps and enter the name of the country.


This "Renaissance Man" humanities education philosophy is really outdated.


I disagree as well. People with too narrow an education will lose out the minute their trade becomes obsolete (blacksmiths, coopers, operator, pony express rider wink ....). And having a broad education makes it a lot easier to learn something new. It keeps you flexible, whereas a narrow field of expertise (and nothing else tucked on) may suddenly leave you unemployed.

We shouldn't be too literal with "Geography" in this discussion. "Geography knowledge" as a stand-alone skill is also just another specialization.


Why men throw their lives away attacking an armed Witcher... I'll never know. Something wrong with my face?
#4359021 - 05/23/17 06:30 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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I never relied on the school system to teach my son geography; indeed, I don't recall a geography class past third grade, and it was of the USA and memorizing state capitals.

I understand the why, but it shorts the how of history. And history is important, as it is about how people think and what they do - and that is always useful.

So my son learned to love looking at maps and talking about history at the same time because I took the time to do it with him. Topography as well as geography is important. Having them concentrate on STEM was just fine with me.

Hell, the whole of human development is dependent on geography. People tend to move along latitudes, sticking to the same kinds of climate whenever they can. This is why there was a silk road from China to the Mediterranean, why bronze, iron, and domesticated animals and crops spread across from Europe to Asia.

In the Americas it was different. Technology and crops didn't flow north and south to then travel east and west. Potatoes went from South America to Europe and then to North America, for example.

Korea has the problem of being no place special that is on the way to all manner of special places full of resources. The same is true for the Balkans in Europe.


The opinions of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

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#4359024 - 05/23/17 06:34 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
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The best way to make financial use of extensive geography and history knowledge is to get on "Jeopardy!". smile

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 05/23/17 06:35 PM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4359063 - 05/23/17 09:27 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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While I can point out most countries in the world on a silent map, when it comes to US states I am somewhat clueless. Indiana? Somewhere in the mid-west, between Kansas and Wyoming probably, which are also in the mid-west ... somewhere.
With that in mind I tend to give others some slack, given that most US states are the size of full-grown countries elsewhere. I may know the locations of 170...180 countries, but at the same time I'm missing out on an equal number of provinces in large countries like China, Brazil, Russia, Canada. So who am I to chastise the average American for not having a precise bearing on the location of some commie backwater hellhole. Now, the other part of the study is more interesting, that we're more inclined to agree to the application of military force the less we know about a certain place.
I suppose it should be the exact opposite way - that we wouldn't favor military intervention if we don't have a clear idea about the context and the consequences. But on the other hand, that's why we have representatives in parliament, so that THEY learn all the relevant facts before casting their vote. And that in turn is based on the demonstrably false expectation that it would actually be the US Congress to declare war - which it hasn't on anyone since Pearl Harbor. The effective decision rests with the executive these days (which may not be such a great idea, depending on one's point of view) ... so for Joe Sixpack the knowledge where North Korea is and why it may or may not be a good idea to use military force is largely inconsequential. After the presidential elections are over he has zero influence on the decisions made in the White House, so why even bother. North Korea isn't a trade partner (except for animated films and TV series) to anyone outside of China and South Korea (up to a degree), so nobody's jobs are at stake if he's ignorant about North Korea in general, be it its location, history, culture, or politics. There's a crazy dictator with a terrible haircut at the top, and they got nukes. What else does Joe Sixpack really need to know?

#4359067 - 05/23/17 09:47 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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#4359074 - 05/23/17 10:20 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: DM]  
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Originally Posted by DM
Originally Posted by PanzerMeyer
MarkG's post perfectly illustrates my point. Let's be honest, knowing where a country is on a map in this day and age really does not matter. If you have to get that info, all you do is load up Googlemaps and enter the name of the country.


This "Renaissance Man" humanities education philosophy is really outdated.


I would disagree with that smile a well-rounded education is an essential IMO. But, education cutbacks, school targets etc has turned education into training frown


When your country is tiny and has to import a lot of goods and many have to leave if they want to pursue many career choices your argument holds more water. Lets take sims / video games considering they site we're on. You live in the Czech Republic so lets use that as an example. Your choices are for this career are:

1) Bohemia Interactive / ArmA series
2) Maybe some small time mobile game studio
3) Move to another country

In the US we have many options. We can even go to Canada for a short while and culturally you won't notice much of a difference unless you're in Quebec.

Not saying it isn't useful, but when you have 320 million people, can fly 5 hours via commercial plane and still be within your borders it isn't as relevant.

#4359098 - 05/24/17 12:20 AM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: Flogger23m]  
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Wow. Czech Republic and not including Warhorse? Missing a trick there. Okay so a relatively small game company ~100 people, but that is huge compared to some, and they are making a 'realistic' historical Mediaeval role playing game, which has to at least tickle the "swords are cool I guess" aspect.

#4359103 - 05/24/17 12:39 AM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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The Czechs gave us Mafia and Hidden and Dangerous. cheers notworthy Coming soon, Kingdom Come Deliverance. charge


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Romans 10:1-13

#4359111 - 05/24/17 01:29 AM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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Don't forget Factorio. thumbsup


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#4359170 - 05/24/17 11:18 AM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
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And the Poles gave us the Witcher series!


But yes, both the OFP/ArmA series and the Hidden & Dangerous series have a special place in my heart.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4359204 - 05/24/17 02:13 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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Coot Offline
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These United States of America
And the Finns gave us Max Payne and Alan Wake! I dare say some of the best and most unique and timeless gaming gems that have ever been created were made across the ocean. No doubt about it.

Last edited by Coot; 05/24/17 02:13 PM.

John 10:1-30
Romans 10:1-13

#4359209 - 05/24/17 02:28 PM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: Coot]  
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PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
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Originally Posted by Coot
And the Finns gave us Max Payne and Alan Wake! I dare say some of the best and most unique and timeless gaming gems that have ever been created were made across the ocean. No doubt about it.



I enjoyed Alan Wake quite a bit. I had no idea it was made by a Finnish developer.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4359381 - 05/25/17 10:41 AM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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Yeah Remedy made those games. I'm guessing they are still based out of Finland. Loved Max Payne1&2 and Alan Wake. I hope to get Quantum Break at some point as well. I'm hoping they do a real Alan Wake Sequel and make it open world like they had planned on doing with the original game. I still remember some of those alpha videos of Alan Wake that was open world and showed a tornado tearing everything up with the physics.


John 10:1-30
Romans 10:1-13

#4359385 - 05/25/17 11:03 AM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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As long as Trump knows where it is... boom


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#4360637 - 05/31/17 05:00 AM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: piper]  
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It appears our anti-missiles know where the incoming ICBM's are at.
That's important. biggrin
If North Korea fires one, it may not be on the map anymore.
They'll just call it "Korea", as it should be. MacArthur was right, we are paying for our mistake now.

Most of the college kids couldn't point out the Asian Continent, let alone North Korea.
I don't think they're sure of where to go to the bathroom anymore.


"Murphy's Law"
#4360708 - 05/31/17 09:43 AM Re: Only 36 percent of Americans can find North Korea on a map [Re: Murphy]  
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Originally Posted by Murphy
I don't think they're sure of where to go to the bathroom anymore.


Ain't that the truth. Had some "whatzit" walk into a Men's room in front of me at school recently. After doing my thing I said, "If you have to sit down to pee, you are in the wrong place" and walked out.

I also feel geography and history are an essential part of basic education.


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