Just wondering how you learnt English and what was the most effective thing you did to learn it? There are an awful lot of non Native English speakers on the internet and I'm always impressed at how well they speak/write English. I've been learning French for a couple of years and now I'm getting a little frustrated as I seem to be stuck at an intermediate level and I'm not really sure what to concentrate on to improve efficiently.

In my opinion, you will really never learn another language unless you immerse yourself with native speakers for at least a few months. I took 4 years of German when I was in high school and college and I actually had a pretty decent conversational ability UNTIL I graduated from college and thus had no native speakers to continue learning the language. I can still read German a bit now but my conversational skills have really diminished.

I would tend to agree except I see heaps of non native English speakers on youtube, for example, making videos in English from their own native countries and I can't believe that these people all disappeared off to England or the US for a few months to immerse themselves in our language, or that they have lots of English friends hanging around. They must have picked up most of their skills 'in situ'

I've just come back from a week's language course in France, I have a French private tutor, and I have friends in France, so it's not like I'm bereft of native conversation. I'm just a little frustrated that something I appear to be finding difficult seems to be so easy to these foreigners who speak English so well.

My neighbour,who is Polish,told me he learnt most of his English by playing computer games and interacting with the gaming community.

English is the universal language for a myriad of reasons; hence, the language is everywhere and easily accessible especially since the advent of the internet. Even in Miami it's becoming more difficult to find people who only speak Spanish. Most of them at least have a basic command of English.

I work with Czechs and almost all of them learned better English by playing online games with VOIP.

Playing online games with comms can be both a funny and educational experience.

I remember playing Joint Ops years ago and we had a German member who spoke grammatically correct English but he also sounded just like Arnold Schwarzenegger. We also had a Canadian player who sounded like he was from the film "Strange Brew".

Sesame Street.

My wife learned English at school, also French and German as well as her native Flemish Dutch, but she says that watching UK/USA TV here in Belgium got her to a point where she spoke English pretty fluently, then when the internet came along it was mainly English that she used on it. She does still have some moments in regards what prefix to use i.e. using "un" instead of "in" and my favourite is "raped cheese" instead of grated cheese

Back in the UK she is mistaken for Scottish or Irish as people cannot quite place her accent, but then again I have a very mixed accent having spent my formative years just north of Glasgow and then moving to the far north when I was 16.

You mean to tell me that not all Scots sound like Bill Connolly?

Wow. I think I understood about 25% of what that guy said in the video. Lol.

I hear that a lot but have never really understood it. I could watch Japanese TV from now until doomsday and I don't think I'd ever understand Japanese. I can't quite figure out how words and sentences you don't understand magically translate in to sentences you can understand just by listening to them over and over again.

I recommend subtitles for Rab C Nesbitt

Key word here being "spoke".

Once you get the basics (by reading, that is) yes, TV and movies pretty much teach you the rest. A lot of knowledge is just how to say X expression in language Y.

That's how it worked for me at least. I started with computers at a time when everything was in English, no internet of course, not even a Spanish keyboard. So you learn, dictionary in hand, as you go. "hmmm, so you "run" a program but DOS "runS" a program... second person singular adds a "s" at the end? That's it?"

The rest comes from watching The Nanny with subtitles.

Nowadays I guess Youtube and the Web fulfills that role.

It also helps that, at least from a Spanish perspective, English doesn't have any concept that you didn't know already Japanese would be another matter I'm sure.

So at the end, it's easy to learn and you have plenty of material all around you.... one day you can just speak English for some unknown reason.

Yes. Having a totally different alphabet and script would tend to make things a bit more complex.

Actually, I was shocked to find out that Japanese and Spanish have quite a few similarities when it comes to pronounciation rules.

She had already learned the basics in school, therefore she already had a handle on what was being said.

I have no feeling for language and really struggle with speaking Dutch, partly is that I cannot pronounce some of the words which stems from a childhood accident that damaged my throat and adam's apple, hang I struggle with English too sometimes Now I can read the subtitles on the TV programs here and understand what is being said either spoken or written - tho I'm better at reading Dutch than hearing it.

As for Japanese, once you start to understand a few of the words and how they are put together you start picking out more and more of them from what is being said. I had a Japanese friend that lived with me while he was studying in Scotland, as part of his way of paying for his studies he gave Japanese lessons at college which is where I met him, but with not having much access to spoken Japanese other than the likes of Ran and Kagemusha after he went back home I very quickly lost the ear to the flow of the language.

Sorry, must do the mandatory Monty Python sketch posting since this thread made me think of it.

Just for you PM, a teach yourself Glesga



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfCk_yNuTGk

Yeah, that sounds more like how I expect. It's not just watching TV shows. It's watching TV shows in concert with doing other things too. I'm doing much of that. Just a bit frustrating at how slow it seems to come. Maybe I'm just a bit dim

That is the slow-but-not-boring method. You can also go with the more academic-but-tiresome method, but it is, well, boring. I guess it all boils down to how fast you want to learn vs. how much effort you want to put into it. Watching movies doesn't require any effort other than making popcorn.

Thanks for posting that Alicatt. It was a great watch!

I got half-way decent in speaking english by trying to imitate Jello Biafra Spoken Word style and singing Iron Maiden songs
My contemporary vocabulary stems mostly from modern US comics like Bongo's Simpsons Comics.
My prof was surprised how well I could handle our native english-speaking post-docs in conversations. I lost my edge after a few years without practice.

English was the language used for 98% of the subjects taught at school. I had reading, writing, and grammar classes. Aside from locally-made programs or shows, almost everything else entertainment-wise was from the USA. Cartoons were 99.999% in english. I loved reading books and it was near-impossible to get a non-english book unless it was about the Filipino culture or folk tales and the like.

I was also Editor-in-Chief for my highschool's paper and spent one year again as the EiC in university for a scholarship.

Everything nursing-related is in english.

My youngest daughter works in a recruitment firm, she had an office job basically a clerk until one day after being there for about 3 months she called home here to ask me to do somethings for her and of course we spoke in English, the office manager heard her speak and was impressed with her grasp of English.

So he called her into the office and questioned her about it, with the result being that she got promoted, moved to Zaventem and was made a kind of roving trouble shooter

English is easy to learn. I learned it before I went to school even. All these foreign languages though......

My English grew mostly with the amount of forums I visited online. That took the barely serviceable results from school to where it's now.

So find some French message boards on topics that interest you.

And I can vouch for Colonel that his English is excellent. Actually meeting with him (and Jayhawk for that matter) you couldn't tell really that English was their second language. Those of you who knew Jstar, he was the same way. in fact I was impressed that he even knew some of our American expressions and used them appropriately. Except for an accent here and there you couldn't tell he was Swede.

My wife was born and raised in Poland and she came over to the US when she was 17 or 18. So, she still has a pretty strong Polish accent. But her English is in many ways better than mine. She studied English in school, but she was taught the Queen's English, so some things were a little fof, like when she asked her teacher for a rubber when she made a mistake on her exam. The American teacher was aghast but then realized she was asking for an eraser, which is called a rubber by the Brits apparently.

For my wife's case, she learned English in school in Poland, then with ESL classes in the US. She said what really helped her was writing English...probably beause it married what she was hearing to what she was seeing. SHe also said watching things like children's cartoons helps because the English is very simple. Finally, there is also actually using it on a regular basis and being immersed in it. I think any of us with a high school language course know about that one.

v6,
boNes

I think one of the major things this thread has revealed is that since English is the universal language, native English speakers as a general rule tend to be less motivated to learn a second language. Why learn a second language when you can use English almost anywhere?

I was fortunate in that I was raised fully bilingual. I spoke English with my dad and of course in school while I spoke Spanish with my mom and other relatives.

Thanks Bones. My English isn't half as good as your Top Gun impression

I'm disappointed in how many people around here have no grasp of anything but German. In my coaching function I often know very helpful books or youtube links that I would offer, if they could actually read or listen to the damn things...

I remember Jayhawk saying that he lived in California for like 2 or 3 years? That would definitely help in making him fluent.

I was an unfortunate opposite. My parents spoke Tagalog to each other but English to us so I never picked up Tagalog except for very basic words and bad words (haha always the easiest to learn). I feel silly that I can't speak Tagalog even though I am Filipino but I'm trying to learn it now and need more practice (hint hint, Ice). I have my plate full as it is though with learning Polish and continuing my French and Spanish.

v6,
boNes

In my experience so far I find the culture most like the US (in that they are monolingual and don't bother with more than a passing attempt at another) is Japan.
Our company is global. I communicate with offices in France, Germany, UK, China, Malaysia, India, Japan, Taiwan, and Korea.

The office I have the most difficulty with is the Tokyo one. None of them are what I would consider fluent in English, and probably only half of them can make themselves understood.
Taiwan is not as bad, but it can be difficult to understand what they mean.

The European offices? No problem with English at all. Malaysia seems to do everything in English. China's offices do English and Chinese, but their English is great. Korea is mostly English.



The Jedi Master

Malaysia used to be part of the British Empire so that explains their affinity for English. Japan is still very much an isolationist society compared to the other Asian countries and immigration to Japan is super, super tiny compared to most other countries. That pretty much explains the lack of interest for the most part in learning a second language.

Anytime you need practice, bones, sabihin mo lang at maguusap tayo sa wikang Tagalog

It's quite a funny setup with my boys... my wife and I talk in three languages/dialects, primarily Bisaya/Cebuano because that's the dialect in the region where we were when we met. Our eldest knows Bisaya/Cebuano, English, and Tagalog because my parents and relatives speak Tagalog and most of my relatives (Dad's side) are from Luzon and they speak Tagalog. Our youngest can understand a little Tagalog, nothing of Bisaya/Cebuano, and speaks primarily English. The main reason for this was because he was 2 years old when he came to the UK and was thus "immersed" in the English language for most of his life. He is "studying" Tagalog via YouTube so that he can speak it more and one of his best buds in school is a Polish lad and they teach each other their language.

So Tagalog is the main language in the Philippines while Bisaya/Cebuano is more of a local dialect?

More or less. There is another popular dialect there called Illicano (I might have misspelled it).

v6,
boNes

i started somewhat early becouse my father realized how important that would be in the future,so i was 11 to 12 and this was a time when not everyone could afford a english class,not like today where you have a english school in every corner.
At that time, i loved the x-files,and the english school had available to all students a video room, and lucky me they had a whole season there subtitled in VHS,so i would watch the episodes and again trying to make out the words, and i learned that subs dont exactly match what is spoken,but it was a nice helper.
So i would sugest,pick something that you enjoy,movie,books,videogames,tv series especially since they use common vocabulary and slangs,and also,dont be lazy if you dont know a word have a dictionary with you,today it is even simpler since you dont need to carry a 2 pound book the size of the bible!!!!

And interation with people is honestly the most important, doesnt matter if you have bad engrish,it gets better. So place like this forum and online chats also helped me a lot,and you get to make some friends as bonus.

Oh, and oddly enough contrary to what most of you english speakers think, my spoken spanish is intermediary and kinda bad, its not easy to transition to spanish from portuguese just becouse it looks similar in text,only the grammar is easy.

Yes, while I can do a decent Scottish accent there is no WAY I could actually talk like Nesbitt or Baxter in this thread. Understanding is one thing, communicating in kind is another!



The Jedi Master

While I can speak like them, it is not my dialect, and coming from a more middle class upbringing and about 20miles from Glasgow it does not come naturally

Here with all my step kids and their spouses I can understand most of what they say... except for one of them that comes from the next town, her dialect is so different I just look blank when she says anything I just do not understand her. My youngest grand daughter, the daughter of the afore mentioned daughter in law, she is almost 2 and she catches on quick, today she used English words to me and Dutch to everyone else, it caught me by surprise this morning while I was baby sitting her and her younger brother.

Tagalog (or Filipino) is the main language in the Philippines, yes. The terms change depending on who you talk to, but I prefer the term Tagalog as it is clearly the language. Filipino can either mean the language or a citizen of the Philippines.

As for dialects, there are many. Bisaya and Cebuano are roughly the same, with small differences here and there. There's Ilonggo, Waray, Hiligaynon, Ilocano, Karay-a, and so on. It's quite funny when you then transplant those people over here in the UK.... we converse by Tagalog initially, but when we figure out that the person speaks a common dialect, it's like meeting an old friend! Speaking English is fine, speaking Tagalog is better, but when we speak the same dialect, it's like talking to a cousin or something. I guess one aspect of that is because humor can be different also depending on the dialect spoken, and there are "funny terms" that is funny in the dialect but not in another language.

A few times over here, when meeting or passing by someone who looks Southeast Asian, one person will throw out the term "kabayan" which is Tagalog for "countryman" or "fellow countryman." If the other person is Filipino, then they'll respond appropriately... if the other person isn't (maybe Malaysian or Indonesian or something else), they'll give a blank stare at which point the first person just apologizes and carries on. I was walking down high street one time when some guys passed me and I heard him say "kabayan!" I looked back and he was looking at me, so I responded. Turns out they were living nearby but just moved into the area and wanted directions.

Dude, chinese people surprise me, the ones i met in business were in one sentence oh hok, ki min oh chi, then turn to me and speak fluent portuguese with brazilian acent,if i didnt know i would think they were born here !!

There's also the fact that, even if you speak the local language adequately enough, once they determine that you're English they usually want to switch to English to speak to you. It can be a bit annoying and I've spoken to a couple of English people who have given up trying to speak other languages because everybody wants to speak English to them. I had a homeless guy approach me in Montpellier to ask for money, and even he spoke English. The ubiquity of the language is becoming quite startling and I definitely see the internet as being behind that. When I first started going abroad in the 80s English wasn't nearly as widely spoken among 'common' people.

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

I use this method when I am trying to speak a foreign language.
If you speak slowly and loudly enough they will understand you. Lol



https://youtu.be/Y8gOjasxxO0






.

My experience with trying to talk Czech is that I will go to some restaurant, and in my best Czech will ask for what I want, and the waiter/waitress will ask me in English what drink I want with it.

And this happens in Prague? How interesting.

Oh I know that response so well here too

There are so few foreigners that speak Dutch that they do appreciate you trying to speak their language

I was in Aruba and Bonaire ( both islands are part of Holland) about 2 years ago and what's funny is that I heard English being spoken there much more than Dutch.

Most people here and in Holland speak English as a second language, I have found very few that don't and most of them are about 80 years old.

My wife is fairly typical in that she has Dutch as her first language and French as a second, but more people have English as a second language and it seems to have overtaken French as a second language.

Now if you go to the Walloon region everyone speaks a version of French which is slightly different than the French from France, you will find quite a few also speak a little English but not as many as in the Flemish region, and you will find very, very, few Walloons that speak Dutch/Flemish ( or that will admit to it!)

I have seen it when we are in the Walloon region that if my wife uses Flemish then she gets blanked and also if she uses French she gets treated as a second class citizen, it doesn't happen everywhere but I have seen it happening often enough over the years. If I use English then I get smiles and help.

Same with me
In the more major places, anyway. In smaller shops, or anywhere outside of Prague, and in any government offices, I speak bad Czech, and they either look at me confused, or reply in a rapid stream of complicated Czech.

To add a bit about how people learn English and get competent in conversation skills - there are English native speakers all over the place teaching English. It's a really common summer / Gap year job for Americans (and some Brits). It's pretty easy to find a native speaker, meet with them for an hour a week, and talk.

I hear more English spoken when I go to Mexico than I do going to Miami.



The Jedi Master

OMG, This weekend I went to a panel discussion and test screening for a documentary about Chicago record label WAXTRAX! and as I was walking into the theatre, I passed someone who looked like Jello Biafra. Sure enough, he was on the panel. That was crazy!

v6,
boNes