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#4340604 - 02/27/17 04:39 AM Shadows of Mordor sequel  
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Raw Kryptonite Offline
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Saw this elsewhere. Great game, glad we're getting another one.
Supposedly 8/22.
http://www.pcgamer.com/shadow-of-mordor-sequel-shadow-of-war-leaked/


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#4340608 - 02/27/17 05:10 AM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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I'll be buying it. I really enjoyed Shadows of Mordor and the two DLC's.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4340664 - 02/27/17 10:29 AM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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Yep. One of the best LOTR universe games, IMO. Will definitely get the sequel as well.


In all my years I've never seen the like. It has to be more than a hundred sea miles and he brings us up on his tail. That's seamanship, Mr. Pullings. My God, that's seamanship!
#4340732 - 02/27/17 03:19 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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I'm not sanguine about it coming out late August when it hasn't even been announced yet. I find it more likely it will be delayed.

Still, not surprising they made a sequel. The bigger question is if it will be worthy.



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4340787 - 02/27/17 05:13 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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#4340810 - 02/27/17 06:13 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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Wow, cool trailer! Glad to see confirmation of the date, I was doubtful too. LOL


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#4340885 - 02/27/17 09:19 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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Oh wow awesome! Definitely one I'll want to get. I've got 56 hours in SoM and still haven't finished it yet. I agree that this is one of the best LOTR games. PS2 had a couple of great movie-based games that I liked and that my nephew now plays. I also have to say that War in the North is also a great LOTR game. This is a sequel that I've been hoping for and I kind of like these late announcements because then it doesn't feel like you're having to wait as long as they've already been secretly working on it for some years. I hope they make it even more open world or at least more than two areas that are even bigger maps than the first. SoM also does great with how they implement the Tolkien lore through finding objects with "memories" and the substantial library of people and places. That trailer is epic! I wonder if they are using the same engine or trying something new? I also wonder if the game will continue the SoM and Mad Max formula of sort of having a modular world that has to be liberated and reclaimed piece by piece. I'm glad to see the Nemesis system is coming back too! And make sure Monolith that you add a FOV slider this time!!!!(I use widescreen fixer but we need more settings this time)

Last edited by Coot; 02/27/17 09:39 PM.

John 10:1-30
Romans 10:1-13

#4340899 - 02/27/17 10:08 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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I played "War in the North" a couple times through in cooperative mode and it was a lot of fun.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4340970 - 02/28/17 04:51 AM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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One thing I really, really don't like though is the level of DLC and expansions that will apparently be available from the get go. What I mean is I want extra stuff for a great game but it really bothers me this model of having apparently day one DLCs and Expansions for purchase. Even if its not completely accurate, it does really feel like (because apparently it can be purchased already and may have day one availability) they will build a complete game and then shave some parts of it to sell either day one or later as "extra." Its not really an "expansion" or "DLC" when its handled this way. I'd rather have the full game released and then have a traditional later release of any so called expansions and DLC. Give customers and fans something else to look forward to adding to their game after they've had some time with it. This kind of method though really bugs the crap out of me. To my eyes it casts a chintzy light on their product which I would think publishers and especially the digital game artists would want to avoid at all costs.

I'll be happy to buy the other stuff later and hopefully cheaper but they had better not handicap the main 60 dollar title in any way, shape or form.


John 10:1-30
Romans 10:1-13

#4340972 - 02/28/17 05:04 AM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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I'm with you on that. And overly expensive DLC to try to justify ridiculously priced "season passes" gets on my nerves.


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#4340979 - 02/28/17 06:57 AM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I enjoyed that one too coop, wouldn't suggest necessarily for single though.

Great news on SoM.

#4341044 - 02/28/17 02:47 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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Entil'zha
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I think the problem is years of historical data proves that DLC/addons sell best in the first year after release. So if you want to sell more than one, you need to have say 2-4-more lined up so the final one comes out about a year after release. Wait too long and sales drop off as people uninstall the game and move on if they've finished it and there's nothing coming out for 6+ months. When it does come out, you don't bother reinstalling for it and you don't buy it.

That means you're planning them before the game is close to finished.

That means you have people working on them before the game goes gold.

That means you have fewer people working on the stock game itself, so there is less you can do in it if you want to finish it!

While I also miss the days of addons coming out well after release adding a bunch of content, the only titles that seem to do that now are RPGs. Skyrim's Dragonborn and Fallout 4's Far Harbor are two prime examples.
Otherwise, they seem to be standalone expansions, like Wolfenstein's The Old Blood or Total War Shogun 2's Fall of the Samurai.



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4341061 - 02/28/17 03:23 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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+1 Jedi

It's been my impression based on what I've seen on Steam and on SimHQ that most people play a new game for a couple of months and then drop it. Therefore it makes sense to release all DLC's while the iron is hot.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4341130 - 02/28/17 08:50 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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There is no way not to give the impression that "this stuff could've been in the main game" in that scenario. Especially with "day 1 DLC" where there is something included in the game's code but not in the stock purchase price, unless you preordered or bought the season pass already or whatever.

Really, the only metric is if YOU feel like you got good value from the initial release. There is no absolute answer.

Now if the game doesn't end, and you need to buy a DLC to see the end of the story, THAT is crap. DLC's like the ones for Far Cry 4, however, were clearly extra. It was linked to the main story but you didn't need it. People who didn't want to pay more didn't have to and still had a complete game.



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4342295 - 03/06/17 07:46 AM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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I replay games that I really enjoyed. I'm always up for more of a great game that I really enjoyed. If it comes out about a year later or even moreI can still just play that expansion or do a second playthrough of the game with the expansion to enjoy the game again only this time having the experience supplemented with the new content. I don't need to have the expansions or DLC within a year. I can wait. I can understand their fear of incurring a loss of profit if they wait too long because not every player is someone like me. It still comes off as tacky and suspect. The only way to avoid that stigma is to not do it at all and come up with a better system. Or make for darn sure that your main game is complete as is and that it is a quality product by itself, independent of anything else and that the upcoming "DLC" will be quality.


John 10:1-30
Romans 10:1-13

#4342308 - 03/06/17 11:54 AM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Coot]  
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Originally Posted by Coot
I replay games that I really enjoyed. I'm always up for more of a great game that I really enjoyed. If it comes out about a year later or even moreI can still just play that expansion or do a second playthrough of the game with the expansion to enjoy the game again only this time having the experience supplemented with the new content.



Steam has been quite an interesting experience for me because I'm always amazed whenever one of my Steam friends starts playing a game for the first time that is 5 years or older. That's pretty rare.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4342364 - 03/06/17 04:32 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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The main problem is the publishers (and some devs) want to increase the price of games (beyond the $50->$60 increase that happened several years back) but the market won't embrace it. So the answer is a la carte.

If a restaurant wants to increase revenue without increasing prices, it does it by making soup/salad extra instead of included. It reduces the number of sides from 3 to 2 or 2 to 1 so you have to pay for another. All without lowering the price for the meal.

Games are now the same way. They spend a good amount of thought on what the game will require to be considered "complete" and many things that the team thinks would be cool to add in like skins or extra equipment or supplemental missions get an extra price.

To be fair, graphics look a lot better than they used to, that means the 3D models and the texture art require more time and resources to complete than the low-res junk we got in the 90s. Then you have lighting and shaders and effects and what not, all of which take hours and hours to implement.

When games are routinely busting 20GB, it's not all taken up by a continuous recording of the outdoors, there is work in all those bytes.



MPS' F-19 cost $60 in 1989 at my local EB. Today that would be almost literally double, $117. Yet its team was a fraction of the size of these current games, it fit on 3 floppy disks IIRC, and had only a nice printed manual as a topping.
SWOTL I believe was only $50, but then released 4 more planes at $30/each! That $170 for the full game + addons in 1990 which is well over $300 today!

So for a game with a season pass to be priced at $100 today is actually pretty much the exact same model.



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4342368 - 03/06/17 04:41 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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Great post Jedi.


I really do think the Steam sales have spoiled many gamers. Most gamers just wait for a sale until they buy a new game now. This is especially true of older gamers like most of us on SimHQ who don't have as much free time as teen or college age gamers.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4342375 - 03/06/17 04:52 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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Honestly, though, Steam sales are necessary.

Pre-digital there was a set pattern for games, books, movies, music, and so on. They come out at full price and people scramble to buy them, but may have trouble getting a copy. After several months, the price drops as sales taper and supply become plentiful. Many months later, the retailers clean out inventory with dirt-cheap sales. I recall buying games in the store for $5-10 a couple of years after release. Then they vanished from the stores and you had to find a used copy or a "jewel case" value edition somewhere.

With digital, there is no supply shortage. As many who want it can buy it. However, prices never bottom out because there's no need to clear shelf space for the new. To see a 10 year old game going for $20 is really quite absurd. To see a 20 year old game for $10 is kinda pushing it. Many of those don't even run on modern systems anymore.

Look at this example: Total War Rome II. It's 3.5 years old now, and it's $60! It's another $85 to get the DLC for it! These are release prices, not what a 3 yr old game should be set at. Only in a sale at 60%+ off does it make sense to buy this now.

How about Shogun 2? It's SIX years old and it's $30. For the BASE game. Fall of the Samurai is also $30. It's $40 for the rest of the DLC. That's $100 for all the content in a 6 yr old (5 for Fall) game?? Yeah, a 6 yr old game in the late 90s was going for $5 if you could find it. Doom cost so little by the time Quake 3 Arena came out.
Digital distribution has supported the artificial elevation of prices for books, music, films, and games. Quite often there are now only two times it makes sense to buy a game--on release, at full price (where at least you get to play it when it's got the largest community around it) and much later during a mega-sale period. To wait 3 years to buy it, but then not wait for a sale, you'll find the price is down 10-15% at best...maybe not at all!



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4342384 - 03/06/17 05:22 PM Re: Shadows of Mordor sequel [Re: Raw Kryptonite]  
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Jedi, your point is still correct, but Rome II Total War Emperor Edition includes all the DLC for the $60. This is not the base game alone.

Also, Shogun 2 Collection ($50) includes all of the DLC, but does not include the Fall of the Samurai campaign (which is a stand alone expansion, not DLC).

Last edited by Bib4Tuna; 03/06/17 05:47 PM.
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