Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate This Thread
Hop To
#4327876 - 01/11/17 02:37 PM War movies and languages  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
PanzerMeyer  Online Centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
King Crimson - SimHQ's Top Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
Miami, FL USA
Continuing the trend we've had recently on SimHQ with war movies, I was wondering about a different aspect that I don't recall ever being discussed before on SimHQ to the best of my knowledge. This is the topic about which languages are used in different war movies and what works best.

For me personally, I always prefer to have the different sides of a conflict use their respective languages and thus include the appropriate subtitles. So films like Patton, Tora Tora Tora, The Longest Day and A Bridge Too Far got it right in my opinion.


While I really enjoy other war movies like The Blue Max, Paths of Glory and Cross of Iron, it does annoy me to some degree that the correct languages are not used.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#4327884 - 01/11/17 02:55 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,105
Chucky Online sosad
Veteran
Chucky  Online Sosad
Veteran

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,105
UK
Correct language and subtitles all the way here.


EV's are the Devils matchbox.
#4327885 - 01/11/17 02:55 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 49,716
Jedi Master Offline
Entil'zha
Jedi Master  Offline
Entil'zha
Sierra Hotel

Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 49,716
Space Coast, USA
I wonder if any producers ever commissioned a study to see if films with accented English, correct or not, do better than films where significant parts are subtitled in the proper language.

My guess is they did because there is a widely held belief that people don't like subtitles outside of a few phrases here or there. There is also the issue of needing to find actors who speak that language. Getting an actor who doesn't know it to try and act while speaking words they don't understand results in an inferior performance. That is why Rome was not filmed with the actors speaking Latin and subtitled.

Of course, subtitles are still vastly preferable to godawful dubbing.



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4327892 - 01/11/17 03:24 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,503
DM Offline
Senior Member
DM  Offline
Senior Member

Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,503
Prague
Yeah original language + subtitles all the way here.

In fact I like it so much, when I play Silent Hunter 3 I actually change the ingame language to German (with subtitles) to get a better "Das Boot" feel smile


"They might look the same, but they don't taste the same."
#4327894 - 01/11/17 03:37 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
PanzerMeyer  Online Centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
King Crimson - SimHQ's Top Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
Miami, FL USA
Speaking of Das Boot, I admit that the English dubbed version is quite good since the same actors did the dubbing for the most part but yeah, the original German version is still far superior.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4327904 - 01/11/17 04:08 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 4,465
Bib4Tuna Offline
I will take you to Jabba
Bib4Tuna  Offline
I will take you to Jabba
Senior Member

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 4,465
NC, USA


If the movie is good enough it might not even bother me.

The Hunt for Red October would not be the same without Connery's "Rushian akshent", and Sam Neil's character wanting to have a "trok in Montannna".

#4327905 - 01/11/17 04:20 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
PanzerMeyer  Online Centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
King Crimson - SimHQ's Top Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
Miami, FL USA
HFRO is a great film but it was all over the place with how it handled language. The scenes with the main Russian characters would be in English but the scenes with the Russian crew extras were in Russian.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4327909 - 01/11/17 04:55 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,225
No105_Archie Offline
No105_Archie  Offline

Veteran

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,225
N. Atlantic east of Canada
I like the regional language with subtitles as well.......but a villain speaking with a 'posh' English accent somehow feels right as well smile


Archie Smythe

carpe diem
#4327911 - 01/11/17 05:01 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: No105_Archie]  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
PanzerMeyer  Online Centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
King Crimson - SimHQ's Top Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
Miami, FL USA
Originally Posted By: No105_Archie
but a villain speaking with a 'posh' English accent somehow feels right as well smile


I've noticed how the villain never has like a heavy Cockney accent or a Yorkshire accent. Why is that?


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4327915 - 01/11/17 05:49 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,534
Alicatt Offline
Hotshot
Alicatt  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,534
Ice Cold in Alex or Eating in ...
OV en ondertitels thumbsup

the double set of Flags of our fathers and Letters from Iwo Jima would not be the same without the original language.

One thing I'm waiting for is to get Assassin's Creed on Blu Ray so I can get the English subtitles for the Spanish sections smile


Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4327917 - 01/11/17 06:01 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,105
Chucky Online sosad
Veteran
Chucky  Online Sosad
Veteran

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,105
UK
Tarantino uses quite a few native speakers in his films. Inglorious Basterds was very good as was Kill Bill although I'm wondering if Thurman did a good job with her Japanese or not. The Man from Okinawa is my favourite chapter in Kill Bill.


EV's are the Devils matchbox.
#4327919 - 01/11/17 06:08 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: Chucky]  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
PanzerMeyer  Online Centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
King Crimson - SimHQ's Top Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
Miami, FL USA
Originally Posted By: Chucky
The Man from Okinawa is my favourite chapter in Kill Bill.
Is that the one where Uma goes to have her custom sword made?


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4327926 - 01/11/17 06:25 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 24,712
Dart Offline
Measured in Llamathrusts
Dart  Offline
Measured in Llamathrusts
Lifer

Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 24,712
Alabaster, AL USA
Well, can anyone imagine John Wayne trying to speak German in The Sea Chase? Good grief, even for non-German speakers it would sound like John Wayne trying to speak German.

Hell, he didn't even try for a German accent.

Or Chinese. God, I'd love to watch Blood Alley with John Wayne butchering Chinese with his inflection and cadence.

So sometimes it's better to have the actors speak like they normally do, and to hell with accents and different languages.

That said, if it's done right, I prefer normal languages where there are two or more. If it's all on one side, English is okay, as since I'm viewing it from their perspective I should know their language.

It's the same reason I snort at the idea that putting English labels in foreign cockpits within sims is wrong. I'd bet the German pilots in their FW-190's could read the labels. Why make it so I can't?


The opinions of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

More dumb stuff at http://www.darts-page.com

From Laser:
"The forum is the place where combat (real time) flight simulator fans come to play turn based strategy combat."
#4327927 - 01/11/17 06:30 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,105
Chucky Online sosad
Veteran
Chucky  Online Sosad
Veteran

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,105
UK
Originally Posted By: PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted By: Chucky
The Man from Okinawa is my favourite chapter in Kill Bill.
Is that the one where Uma goes to have her custom sword made?


Yup.I like the fighting scenes but that sushi bar one I just love. I think that scene introduced me to Sonny Chiba. Never knew of the guy.


EV's are the Devils matchbox.
#4328021 - 01/12/17 01:33 AM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 26,557
wheelsup_cavu Offline
Lifer
wheelsup_cavu  Offline
Lifer

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 26,557
Corona, California
As long as their are subtitles in the movie I don't mind when they speak in their native language. Without the subtitles I definitely want English to be the only language spoken.


Wheels


Cheers wave
Wheelsup_cavu

Mission4Today (Campaigns, Missions, and Skins for IL-2)
Planes of Fame Air Museum | March Field Air Museum | Palm Springs Air Museum
#4328100 - 01/12/17 02:30 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: Dart]  
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 49,716
Jedi Master Offline
Entil'zha
Jedi Master  Offline
Entil'zha
Sierra Hotel

Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 49,716
Space Coast, USA
Originally Posted By: Dart
Or Chinese. God, I'd love to watch Blood Alley with John Wayne butchering Chinese with his inflection and cadence.


Ni hao, pilgrim! Xie xie!



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4328281 - 01/13/17 08:47 AM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,586
kaa Offline
Senior Member
kaa  Offline
Senior Member

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,586
France
Originally Posted By: PanzerMeyer
Speaking of Das Boot, I admit that the English dubbed version is quite good since the same actors did the dubbing for the most part but yeah, the original German version is still far superior.


With some political correctness : I remember Frenzen's fart becoming Frenzen's feet in the English version !


"Anyone can shoot you down if you don't see him coming but it takes a wonderfully good Hun to bag a Camel if you're expecting him."
Tom Cundall.
#4328306 - 01/13/17 12:22 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,876
Immermann Offline
SimHQ's resident fire enthusiast.
Immermann  Offline
SimHQ's resident fire enthusiast.
Member

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,876
Lule/Norrbotten/Sweden
I prefer subtitles. All foreign movies are shown with subtitles in Sweden.
Only children's movies and TV shows are dubbed.


"When I saw The Matrix at a local theatre in Slovenia, I had the unique opportunity of sitting close to the ideal spectator of the film - namely, to an idiot." - Slavoj Zizek
#4328308 - 01/13/17 12:24 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
PanzerMeyer  Online Centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
King Crimson - SimHQ's Top Poster

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 121,386
Miami, FL USA
I really love the film "Waterloo" and I think Rod Steiger was just amazing as Napoleon. The only thing missing is the correct spoken language. smile


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4328310 - 01/13/17 12:50 PM Re: War movies and languages [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,534
Alicatt Offline
Hotshot
Alicatt  Offline
Hotshot

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,534
Ice Cold in Alex or Eating in ...
A lot of the TV programs we get here are in an other language with subtitles, I picked up reading Dutch from reading the subtitles while listening to the spoken word. The only thing now is, occasionally I will shout out "he never said that..." sometimes it can really spoil the meaning of what was said or the intent of what was said.

One frequently occurring mistake is the way numbers are said or written, in English we say "twenty four", in Dutch we say "four and twenty", so the writers of the subtitles often get it mixed up and the dates times etc. are written wrong.


Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron

Moderated by  RacerGT 

Quick Search
Recent Articles
Support SimHQ

If you shop on Amazon use this Amazon link to support SimHQ
.
Social


Recent Topics
Carnival Cruise Ship Fire....... Again
by F4UDash4. 03/26/24 05:58 PM
Baltimore Bridge Collapse
by F4UDash4. 03/26/24 05:51 PM
The Oldest WWII Veterans
by F4UDash4. 03/24/24 09:21 PM
They got fired after this.
by Wigean. 03/20/24 08:19 PM
Grown ups joke time
by NoFlyBoy. 03/18/24 10:34 PM
Anyone Heard from Nimits?
by F4UDash4. 03/18/24 10:01 PM
RIP Gemini/Apollo astronaut Tom Stafford
by semmern. 03/18/24 02:14 PM
10 years after 3/8/2014
by NoFlyBoy. 03/17/24 10:25 AM
Copyright 1997-2016, SimHQ Inc. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0