We are supporting an BN size attack with scouting/screening. We have 1 light(2 Luchs) and one heavy Recon team(2 Leopard 1A5 and 2x Luchs) Great work by the recon team leaders...was a fun mission. Ah, and the combat units also won their battles ;-)
Enjoyed viewing that Ronin The weather effects were very atmospheric What happened with the friendly fire incident did the call sign responsible think he was firing at a BTR.
First i have to say these where very good shots!! Hitting a mover in such weather conditions at over 2800m is an achievenent...bugger it hit the wrong target. Yeah...4 wheels, rain, blurry TIS picture...#%&*$# happens esp when the SA is not perfect.
First i have to say these where very good shots!! Hitting a mover in such weather conditions at over 2800m is an achievenent...bugger it hit the wrong target. Yeah...4 wheels, rain, blurry TIS picture...#%&*$# happens esp when the SA is not perfect.
Indeed, an easy mistake to make especially looking through a thermal sight at that range. The Silhouette of the BTR and the luchs are very similar.
KNOWING that friendly eight-wheeled vehicles are forward of your position ...
KNOWING that thermals give a less than perfect picture ...
KNOWING that a Luchs can easily be mistaken as a BTR (or a Piranha, or an XA 360, or...)
Even IF assuming the worst, a BTR at 2km range doesn't pose a threat big enough to warrant a dubious engagement because "you couldn't afford waiting for better ID". I'm all for going easy on people making honest mistakes - but here it simply was bad judgement by a trigger-happy player.
KNOWING that friendly eight-wheeled vehicles are forward of your position ...
KNOWING that thermals give a less than perfect picture ...
KNOWING that a Luchs can easily be mistaken as a BTR (or a Piranha, or an XA 360, or...)
Even IF assuming the worst, a BTR at 2km range doesn't pose a threat big enough to warrant a dubious engagement because "you couldn't afford waiting for better ID". I'm all for going easy on people making honest mistakes - but here it simply was bad judgement by a trigger-happy player.
May be its time to start simulating ID/IFF panels in game. Yes following stricter rules of engagement mite also reduce to risk of friendly fire incidents.
#4296289 - 09/15/1606:05 AMRe: Recon at work (Steelbeast Video)
[Re: Ssnake]
KNOWING that friendly eight-wheeled vehicles are forward of your position ...
KNOWING that thermals give a less than perfect picture ...
KNOWING that a Luchs can easily be mistaken as a BTR (or a Piranha, or an XA 360, or...)
Even IF assuming the worst, a BTR at 2km range doesn't pose a threat big enough to warrant a dubious engagement because "you couldn't afford waiting for better ID". I'm all for going easy on people making honest mistakes - but here it simply was bad judgement by a trigger-happy player.
A couple of counterarguemenr: -had this been a training-ex-sim, I'd have some harsh words for the soldier. As we where playing... -he was a first time player. I bet he will not make that mistake again...this shows the value of SB as training tool!!! -We've got to cut the players some slack here. After all, SB's AI would not hesitate to take even more obscure shots. Therefor players are more on their heels...and if in doubt, shoot quickly
Sure... in GAMES sh!t like this happens, and it's okay to happen. In training, it may happen once, and would then be a talking point during the AAR. In real life - not good.
Now, confession time: I have secretly been waiting for this incident since when I was at tank platoon leader's course (early 1990s) when I created a decision-making exercise for the rest of the class showing an eight-wheeled green and black (pseudo-)thermal slide in crosshairs for two seconds, then asking "Shoot or no shoot?", within the context of a rearward passage of lines of armored recce in hot pursuit by a motorized rifle regiment, with predictably split opinions. When adding the Luchs to Steel Beasts, I knews that it was only a matter of time until this would happen.
Well hopefully one day we can see the opposit effect in SB too. That I have a reasonable chance to drive by the enemy T-80(AI control) and get trough with "wave and smile" because he mistakes me for a BTR.
Must be a tough call to make in a real world situation shot or not to modern sights/thermals can spot targets far beyond ID range while playing SB i have often fired at a dot at 3000 plus No way to ID it at that range. but if you don't shot you can be sure the Opfor tank will. A few seconds can mean the difference between life and death in a real world combat situation Add the fact your probably be tired stressed its a call I would not like to make.
I agree that an overly observant and accurate computer-controlled force creates undue "evolutionary pressure" to shoot first, if in doubt. It certainly is something that we should work on. Unfortunately it's one of the things that have very deep roots in very old code, and you have the potential to break a lot of things if you touch these issues. But that hasn't stopped us in the past from doing what's necessary, and I hope it never will.
