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#4269957 - 06/14/16 11:12 AM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Hi John,

Sounds good to me as I will have to alter the bridges for Kuma and Sendai anyway. As I mentioned earlier, just like everybody else the Japanese modified their ships as the war went on, usually adding more AA guns, sometimes at the expense of the main armament, and bridges changed as well. I have no idea what "period" each of the PAW ships is modelled on so adjustments may be required on most if not all of them to get June 1942 condition (assuming I can find the correct details of course). I also mentioned the problem with measuring length - sources can quote any or all of waterline, overall and between perpendiculars and beam is at the widest point along the hull, supposedly including overhangs, so a meter here or there does not bother me. Given how few Japanese ships survived the war I am not sure how accurate the published dimensions are anyway. I have managed to aquire a cheap model of a Sendai class from E Bay (albeit in pre-war condition with what seems to be a Dave floatplane) so that will help me visualise the layout better in conjunction with the line drawings and photos/profiles. Let me know if you want accurate dimensions for the other PAW ships as and when we come to them - maybe some of them are correct?

Pete


With increasing age should come wisdom and tolerance, but as the saying goes, "there is no fool like an old fool" as I prove regularly!

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#4269960 - 06/14/16 11:29 AM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Re scaling, I think I had a double take when I did the carrier models and had to do substantial re-scaling upward.

Last edited by Moggy; 06/14/16 11:30 AM.
#4269965 - 06/14/16 12:16 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Thanks for confirming the scale issue.

I have a nearly 100% converted Shoho model.

Anyone fancy trying to skin it?


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#4270099 - 06/14/16 07:13 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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John,

For the record Shoho was sunk at the Coral Sea just before Midway but her identical sister Zuiho was at Midway and as far as I know was still in the standard IJN carrier colour scheme - waterline brick red, all other metal IJN dark grey including lifts. Deck natural wood - pale yellowish brown. Fantail red and white stripes fore and aft, usual white landing deck markings. It may or may not have had a large Hinomaru on the forward deck like Hiryu - don't know. I probably have a pic somewhere of Shoho at Coral Sea,if anybody wants it. Problems at home mean I have little time at the moment so even if I knew how I cannot offer to do it, bur perhaps in a month or too depending on how well I learn!

Pete


With increasing age should come wisdom and tolerance, but as the saying goes, "there is no fool like an old fool" as I prove regularly!

#4270262 - 06/15/16 11:05 AM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Just for the fun of it I've converted the IJN Destroyer model, and after a lot of looking about I found a card model of the IJN Uranami, which is the same as the PAW model, and provides a ready made skin.

The model is again about half as big as it should be, so there is a scale issue with the PAW models. Fortunately resizing is not a problem as only Normals are effected.


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#4270272 - 06/15/16 11:35 AM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Hi John,

All the Japanese destroyer types at Midway were either Fubukis like Uranami, or later derivatives. There were a few differences in armament and funnel size etc but nothing to worry about. Later on they produced another 3 types which were considerably different but they are not relevant to this scenario. I wish the US destroyers were that easy!

Pete


With increasing age should come wisdom and tolerance, but as the saying goes, "there is no fool like an old fool" as I prove regularly!

#4270279 - 06/15/16 12:11 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Hi Peter.

As most of this class ended up at the bottom of the Coral Sea, and in the seas off Guadalcanal, I thought this class would do for starters.

I have a model of a similar ship, the IJN Yukikaze, which I can use to convert the IJN Uranami into.


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#4270311 - 06/15/16 02:01 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Moggy. Can you make an easy to find place, where Peter and me can place our ship models, to see how they in game?

Mine has 4 models, and Peter has 5, but it doesn't matter what you call the 3dz's. We can rename as requried.


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#4270330 - 06/15/16 03:15 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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John,

For the record, launched in 1927 the Fubiki was the first of the "special type" destroyers, and was followed by a further 6 classes all of which were basically the same - a total of 88 ships. Uranami was a "true" Fubuki but Yukikaze was one of the Kagero class which was the 5th follow on series with a few differences - some people regard it as a new design. Not sure why you would want to convert Uranami to Yukikaze?
The earliest 3 groups had 3 triple 24" torpedo tubes, but all the later ones including Yukikaze had 2 quad mounts so the deck layout is quite a bit different.

Pete

#4270352 - 06/15/16 04:23 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Because I have textures and drawings, it's easy to work one from the other, and then we have two different ships for the price of one. biggrin

Here is where I am. The front deck is from the card model: The rear deck was based on a drawing I found, I like the model textures.



The 3dz model is not wide enough and the bow shape is wrong so I might do a bit of tinkering with the model.


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#4270366 - 06/15/16 05:21 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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I can let you have the 129 setup of the revised Midway as it currently stands. You could then drop the models in at any of the Japanese target locations.

#4270377 - 06/15/16 05:43 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Hi Moggy,

As long as you tell me how to find a target, and what file names to use that will do fine.

I have 1.29, so just send the target files. smile


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#4270459 - 06/15/16 09:02 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Hi John,

That is a pretty good Kagero class as built and as Yukikaze would have been at Midway, except for a few missing AA guns. By late 43 the survivors had "C" 5" turret removed and replaced with more AA. Frankly, as this is not a ship sim the AA guns are not really physically necessary to my mind as it will make them a lot easier to model and they can be included in the "software" for AA fire I guess. The only other things missing seem to be the foremast, the various ships boats (lifeboats, launches etc)and the prominent torpedo shields that will need looking at I suggest - more anon as I have detailed scale drawings somewhere..

The only puzzling thing, and it might be an optical illusion, is why the reddish brown linoleum covering on the wooden part of the deck is darker on the forward part of the ship or is that perhaps because you have mixed 2 models I wonder? The detail of the linoleum is excellent. It was glued down in strips running side to side - on cruisers the strips were 6' 6" wide I believe but I am not sure about destroyers. The gaps were then filled with tar and covered with brass strips so the representation here is perfect at the front with the yellow lines, less so at the back. Obviously it faded in use but that at the front was about the starting colour according to Osprey Profiles. You are right about Japanese bow shapes, they were somewhat different to those of other countries being variations on the "clipper" bow. Some curved steadily back from the deck to the waterline (Light Cruisers mostly) whilst others only curved back for the top quarter/third or so and then were almost perpendicular. Most other countries either curved steadily forward from the waterline, or at least were a straight forward leaning diagonal at say 20 or 30 degrees if you get my meaning.


Fubuki early and late.Note triple tubes and shields.


Kagero as built, late version had same changes as Fubuki. Note thinner rear funnel and quad tubes with shields, and also torpedo reload houses shown as slightly diagonal structures so tubes could be swung roung and fish slid in.

Cheers

Pete

#4270490 - 06/15/16 10:13 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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This is the GA I'm working too, and so far the PAW model as way too short! I'm shifting things around to match the drawings, and model textures.



As you can see, these card models are very detailed!







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#4270739 - 06/16/16 04:42 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: Col. Gibbon]  
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Hi John,

Impressive. I have a Polish Naval series of books with scale plans, showing all the individual components such as all the deckhouses,guns, tubes etc, which looks like your card model in many ways. Your model of the Fubuki Class has three triple 24" TT without shield, which is correct but most of the later classes had quads with shields so some mods called for. The Fubuki wil do fine and so will the Kagero class as there were I believe 11 "straight" Fubukis and a dozen Kageros at Midway, together with 4 Yugumos which were a virtual repeat Kagero. There were also 2 Hatsuhara, 10 Shiratsuyu and 8 Asashio which were Fubuki derivatives with various changes.

A perfectionist would no doubt modify for each class but as I said before this is not a ship sim so either or both of the Fubuki and Kagero would suffice for me - perhaps better ask Moggy what he wants as it is his scenario.

Pete


With increasing age should come wisdom and tolerance, but as the saying goes, "there is no fool like an old fool" as I prove regularly!

#4270753 - 06/16/16 05:18 PM Re: Multi Part Ships [Re: PeterMBooth]  
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Did you check out the links I sent you? smile


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