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#4193938 - 11/13/15 09:47 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Naunton Beauchamp Worcestershi...
Probably, as in my image above in the Fort. Probably dampened it would be extra effective and drastically reduce the kinetic energy of a shot coming the other way.

The back end of that last image from Flats does look like a Willy, or am I being weird?



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#4194176 - 11/13/15 10:00 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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WolfDancer - not quite, but very close ... thumbsup

BD-123 - yes, you're being weird .. or perverted .. or both .. neaner If you want a second opinion on Willys, Chucky's your man ... hahaha

Any other guesses?

#4194511 - 11/14/15 09:08 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Ice Cold in Alex or Eating in ...
Originally Posted By: FlatEric
Chucky, please - no pictures of 'Willie', little or otherwise ..!! hahaha

Well I'm not Chucky, and I can't top the VC guns... but I do have a Meg, Mons Meg, she was a bit of a big bore when she was younger





Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4195006 - 11/16/15 09:43 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Alicatt - awesome! Thanks for sharing. My mum is from Edinburgh, so I have many memories playing in and around the Castle in my early years. Isn't Mons Meg one of the biggest guns by calibre in the world - 20 inches if I remember correctly?

WolfDancer, BD-123 - thanks for having a guess. You were both very close.

It’s one of the first known examples of a land-based ‘gun shield’, designed to protect the gunners from enemy fire. It was used by the Russians in the Crimean War – here’s a photograph of it in situ:



There's also a representation of it in this diorama (from a Canadian museum, I think):

http://wpmedia.o.canada.com/2014/03/fisher-3.jpg

Also from that era, and design specifically for the Crimean War as a siege weapon, is this 36 inch mortar shell. It was made in 1857:



Unfortunately for the designer (fortunately for the participants!), the Crimean War ended in 1856!

#4195376 - 11/17/15 03:21 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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A land-based 'gun shield'. That's why I couldn't find any examples of it on wooden ships! An enjoyable challenge nonetheless, FlatEric.


War is the continuation of natural selection by other means.
#4195452 - 11/17/15 11:33 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Naunton Beauchamp Worcestershi...
Good grief Flatters, that would give on a headache no doubt. Did you see the actual mortar?
I read that 'each test ended with damage to the mortar itself'. I'm not surprised.

Family story; my wife's Grandfather said that you could see 'Moanin Minnies' trench mortar shells coming over with their slow speed and high trajectory. Running down the trench away from predicted fall he ran full tilt in a Tommy coming the other way round a revetment and severely gashed the bridge of his nose on the rim of the other chaps helmet giving him a few days respite from the front in a Field hospital.
Where he met Molly, his future wife.
On reflection he quipped, he would of been better off at the Front.



#4195455 - 11/17/15 11:39 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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WolfDancer - you're welcome smile

Last few curios from the Firepower Museum:

Dragon Gun – think this may be from Burma (rather than China), but I could be wrong:






Selection of muzzle loaders:


Selection of breach loaders:


A seventeenth century Falconet. This gun is typical of the light field gun used during the English Civil War and is mounted on its original carriage. It’s unusual in that the gun has no main axle and is decorated with wrought iron motifs. As a weapon it was probably used to snipe at individuals in the enemy ranks. ‘Falconet’ was a loose classification for guns of around 2 inch calibre.





Early medieval rocket launcher:


Congreve rockets. William Congreve developed a system of rockets with ranges up to 1,800m. They were used in the battles of Leipzig and Waterloo, and also by the Royal Navy to bombard Baltimore in 1812. This apparently inspired the words in Frances Scott Keys “The Star Spangled Banner”, later adopted as the American National Anthem.


Models:




This model is of a contraption designed to assess the power of a gun by measuring both it’s recoil (right hand side) and the impact of its projectile (left hand side):


MGR-1 ‘Honest John’ rocket was the first nuclear-capable surface-to-surface missile in the US arsenal. In the British Army, Honest John was used to equip three missile regiments. It was replaced by 1975 with the MGM-52 Lance nuclear armed missile.


M107 as used in 'Desert Storm - The Empire Strikes Back' ...hahaha (forgot to post this in the ‘Cold War’ part of this thread):






FV 610 armoured command post (ACP), a variant of the Alvis Saracen armoured personnel carrier. This one has been kitted out with speakers on the front wings (fenders?) – presumably an adaption for use in Northern Ireland:




And that’s all folks. If you get the chance, I’d highly recommend a visit; otherwise I hope you’ve enjoyed this ‘virtual tour’.


#4195457 - 11/17/15 11:47 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Originally Posted By: FlatEric
Alicatt - awesome! Thanks for sharing. My mum is from Edinburgh, so I have many memories playing in and around the Castle in my early years. Isn't Mons Meg one of the biggest guns by calibre in the world - 20 inches if I remember correctly?

Yes, she is about 20" (520mm)

I'm from a bit north of Glasgow myself, and that was my second visit to Edinburgh Castle, I can barely remember my first visit!

Looking down the barrel of the gun you can see the lines of the iron staves she was made from. There was three of them made around the same time, Mons Meg, Dulle Griet, and the third has been lost in France.

Dulle Griet (Mad Meg - rough translation) is in Ghent, I must look out for her the next time I'm up that way. She is also of slightly larger calibre than Meg at 660mm firing a projectile that was almost twice the weight.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dulle_Griet


Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4195458 - 11/17/15 11:53 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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BD-123, thanks for sharing that personal history. So you owe your existence to a German soldier firing a Moanin' Minnie at your grandfather? Thank goodness for Germans .. biggrin

No, they didn't have the actual mortar on display at the Museum, just the mortar shell. There are some images on Wikipedia of one of the last surviving examples (at Fort Nelson, Portsmouth):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mallet's_Mortar

#4195460 - 11/17/15 11:55 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Thank you FlatEric for sharing your visit, I've thoroughly enjoyed your pictures and the information with them.

Looking forward to your next outing smile


Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4195462 - 11/17/15 12:00 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Alicatt, interesting stuff. I certainly wouldn't like to have been on the receiving end of any of that trio!

Would be fun to see them fired though attack biggrin

#4195465 - 11/17/15 12:07 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Originally Posted By: FlatEric
Alicatt, interesting stuff. I certainly wouldn't like to have been on the receiving end of any of that trio!

Would be fun to see them fired though attack biggrin
That it would! Meg is still fired with a small pyrotechnic charge on special occasions


Not Meg but at a cannon at Amersfoort in the Netherlands, using 25g (about 1oz) of blackpowder and a polystyrene ball.



Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4195835 - 11/18/15 12:08 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Naunton Beauchamp Worcestershi...
'So you owe your existence to a German soldier firing a Moanin' Minnie at your grandfather?'

No, it was my wife's grandfather...so I owe him my 35 years of happiness married to his Grandaughter ........honest.

'Thank goodness for Germans ..'
Yes indeed, thanks to the actions of the Luftwaffe, whilst the slight damage to the roof of my Mother's house in East Ham was being repaired, (damage due probably more to the reverberations from the AA battery at Waltham Flats than the land mine that fell at the end of the road). She moved in with an aunt at Epping where she met this dashing young Despatch Rider at a Valentine's Dance in 1941.



#4196564 - 11/20/15 02:43 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Cool pictures, thanks for sharing. smile


Wheels


Cheers wave
Wheelsup_cavu

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Planes of Fame Air Museum | March Field Air Museum | Palm Springs Air Museum
#4200471 - 11/29/15 07:31 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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The FirePower museum is due to close first week of July 2016 (the closure date has always been pencilled in as 1st July but as it is the centenary of the first day of the Somme, they've knocked back closure to a week later)

Due to the museum winding up all the outbuildings have been closed completely to the public (Building 41/Cold War Gallery) since August, So no Green Mace, Garrington etc anymore. The one exception is the Burmese Gun (the painted dragon head) this has been moved into the main museum so can be seen now.

I've been informed the family history side/research is closing in February as the Archive has to be moved to Larkhill, the Royal Artillery headquarters. So anyone wanting to look into the Royal Artillery Archive should do that before then, as there will be no access for the rest of the year (2016) and beyond.

The Museum was due to reopen in Larkhill in 2020 in a purpose built centre, but three things have delayed this.
1) the council in Wiltshire seem even less happy about having the museum than Greenwich and turned down the planning permission.
2) the museum has lost its National Lottery funding
3) the Artillery land that the museum was to be built on is now being used for a new officers quarters.

There will be a small "Heritage" Quarter on the Arsenal site but its not expected to house a museum of any kind, the Military Academy building, one of the oldest military academy's (est 1716) has already been rebranded as the Academy of Performing Arts, and is being used as a dance and acting school.

I'll have to post some pics I have that may add to the already excellent posts previously.

Last edited by cacabolsa; 11/29/15 07:41 PM.
#4200861 - 11/30/15 05:22 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Hi cacabolsa,
thanks for the update on the closure of the Museum. I must make an effort to visit again before it finally closes - so sad frown

Please feel free to add some of your own pics to this thread - would be great to see them smile

#4201234 - 12/01/15 11:34 AM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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A pic that somes up the sad state of affairs, A statue of the Duke of Wellington.



This statue was commisioned for the Tower Of London when the Duke of Wellington was the commanding officer there in the 1830s (i believe). When the Duke died it was moved to Woolwich behind the entrance to the Beresford gate (main enterance of Munitions site) so in ww1 100,000 workers would have shuffled past this statue.

In 2003 Berkeley Homes won the contract to turn the remainder of the munitions site into blocks of flats, the statue didn't fit into their vision. They decided the ideal spot to lose the statue, was on top of their multi-story car park in a garden no one knows is there.

Moving from the dockside to the top of the car park the statue loses a hand, and all the fingers on the other hand no one knows where the hand is or where it went, the Duke now looks like Nelson!

In the guide to the museum they have a picture of the statue from the 1970s aged 140+ years old with all arms, hands and fingers intact. This is how we now treat historic artefacts.



Last edited by cacabolsa; 12/01/15 12:10 PM.
#4201242 - 12/01/15 12:05 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Here are some pictures of Woolwich docks, the second Royal dock after Portsmouth, built by Henry VIII in 1511.

It's a dilapedated shell that next to no-one knows is there, but here the ships that made our empire were built there for over 300 years, from the great Harry (Henry VIIIs flagship) to the Soverign of the Seas (Charles I flagship) to HMS Beagle (the last great ship built here) - theres no signs or information displays to say what there two dry docks are.

Woolwich docks are the reason cannons first came to Woolwich, firstly to protect the Royal dock and then just logistically the Ordanace was moved from the Tower of London to the Arsenal.

Woolwich docks were where the Mary Rose was infamously refited in 1536 (when Henry VIII had a bit of money after dissolving the monastries, but had upset the Catholic Church and needed a Navy quick), taking canons from the Great Harry and overloading the Mary Rose, subsequently causing it to be to top heavy and capsising in the Solent.





John Deane a diver from Woolwich discovered the Mary Rose in 1836 while taking Royal Engineer cadets from the Royal Academy Woolwich on a diving expedition to find the Wreck of the Royal Oak (another ship built in Woolwich docks that sank in the solent) This is his watercolour of the canon he salvaged from the wreck that now sits in the Firepower museum.






Last edited by cacabolsa; 12/01/15 12:09 PM.
#4201341 - 12/01/15 04:30 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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Naunton Beauchamp Worcestershi...
Most interesting Cacabolsa; didn't know there was still a dock in London that has not been turned into a prestigious development or marina!
I presume in such a crowded residential area it would be difficult to develop as a tourist attraction such as has been conceived around the Royal Armouries basin in Leeds.



#4206254 - 12/15/15 04:28 PM Re: Firepower Museum - Royal Woolwich Arsenal [Re: FlatEric]  
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A Trophy gun seized in the French defeat at Malplaquet in 1709 by the Duke of Marlborough.

John Churchill, The Duke of Malborough, lost command of the British army after this his last victory due in part to his ill treatment of his infantry, literally using them as canon fodder, he had the supperior forces and happily sacrificed thousands to win.

Previous victories by the Duke were Mons and Tournai obviously two names associated strongly with WW1, and Malplaquet itself was the site of the battle of Le Catteau in 1914 as the BEF retreated from Mons.


Inscription in Latin says Designed by Figar Augustin, Made in Douai in 1704 by Berenger de Falice.


Last edited by cacabolsa; 12/15/15 11:25 PM.
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