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#4166534 - 09/08/15 08:07 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: RSColonel_131st]  
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Chamot Offline
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I've upgraded my ancient first generation i7 from Windows 7 within the first week of release and I've had two issues that combine to cause a real problem for gaming.

1. My controllers in the USB game controllers list get jumbled up with every reboot. This turns out to be a real issue for games that (I assume) read controller and button numbers as reported by DirectX like 'joy1' or 'button25'. I assume many people here have multiple controllers and I was wondering if anyone else encountered this problem.

2. I can't fix my previous issue easily by disconnecting and reconnecting to a different port because of a weird catastrophic system issue (basically only the keyboard works afterwards) that is associated with Saitek drivers. My issue may be the Saitek drivers, which apparently was fixed for Saitek HOTAS products with a new driver, but I have Saitek Pedals which didn't get a new driver. I'm not sure though. This also causes issues with non simulation games where I need to disconnect my controllers, like Unity games that seemingly always pick a random axis on a random controller as movement input.

Still, apart from the terrible email application, I kind of like Windows 10.

Originally Posted By: RSColonel_131st
Was Mantle meant like an alternative to DX, so for example like OpenGL? Now there's also talk of "Vulcan"... headache inducing stuff.

Whatever comes out of this might have significant meaning of games for Linux and Mac, however. Main reason for so many devs sticking with Windows would be relative ease of DX graphics coding. A new API, basically a monster OpenGL that works on most platforms with the same calls could really drive cross-development.


Mantle was basically that - AMD's attempt to bring their console experience to remove obstacles in D3D to better performance in a new alternative API, and furthermore an attempt to catch up with nVidia utilizing new software to bypass their driver and/or hardware deficiencies in DX11. My understanding is, its main virtue was less work required by the CPU, and less work that GPU needs to wait for the CPU to do. AMD seems to have failed in pushing it but I suspect they've had a lot of input in the development of DX12 and the influence of Mantle has succeeded for a more efficient DX12, I'd guess. Vulkan is the successor to OpenGL and is said to be largely based on Mantle, which was given to Khronos group by AMD.

Last edited by Chamot; 09/08/15 08:23 PM.
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#4166535 - 09/08/15 08:10 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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RSColonel_131st Offline
Lifer
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Thanks for the details Chamot. Now it all makes a bit more sense.

#4166797 - 09/09/15 02:28 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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Entil'zha
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Entil'zha
Sierra Hotel

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I would never experience #1 as I never leave anything connected to my PC but my mouse and kb. smile
I plug in the stick/HOTAS/wheel when I need it, calibrate it, play whatever game(s), then disconnect it when I'm done. Don't have the room to leave them connected while I'm not using them, tangle/trip/snap the wires!




The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4177199 - 10/04/15 07:36 AM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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OldHat Offline
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I managed to save some coin over the past several months and gutted my system to replace the video card, CPU, Motherboard and RAM. Then I went ahead and installed windows 10 (clean install) with the new hardware in place. I read that skylake and windows 10 are a match made in heaven due to a deal between intel and M$. I wanted to see it for myself if that is true.

Well, after my upgrade from Sandybridge to Skylake, I have to somewhat agree with the OP of this thread. In its current form, Windows 10 doesn't play right with various drivers and caused me some frustrating game crashes. On the other hand, Windows 7 JUST WORKS RIGHT with everything I throw at it without any hiccups or bugs.

IMHO, Windows 10 is a great OS, period. It has the potential to surpass Windows 7 in every way, but its stability is not there yet. So, I will eventually upgrade to Windows 10 after most of the bugs are ironed out and they remove that spying software inside it. Until then, I have no regrets going back to Windows 7.

#4177507 - 10/05/15 08:59 AM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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Chucky Offline
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Despite my early hostility to 10 (the keyboard issue is still there but I got around it) I am now running it full-time on my main laptop.It's good but I did turn off a lot of the features.A clean install is the best way to go.

As for games,I only really play Elite:Dangerous,World of Tanks/Warships and they are fine.


EV's are the Devils matchbox.
#4177647 - 10/05/15 03:16 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: OldHat]  
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Entil'zha
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Originally Posted By: OldHat
Well, after my upgrade from Sandybridge to Skylake, I have to somewhat agree with the OP of this thread. In its current form, Windows 10 doesn't play right with various drivers and caused me some frustrating game crashes. On the other hand, Windows 7 JUST WORKS RIGHT with everything I throw at it without any hiccups or bugs.



What kind of performance increase did you see? What was your GPU upgrade?
I'm still Sandy Bridging it and I'm going to upgrade my GTX 770 video card soon, but I was wondering about the CPU side and if it was time or if I could get some more mileage out of it.




The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4177707 - 10/05/15 05:53 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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Well, I'll recap what I had upgraded...

Went from a 580 (2011)/680 GTX 2gb (2012) -> 290x (2014) -> 980 Ti (2015), then from a 2500K (2011) to a 6700K (2015).

From the 580 -> 290x there was a small to moderate increase in performance with the same AA/AF/AO/etc... settings. Then the 980 upgrade gave great performance increase as well as graphic quality.... BUT only in 3+ year old games. Recent game titles (2015) showed little gain.

It's only when I upgraded to the 6700K is where I feel that I can play any game on earth at its max settings without breaking a sweat... simply amazing performance! Compared to Sandybridge, Skylake is a BEAST and there's no doubt about it. IMHO overclocking is good for benchmarks, but no real world benefit like a hardware upgrade for sure.

Now, I'm guessing that the 980 Ti also helps a bit more than the 290x would have, but I'm not going to compare at this point and just take it as it is.

Also, Windows 10 + 980 Ti + Skylake and that's one unstoppable combination that will be hard to beat at least for another 3+ years.

#4177813 - 10/05/15 08:35 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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Entil'zha
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Sierra Hotel

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The 980Ti certainly blows away a 290x in what it's capable of, but as you noticed if the CPU can't feed it you won't see it. Obviously the 2500k couldn't, so now I know I will definitely need to upgrade to a 6x00 when finances allow.



The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4177907 - 10/06/15 12:32 AM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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rezerekted Offline
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Microsoft have blocked Securom/Safedisk on Win10 due to security issues. That is why their own game FS2004 won't run on their own OS Win10. All the DRM apologists can eat their crow now. I saw one post on RPS comments section claim it was our fault for buying games with DRM. Like we had a choice in the matter. <roll eyes>

#4178065 - 10/06/15 11:22 AM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rezerekted]  
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Originally Posted By: rezerekted
Microsoft have blocked Securom/Safedisk on Win10 due to security issues. That is why their own game FS2004 won't run on their own OS Win10. All the DRM apologists can eat their crow now. I saw one post on RPS comments section claim it was our fault for buying games with DRM. Like we had a choice in the matter. <roll eyes>


You can open a command prompt as an admin, type in "sc start secdrv" and it works again. If you want it stopped, "sc stop secdrv".

The SecureRom driver is junk and unsafe. I don't blame Microsoft for disabling it by default. But it's a problem you can get around quickly.

And they also pushed updates to both Windows 7 and 8, disabling SecureRom.

#4178087 - 10/06/15 12:54 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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Entil'zha
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Sierra Hotel

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DRM--full of crap since 1985.




The Jedi Master


The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
#4178110 - 10/06/15 01:53 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
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PanzerMeyer  Online Centaurian
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How many gamers out there are still running games off CD/DVD? I know there are some but it must be a tiny fraction of the overall market.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4178116 - 10/06/15 02:13 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Allen Online content
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Allen  Online Content
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Originally Posted By: PanzerMeyer
How many gamers out there are still running games off CD/DVD? I know there are some but it must be a tiny fraction of the overall market.


On that topic, its been a few years now that I've gone entirely to Steam (and a couple similar on-line competitors).

I even repurchased my "favorite" old games on Steam -- so that I don't ever have to deal with a CD/DVD again.

All that even though I have many dozens of games on CD/DVD in my closet (stretching back to the mid '90s). Now, I won't purchase a game that I can only get on CD/DVD.

As an update to my above posts, still no issues with Windows 10. I now have it on 5 PCs and one Laptop in the house.

Still have three PCs running W7 and W8 to use Windows Media Center with my Ceton tuner. Even then, I now mostly watch TV via TWC apps on the 6 W10 computers, 3 Android tablets, and 2 Android phones.

Just information, FWIW.


Sapphire Pulse RX7900XTX, 3 monitors = 23P (1080p) + SAMSUNG 32" Odyssey Neo G7 1000R curve (4K/2160p) + 23P (1080p), AMD R9-7950X (ARCTIC Liquid Freezer II 420), 64GB RAM@6.0GHz, Gigabyte X670E AORUS MASTER MB, (4x M.2 SSD + 2xSSD + 2xHD) = ~52TB storage, EVGA 1600W PSU, Phanteks Enthoo Pro Full Tower, ASUS RT-AX89X 6000Mbps WiFi router, VKB Gladiator WW2 Stick, Pedals, G.Skill RGB KB, AORUS Thunder M7 Mouse, W11 Pro
#4178157 - 10/06/15 03:40 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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Bib4Tuna Offline
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Relevant to the original topic -

The number of users responding to the Steam Hardware Survey that use Windows 10, now exceeds the number of Windows 8 users.





Keep in mind, this is after roughly two months of release.

Of Course, Windows 7 still beats both, by far.

#4178465 - 10/07/15 02:05 AM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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rezerekted Offline
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Originally Posted By: PanzerMeyer
How many gamers out there are still running games off CD/DVD? I know there are some but it must be a tiny fraction of the overall market.


I still have over 50 Dos games installed so of course I still have disk based games installed. No, I am not buying them a second time from Steam.

#4193717 - 11/12/15 03:36 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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Bib4Tuna Offline
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Threshold 2 (TH2) was released today to non Insiders. A major update with all the improvements and changes from the last 6 months.

If you update, be wary that some of your system settings will need to be re-applied, and if you disabled some of the privacy related settings, they could be re-applied, so check after installing.

Also, run Disk Cleaner after you have made sure everything is working fine, so that you then recover some space from the backed up original install.

http://www.howtogeek.com/232176/whats-ne...10-fall-update/

#4198027 - 11/23/15 05:48 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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Gunslinger5577 Offline
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PC gamers are spoiled... We get so upset when an 11 year old game won't work on a new OS... That's like asking for an original X-box game to work on an Xbox One.....

Frankly, we have it good. Especially with outlets like gog.com bringing back retro games in a modern wrapper to allow us to enjoy the classics. This is why pc to me is the ultimate way to go...the community will find a way to make all our classics work smile

I have had zero issues with Win 10, I'm not a fanboy and I know people who have had issues, so I am sympathetic. Win 10 has a great rollback feature, use that and go back to 7 and you should be good.

Just wanted to state that some perspective on how good we have it as far as retro gaming is in order.. I object a little bit to the thought that a company should ensure that a a game from 2004 was compatible with current gen os's.. They did after all make a subsequent version of the game.....


CPU: 3.8 ghz 3930K, Nvidia 980 TI, 3D-vision, 16gb DDR3-2133 Memory, 120GB SSD, 240gb SSD, 2x1TB SATA HD, 27" ASUS 2ms LCD. Corsair Mechanical KB, Razer Death Adder,Win 10 64 bit.
also:
Alienware M11x R2
#4198030 - 11/23/15 05:52 PM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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PanzerMeyer Online centaurian
Pro-Consul of Florida
PanzerMeyer  Online Centaurian
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I'm sure Win 10 will eventually end up being a pretty good OS for gaming. I just don't see enough of a difference right now with Win 10 to warrant me doing an upgrade. I'm currently using Win 8.1


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4199293 - 11/26/15 05:34 AM Re: Tired of win 10 and gaming [Re: rwatson]  
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Gunslinger5577 Offline
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The Xbox One streaming works excellent if you are also a console gamer smile


CPU: 3.8 ghz 3930K, Nvidia 980 TI, 3D-vision, 16gb DDR3-2133 Memory, 120GB SSD, 240gb SSD, 2x1TB SATA HD, 27" ASUS 2ms LCD. Corsair Mechanical KB, Razer Death Adder,Win 10 64 bit.
also:
Alienware M11x R2
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