But I have some harsh requirements..

When I had to upgrade to a USB joystick, I went with the Saitek X52, a grave mistake as far as ergonomics is concerned.


To give you an idea as for the stick shape and envisioned ergonomics I`ve been looking at the following sticks which for reasons listed wont work for me at the moment:

VKB Cobra Defender M5 - Slightly tall but the profile fits my hand, but hardly ever any examples available.

Thrustmaster T16000M - Seems about right in height, but the top of it is too thick for hardly any reason, and I hear people say the throw on the stick is a bit too much (I don`t plan on puncturing my stomach intestines with my elbow when pulling hard on the stick).

Mad Catz Pacific Aviator, looks PERFECT for my needs (I have CH Throttle Quadrant and the Saitek HOTAS throttle to compensate for the dodgy button arrangements), but I`ve found no reviews to detail on precision and stick throw, does anyone here have a comment on that?

To give a further idea as to why I`m so disapproving of the Saitek X52, the joystick I upgraded from was a Microsoft Sidewinder 3D Pro (which I sold when I converted to W7), that thing was shaped perfectly, anyone who owned a Microsoft stick can attest to this.

Short stick and low base = low profile (Even with a 40" TV Monitor the X52 comes up right into my face).
No silly lights (I dont want the sun in my face).
Sleek grip, none of the ergonomic and silly looking "wrap your thumb around this and that" crongly stuff or silly Mad Catz F.L.Y.5 etc..
My hands are not the biggest so...


So right now I`m pretty much stuck, I want the Pacific Aviator (buttons etc dont matter to me, I have HOTAS throttle, Pedals, Quadrant, TrackIR etc) but I`m unsure as for the throw and precision.


Any advice would be appreciated!

This?

http://www.flightstore.co.uk/simulation-...-joystick-p2430

BTW - Tm T16000M is not much different - ergonomically -than the MS Sidewinder 3D PRO, and you can remove that thumb rest if want.

Coming from an MS SideWinder 3D Pro? That stick has a very short throw compared to most modern sticks, so no wonder you find most sticks to have too much!

If that's a concern, you might as well use a 3DP-Vert adapter so it'll work through USB in its native digital mode. Most sticks have a longer throw, and for good reason; it allows finer control.

I'd offer up my CH Flightstick Pro USB, but on top of the handle being obnoxiously large at the top for whatever reason, it has the signature CH wide throw, like wider-than-T.16000M throw.

Funny how you complain about wanting a short throw while people playing DCS A10C have been modding their sticks to have more, more, MORE!

Personally, I have not tried any other sticks that you mentioned. My experience has been with a Logitech Extreme 3D Pro ages and ages ago, then a Cougar more recently, and finally a Warthog for the past 5 years. I cannot recommend the Warthog enough. It is a bit too big for my hands and as such have to shift my grip a bit when firing missiles but that's not been a problem as I can shift my grip as I set up for my attack. Precision-wise, well, I do A-A refueling in BMS and find it quite relaxing, so I guess that's precise enough for me. Also loved doing guns attacks on tanks when flying the A-10C so I know it's precise enough to put a pipper on a tiny target.

Height-wise, well, it may be a bit tall but I've mounted my HOTAS on platforms so they are on a side-stick configuration and are perfectly ergonomic with regards to the way I'm sitting down.

Hope that helps!

Thank you all so much for placing your cents and opinions

I actually already placed an order for a Gameport adapter from Rockfire via ebay.
It can only place the stick (which has two modes, digital and analog) in analog mode (the 4 buttons at the base wont work) but I can live with that, I`m only really looking to use the trigger as far as buttons are concerned.

I am also aware of the method to build an adapter, using a Teensy board and 3DP-Vert board+Gameport adapter etc, a few minutes of soldering (I might do that if it turns out the digital mode gives more precision or something to that effect), connect the thing and upload the firmware, voila I`m up.

I also have a gameport CH Fighterstick, it`s really thick up top for sure but not around the area that you grip to reach the trigger, like the T16000M.

I know I can remove the T16000M thumb rest, but unfortunately it`s still too wide where my finger would reach around for the trigger.

Some times I find myself flying jets, but my heart has always been with WW1-WW2 dogfights.

I know the longer throw is usually a plus for precision, but the darned old Sidewinder grew on me.
Look at it from a historical perspective, during the Battle of Britain for example, new pilots had a better chance of survival because they were rougher on the stick during combat and therefore not as predictable as a smooth veteran, it was not all that uncommon to see new pilots returning with a few holes and dings on their crates whereas the veterans (also suffering from fatigue) more often than not got shot.
The same way can be said about the Sidewinder and its short throw, it got me out of many tight spots in a multitude of combat flight sims

I hated the stick on the X52 as well. Loved the number of buttons and the throttle, but not how loose and tall the stick was. Even after messing with the sprint to try to improve it, it was still just too tall and loose.
I have an Aviator, just barely cosmetically different than that Pacific Aviator. The one that's for the 360 as well as PC. It's a total POS. Buttons are horrible, but just the entire thing is horribly made, noisy and junk IMO. Yes, it felt too tall and loose like the X52.

What I have now, and love, is a Thrustmaster THOTAS X. Not expensive at all and amazingly solid and weighty--feels far better than the X52 and worlds better than that Aviator. I know you have a throttle though, so not much use for half of it. That stick is the height and feel I think you're looking for though. You might want to take a look at a similar one, with a built in throttle you could ignore like the other sticks you mentioned:
T Flight Stick X. I think the stick is the same as my THOTAS X.
http://www.thrustmaster.com/en_UK/products/tflight-stick-x
Not a bad price at all for such a solid product.
http://smile.amazon.com/Thrustmaster-T-F....Flight+Stick+X

I have only used CH Product HOTAS and rudder pedals