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#4143186 - 07/05/15 09:18 PM Careful what you wish for: The Claims system.  
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DukeIronHand Offline
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High over the Front
After a long time of asking for it by myself and others OBD finally separated Promotions from Claims.
Thought my ship had arrived now. I didn't like how "Normal" Claims worked so I wanted to knock it down to "Easier" or "Easiest" but didn't because I was worried about the already apparently too fast Promotions.
So OBD being a great bunch of guys gave me, and others, what I wanted - separation of the two.

Now after about 10 missions since the separation (with Promotions at Normal) I find myself getting ready to put Claims back to "Normal"!
"Easiest" is a automatic victory add with no form or anything. You shoot one down and boom its in your log. Tried that for two missions and it seemed too weird so I went to "Easier".
Well the issue here for me, as I have been playing with no aids is that at this setting, in the Debrief screen at missions end, it tells you how many aircraft you have shot down. "Easier" all right except for 2 of these I lost sight of the enemy as he spun down so didn't plan to file a claim! Yet at missions end I am told they crashed.
Kind of defeats the purpose of flying with no aids eh?
So after a year of asking for this, and OBD graciously providing it, it looks like I am not going to use it and am going back to "Normal/Normal" where I started years ago. Goodness gracious! I wouldn't be happy if you hung me with a new rope apparently.

Dear OBD, I will shut up now and please don't pay attention to me. You guys work on what you will.
wave

#4143191 - 07/05/15 09:27 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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Even though they tell you how many went down, I only enter the ones I felt good about at the time the combat took place. It's not perfect, but seems to work pretty well! salute


The older I get, the more I realize I don't need to be Han, Luke or Leia. I'm just happy to be rebel scum...
#4143193 - 07/05/15 09:30 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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I've recently seen where my wingman and I downed a balloon we both placed bullets on the target, and filed claims...

I remember thinking, well, he was behind me, got the last shot in, it's probably his. Low and behold, I got gredit, his was denied.

I like the way it works, it's random and not guaranteed.

OvS


The Black Baron of Boistrancourt returns!!

I'd rather die fighting, than live for nothing. - Gen. G.S. Patton
#4143197 - 07/05/15 09:33 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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MudWasp Offline
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I remember 'Normal' having the players box in the column of shot down EA showing an #, not an x
Think it was a 2.0x change, maybe it was a 1.xx thing...remember everyone flying on normal with it telling pilot kill numbers....late last summer.

#4143201 - 07/05/15 09:39 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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DukeIronHand Offline
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High over the Front
And I lied OBD...sorry.
Having a career issue that I will post in the technical support forum.

#4143213 - 07/05/15 10:13 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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MudWasp Offline
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a shack in da woods
WAFFENFABRIK
MAUSER
OBERNDORF N/A
1899

#144

#4143216 - 07/05/15 10:21 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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MudWasp Offline
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a shack in da woods
Still good at 125 yds on a fat old orange yep
Only fired two rounds after dusting it off.

My meat getter is a Rem 1100 2/4 .. 1-4x leupold, two barrels...1 for small game and birds, another a Hastings rifled slug barrel, the scope is mounted on the slug barrel not the base on the shot gun.

#4143222 - 07/05/15 10:48 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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MudWasp Offline
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a shack in da woods
Fire arms put away, PBR Walter Time

#4143229 - 07/05/15 10:57 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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DukeIronHand Offline
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Eh...guns and beer go together just fine.
Just not too much beer...specially PBR...probably makes it hard to see straight.
Empty cans make great targets.

#4143245 - 07/05/15 11:23 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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MudWasp Offline
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a shack in da woods
Yep, bought a remake of the old Red Ryder at the tractor store.
Might be more for me than them...lol...that streak of the bb in the right light. This one throws low left.

#4143397 - 07/06/15 01:11 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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Deacon211 Offline
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Hey Duke,

Are you considering that, based on your debrief to the Intel officer (i.e. "Put 20 rounds into a DIII with a checkerboard on the fuselage. Saw him spin into the clouds."), some infantry or artillery unit might not find that plane and provide proof for you even if you didn't see him crash yourself?

I think that argument could be made for your wingmen as well. I don't know how WWI debriefs went, but I think the aim has always been to recreate an engagement in as much detail as possible. So formations, flight compositions, tactics, weapons, and the general conduct of the flight would all be valuable to the Intel officer. And the debrief would be something of a collaborative experience.

WOFF by necessity abstracts the claim process to you making a case for your kill. But, for instance, if you shot down a plane and your "witness" didn't see it, it's unlikely I think that another flight member who did see it would keep mum because you didn't ask him about it.

In the end there's a bit of subjectivity as to what individual players feel is "realistic" as far as kill confirmation goes. But, I don't think that there's a perfect system. Luckily OBD offers some choices to suit individual tastes. smile

#4143409 - 07/06/15 01:31 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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You are correct and I like your thinking - having said exactly the same on the past - and I wish the "indirect" confirmation method was DIRECTLY AND CLEARLY seen and mentioned in the process (AA, Wingman, Ground unit confirmation assist) then that would be fine but at the middle level (Easy or Easier) you are ALWAYS told of a kill whether you see it or not.
If it was just sometime I could think like the above but not when its always. But that's just me.

No big deal. As I, and you, have said earlier there are enough options available to satisfy every one.

#4143518 - 07/06/15 05:35 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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rockmedic109 Offline
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I am toying with the idea of bumping Claims down to the mid level {always confirmed but have to file the claim} and only file a claim when certain criteria are met.

Then file a claim when on own side of the lines or within 2nm of a friendly plane or ground unit {pause and pull up TAC}. Maybe make the friendly plane restriction require a plane from another flight. Maybe make flamers easier to claim.

#4143549 - 07/06/15 06:50 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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DukeIronHand Offline
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There is certainly several different ways to look at the process and ways to deal with it.
And your idea is certainly fine.
That's what's cool about the whole WOFF thing. The ability to tailor things to your own idea of real and cool.

#4143585 - 07/06/15 09:00 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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rockmedic109 Offline
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This is one of the most configurable games I've ever played. Certainly the most configurable WWI sim. I've had an over lines claim confirmed with nobody near. The next mission I downed two planes that crashed within a NM of the aerodrome I landed at {One at the edge of the field} and they were rejected {both had pilots within 2nm}.

I am beginning to wonder if there are keywords in the notes of the claim form that increase the odds of confirmation or make it a confirmation.

#4143588 - 07/06/15 09:05 PM Re: Careful what you wish for: The Claims system. [Re: DukeIronHand]  
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DukeIronHand Offline
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High over the Front
Reportedly.
The Claim Form verbage has been discussed here often and extensively.
The search feature at SimHQ is weak but give it a try.


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