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#4142167 - 07/02/15 03:04 PM Some epic 18th century warfare  
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I've always had an intellectual fascination with 18th century warfare and some of these depictions on film are among the best IMHO,











“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
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#4142183 - 07/02/15 03:45 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Best time to be a soldier!


Scully: Victim died of multiple stab wounds.
Mulder: *throws her a file* Ever heard of the knife alien?
#4142204 - 07/02/15 04:33 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I always find 18th & 19th century land and naval warfare interesting. As to it being the "best time to be a soldier"....I have to agree on some level, especially if you were an officer. Just don't get wounded.


Archie Smythe

carpe diem
#4142206 - 07/02/15 04:41 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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I was being sarcastic wink

Don't get wounded, or sick, or happen to be in the wrong 500 of 1000 slots in formation on a bad day. A lot easier to die than survive simple things.


Scully: Victim died of multiple stab wounds.
Mulder: *throws her a file* Ever heard of the knife alien?
#4142210 - 07/02/15 04:48 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Was watching the BBC's Napoleon documentary this morning, they were talking about his walking tour of Russia and at one battle they quoted the amount of ammo that was used by the French, 5 bullets in the air every second, 3 cannon balls as well for about 10 hours, your chances of getting wounded were about 30%. Surgeon amputated more than 900 limbs over the time of the battle and there were over 30,000 casualties (wounded + dead) on the French side.

Very good documentary maybe slightly biased towards Napoleon but still very good, it is over 3 parts and well worth catching it if you can.


Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4142211 - 07/02/15 04:51 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: Alicatt]  
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Originally Posted By: Alicatt

Very good documentary maybe slightly biased towards Napoleon but still very good, it is over 3 parts and well worth catching it if you can.


A BBC documentary slightly biased towards Napoleon? How did THAT happen? biggrin


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4142213 - 07/02/15 04:53 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted By: PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted By: Alicatt

Very good documentary maybe slightly biased towards Napoleon but still very good, it is over 3 parts and well worth catching it if you can.


A BBC documentary slightly biased towards Napoleon? How did THAT happen? biggrin
Could only be because it was the 200th anniversary of his defeat at Waterloo wink


Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4142219 - 07/02/15 05:07 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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One thing I wish in movies about 18th century warfare is an accurate depiction of artillery. All too often the artillery rounds are shown as exploding on contact with people flying away to the side. As far as I know the solid shot used would instead tend to kill a line of men as well as bouncing a bit.

#4142222 - 07/02/15 05:15 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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they were fired to hit in front of the line and act like a bowling ball along the rank or file bouncing at less than waist hight, Brrrr gives me the shivers thinking about it.


Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4142224 - 07/02/15 05:16 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: FlyingToaster]  
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Originally Posted By: FlyingToaster
One thing I wish in movies about 18th century warfare is an accurate depiction of artillery. All too often the artillery rounds are shown as exploding on contact with people flying away to the side. As far as I know the solid shot used would instead tend to kill a line of men as well as bouncing a bit.
They showed a bit of that in the Mel Gibson film The Patriot


Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4142227 - 07/02/15 05:18 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: Alicatt]  
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Originally Posted By: Alicatt
They showed a bit of that in the Mel Gibson film The Patriot


Yes it was an obviously CGI effect that was used to depict that. I think that's why most movies don't have a realistic portrayal of solid shot because of the cost involved in using CGI.

Last edited by PanzerMeyer; 07/02/15 05:20 PM.

“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4142244 - 07/02/15 05:48 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Sometimes a 3/4" lead ball into your chest is the better option. Like when option 2 is an 8lb iron one...



Suicide is man's way of telling god "You can't fire me, I quit!"
#4142247 - 07/02/15 05:54 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: No105_Archie]  
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It's alien- not just tactics, but the old political systems involved. While conscription of more professional soldiers is coming online, campaigns were being conducted by their majesties and by emperors, there was still more of a class distinction between officers and men- even people who essentially can purchase their commissions. Arab armies today have this problem- the officers are separated more than by rank but by their social class. It promotes a system of political appointees and yes men. Respect for superiors is often nothing more than fear driven. This probably explains to large degree the results that you would expect.

Napoleon on the other hand was an interesting dude because he wasn't cut from the usual cloth- even going so far as to crown himself emperor without the Church is an unprecedented move, he was more like a 'normal guy' who came up in the world. Beethoven of course became disillusioned after first receiving him as the symbol of a new era.

And everyone knows that weapons technology really starts to outpace 18th and 19th Century tactics, which were still being crudely employed somewhat up until WWI.





#4142265 - 07/02/15 06:25 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Originally Posted By: PanzerMeyer
I've always had an intellectual fascination with 18th century warfare and some of these depictions on film are among the best IMHO,



Have you ever seen the made for television series Shaka Zulu? It's probably one of the most beautiful period films I've ever seen, I think you'd probably like it.

The Battle of Gqokli Hill is depicted with a bit of poetry (especially as you raise the issue of solid cannon balls affecting the outcome in typical movie effects), still, it's a wonderful show. smile

#4142269 - 07/02/15 06:33 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: Mechanus]  
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Originally Posted By: Mechanus

Have you ever seen the made for television series Shaka Zulu? It's probably one of the most beautiful period films I've ever seen, I think you'd probably like it.

I remember watching some parts of it when it originally aired on tv. That was back in 1986 when I was 14 so I don't think I had the proper appreciation for it. I'll have to see if Netflix has it.


“Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”
#4142276 - 07/02/15 06:52 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Reading Cornwell's Sharpe-Series gives a good insight into warfare of the napoleonic time.
I never saw the tv edition. I think I have to one day.

#4142285 - 07/02/15 07:19 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Manual of Instruction for the Safe Use of Reproduction 18th Century Artillery in Historic Weapons Demonstrations

Near the end it gives the amount of powder allowed.

http://www.nps.gov/stri/upload/18th-Century-Artillery-Manual.pdf


There was only 16 squadrons of RAF fighters that used 100 octane during the BoB.
The Fw190A could not fly with the outer cannon removed.
There was no Fw190A-8s flying with the JGs in 1945.
#4142293 - 07/02/15 07:33 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: paf_eaf310]  
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Originally Posted By: paf_eaf310
Reading Cornwell's Sharpe-Series gives a good insight into warfare of the napoleonic time.
I never saw the tv edition. I think I have to one day.


The Sharpe TV series is very enjoyable, although it has some serious historical inaccuracies and plausibility-stretching events (e.g. I don't think any of the riflemen ever miss a shot). Still, one of my favourite TV series, and seems to bring the feel of the era to life.

Click to reveal..
I especially like one bit where Sharpe is training recruits and says 'you don't see a battle, you hear it.'

#4142331 - 07/02/15 10:24 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: KraziKanuK]  
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Originally Posted By: KraziKanuK
Manual of Instruction for the Safe Use of Reproduction 18th Century Artillery in Historic Weapons Demonstrations

Near the end it gives the amount of powder allowed.

http://www.nps.gov/stri/upload/18th-Century-Artillery-Manual.pdf


part of a demo I watched a couple of years ago,



Originally Posted By: PanzerMeyer
Originally Posted By: Alicatt
They showed a bit of that in the Mel Gibson film The Patriot


Yes it was an obviously CGI effect that was used to depict that. I think that's why most movies don't have a realistic portrayal of solid shot because of the cost involved in using CGI.
Still cheaper than doing it for real wink


Chlanna nan con thigibh a so's gheibh sibh feoil
Sons of the hound come here and get flesh
Clan Cameron
#4142340 - 07/02/15 10:54 PM Re: Some epic 18th century warfare [Re: PanzerMeyer]  
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Did any of you guys ever watch a English TV show called Sharpe it was based around a common soldier promoted to officer rank. Around the Napoleonic times some pretty good battle scenes low budget but they managed to pull it off
Panzermeyer I reckon you would enjoy it, The story lines are a little sentimental at times though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-Fy3tSim3to

Last edited by marko1231123; 07/03/15 12:14 AM.
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