#3860212 - 11/08/13 10:41 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Joined: Feb 2000
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Jedi Master
Entil'zha
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Entil'zha
Sierra Hotel
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The industry now has me so jaded I merely raise my eyebrows at most for any given announcement. The rate of under-delivery in flight sims is so high that I no longer eagerly anticipate anything or feel any disappointment when they fail to appear. A brief list of titles that upon a time disappointed me: Fighter Ops, SoW: BoB (what it was supposed to be, not what CloD was), DCS: AH-64, MPS F4: F-15E, Jane's A-10, Desert Fighters...
If it comes, and it's good, I'll get it. If not, oh well. I might invest some money, but I will no longer invest myself.
The Jedi Master
The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
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#3862021 - 11/13/13 04:28 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 18
pandacat
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Yeah, I have also had so much frustration and disappointment with the combat flight sim genre, especially the modern one. True that the fan base is smaller than many other genres and the learning curve is much steeper (not like you can take an AK47 and start banging away), but the fans are hardcore and more dedicated. If one loves flight sim, he will love it for years or even ages. However, I believe the biggest problem lies with developers and their lack of strategic business mentality. They often got ambitious and overextended themselves. They often have no pulse on the fans around them. Like DCS, please ask yourself a question,"how far can you go with detailed and authentic modern fighter jet modeling?" You think you can present to the fans, many of whom are experts, with a faked F-35(with so much classified) and claim it to be authentic? Why wasting years and thousands on something that's bound to be a dead end?
WWII is out there. Not copy righted, not patented, not classified and with volumeous of public information available. I say ED should just ditch the modern era projects and throw all resources on WWII stuff. With good planes and good multi-player environment, many old fans (like myself), who have lost interest, will come back and new fans will join. To address steep learning curve issue, you can set up different servers like War Thunder. For those who just like easy arcadish play style, they can play on one server and for those hardcore simer, they can have fun on a different server. If the prospect looks good, you can then extend into other theaters such as pacific, (I am sure a lot of people would love to see WWII carrier ops in DCS). IL-2's past success is already a good example. DCS can potentially take it to a new level. Well, all this depends on how wisely these folks can managed their resources and deliver on their promises.
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#3862400 - 11/14/13 12:57 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Para_Bellum
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I say ED should just ditch the modern era projects and throw all resources on WWII stuff. No, thanks. IMO ED is doing a fine job with expanding the DCS series as it is.
"...late afternoon the Air Tasking Order came in [and] we found the A-10 part and we said, "We are going where!? We are doing what!?"
Capt. Todd Sheehy, Hog pilot, on receiving orders during Operation Desert Storm
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#3862634 - 11/14/13 08:17 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: Para_Bellum]
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Joined: Feb 2000
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Jedi Master
Entil'zha
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Entil'zha
Sierra Hotel
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I say ED should just ditch the modern era projects and throw all resources on WWII stuff. No, thanks. IMO ED is doing a fine job with expanding the DCS series as it is. Yes, in that case we would have MULTIPLE devs doing WWII and NO devs doing modern stuff. That hardly seems a good strategy. The Jedi Master
The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
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#3862729 - 11/14/13 11:16 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: Jedi Master]
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pandacat
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Yes, in that case we would have MULTIPLE devs doing WWII and NO devs doing modern stuff.
That hardly seems a good strategy.
Sounds like they have a lot of extra resources to spare so that they can get several projects rolling at the same time. Is that really true? If they had so much extra resources, why bother to do this kickstarter thing at all? Please don't forget they said P51D was created on their spare time. It was done by the SAME set of folks, not MULTIPLE/DIFFERENT devs.
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#3862785 - 11/15/13 02:32 AM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Para_Bellum
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I'm currently flying the A-10, the P-51, the Huey and the Mi-8. All are absolutely amazing simulated aircraft and among the best I've ever seen in any flightsim.
I'm fine with how ED is doing business. Stuff takes time. And hardcore sims are and will always be a niche market at best.
"...late afternoon the Air Tasking Order came in [and] we found the A-10 part and we said, "We are going where!? We are doing what!?"
Capt. Todd Sheehy, Hog pilot, on receiving orders during Operation Desert Storm
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#3862795 - 11/15/13 03:15 AM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,147
Gambit21
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WWII is out there. Not copy righted, not patented,
You might want to let Grumman know that - they disagree.
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#3863101 - 11/15/13 06:12 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,147
Gambit21
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Yes, in that case we would have MULTIPLE devs doing WWII and NO devs doing modern stuff. That hardly seems a good strategy. [/quote
Sounds like they have a lot of extra resources to spare so that they can get several projects rolling at the same time. Is that really true? If they had so much extra resources, why bother to do this kickstarter thing at all? Please don't forget they said P51D was created on their spare time. It was done by the SAME set of folks, not MULTIPLE/DIFFERENT devs.
I think you're off the rails a bit. They will (wisely) pursue multiple areas of development and streams of revenue. Abandoning the modern aircraft that they've built their success on would be phenomenally stupid.
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#3863189 - 11/15/13 08:59 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 49,716
Jedi Master
Entil'zha
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Entil'zha
Sierra Hotel
Joined: Feb 2000
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Space Coast, USA
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Yes, in that case we would have MULTIPLE devs doing WWII and NO devs doing modern stuff. That hardly seems a good strategy. [/quote
Sounds like they have a lot of extra resources to spare so that they can get several projects rolling at the same time. Is that really true? If they had so much extra resources, why bother to do this kickstarter thing at all? Please don't forget they said P51D was created on their spare time. It was done by the SAME set of folks, not MULTIPLE/DIFFERENT devs.
KS was done by Ilya's group. Ilya is not an employee of ED. He's not being funded by ED, although he will be assisted by them to some extent. ED is doing the 109 AFAIK, but I don't know the details exactly. The P-51D was indeed created by ED in their spare time...and the fact that it's a WWII bird in a modern battlefield is the result. Ilya is going to take that as the basis for a new WWII DCS, ED isn't making it with "a little help" from him. As for what ED is doing, I expect we'll be talking about the 2016 elections sooner than we get F/A-18C, seeing as they're tied up with making non-FC adaptations of those planes, EDGE and Nevada right now. There's nothing else that they've announced. They're busy enough. The Jedi Master
The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
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#3888101 - 01/02/14 06:34 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: Jedi Master]
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 574
RAF74_Raptor
Jurrasic
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Jurrasic
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TN
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The industry now has me so jaded I merely raise my eyebrows at most for any given announcement. The rate of under-delivery in flight sims is so high that I no longer eagerly anticipate anything or feel any disappointment when they fail to appear. A brief list of titles that upon a time disappointed me: Fighter Ops, SoW: BoB (what it was supposed to be, not what CloD was), DCS: AH-64, MPS F4: F-15E, Jane's A-10, Desert Fighters...
If it comes, and it's good, I'll get it. If not, oh well. I might invest some money, but I will no longer invest myself.
The Jedi Master Jedi I think you summed up exactly how I feel about the whole thing and what I was trying to say in my earlier post where I was called Crazy.
Ahh CLOD never in the history of Simming has so much been promised and so little given.
However I want to thank Team Fusion for keeping the Dream Alive.
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#3888129 - 01/02/14 07:00 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 49,716
Jedi Master
Entil'zha
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Entil'zha
Sierra Hotel
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Posts: 49,716
Space Coast, USA
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Well, it's pretty common to fail to get a point across in text only. You can try and explain things, but it's hard to know when people are going to misread something and fill in the blanks to think "oh, he means this" when in fact that's not only NOT what you mean but perhaps even 180 degrees off!
It's probably the most frustrating thing I find about the internet.
The Jedi Master
The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
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#3888612 - 01/03/14 02:34 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 49,716
Jedi Master
Entil'zha
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Entil'zha
Sierra Hotel
Joined: Feb 2000
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Space Coast, USA
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I understand the P-51 was a proof-of-concept for a hi-fi prop plane in the DCS engine. I get that some people just like flying around in one with working weapons and were willing to buy it. I just personally also think it needs the context or it's just an exercise.
However, that said, to go to the expense of building an entire WWII sim without knowing how it would go over... I get why ED did it as it paved the way for this. This will be what we expected more traditionally as opposed to what the P-51 release was.
The P-51 proved it's possible. Now we have to see the execution. I just hope it's worth it.
The Jedi Master
The anteater is wearing the bagel because he's a reindeer princess. -- my 4 yr old daughter
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#3890708 - 01/06/14 11:10 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: pandacat]
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Joined: Oct 1999
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Allen
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Ohio USA
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Regarding "investing" one's self in an upcoming game. I did that in a big way with Dragon Age RPG -- spent several years on that one every day on the developer forum. It was obvious after a three or so years, they were "dropping the ball". I did not like the result -- graded it B -- as did the serious reviewers. Hated that I had put so much of my "soul" into it Now, for DCS: WWII, I've invested my $100. I definitely wish them the best. However, I'll move on to other things -- until it "pops up" -- if it "pops up". Not completely cured yet, I'm making a money and time investment (as an early access buyer, a Forum Moderator, and game modder) for another RPG that's in development. But, even though serious and holding up my end, I'm much more "laid back" about it -- what will be, will be -- so far, they're on the "right track"
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#3901686 - 01/25/14 11:07 PM
Re: I actually like this DCS WWII idea
[Re: Jedi Master]
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 556
shadylurker
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I understand the P-51 was a proof-of-concept for a hi-fi prop plane in the DCS engine. I get that some people just like flying around in one with working weapons and were willing to buy it. I just personally also think it needs the context or it's just an exercise.
However, that said, to go to the expense of building an entire WWII sim without knowing how it would go over... I get why ED did it as it paved the way for this. This will be what we expected more traditionally as opposed to what the P-51 release was.
The P-51 proved it's possible. Now we have to see the execution. I just hope it's worth it.
The Jedi Master One of the rare occasions I can already say it is worth it, IMO. Even if the game world is just a grass texture and weapons don't work, as long as I can fire up those airplanes and fly around the same way I can in the P51 right now It will be worth my $50, just to flip switches and operate the aircraft. however I think Il2 BOS was a waste of $90 and it's exactly what I thought it would be, I'm a sim masochist.
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