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#3861298 - 11/11/13 08:46 PM How to get started flying with other people  
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 66
cjcrank Offline
Junior Member
cjcrank  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 66
Hey all,

I have done quite a few of the training missions, I can take off and land, use a/g and a/a weapons.
Now I want to do an actual mission but when I clicked on 'campaign' and selected the tiger one, wow was I
totally unprepared for all that info.

So, it would seem better to get online with someone who could walk me through the 'single player campaign' scenario so I can get the hang of the big picture. (then in turn I would be in a position to help someone else in my shoes).

I tried the original F4AF manual and it details the Korean Tiger campaign but it was pretty overwhelming just trying to read through and understand it all.

I have done some searching but am unable to find how to get hooked up online with someone who would be willing to show me the ropes taking into account my skillset.

The terms I am looking at are, Teamspeak, Port Forwarding, IVC Server etc. Any direction would be much appreciated!

Thanks Guys

Inline advert (2nd and 3rd post)

#3861313 - 11/11/13 09:24 PM Re: How to get started flying with other people [Re: cjcrank]  
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
- Ice Offline
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- Ice  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
Philippines / North East UK
Falcon is different because there is no "master server" that you can connect to that shows you all the other servers. There are a bunch of persistent PvP servers (Archer's, Red Flag, etc.) and other virtual squadrons have their own servers as well. To get this info, you will have to ask them (squadrons) or go to the BMS forums for info on the PvP servers.

You can also make your own server and host. You can set up your own Teamspeak or use SimHQ's TS3 server. IVC isn't really needed for a small number of players, and you can just set up different channels and whisper groups in TS3.

As for flying a campaign mission, you have to remember that a lot of things are going on around you. Allied flights are going in and out of the area, you have to keep an ear out for enemy activity near your area (bullseye/BRAA calls from AWACS or other flights), etc., or by Picture/Nearest Threat calls to AWACS Sometimes, you may have to scrap your mission to deal with an air threat to you, or you may have to divert from your course to keep clear of enemy aircraft. It now isn't simply about whether you can get your bombs on target, it's about keeping SA around you and reacting to that. Is it safe to continue with the mission? Is it safe to set your wingman out on a 2-mile echelon right formation? Should you alter course 30-degrees left to steer clear of that inbound enemy aircraft? Do you drop your bombs and keep the enemy busy while you clear your wingman to go A-G?

And that's just in your flight. After that, you have to assess the overall threat picture. Do you want to fly SEAD flights and make sure that SA-2/SA-5 site gets taken out? Do you want to fly a CAP patrol to keep the enemy fighters off your guys? Do you fly a CAS mission and hope to thin down the enemy ground forces?

The skill you learn in training is still useful, but you will then learn how difficult it is to actually get into the target area in the first place.

Good luck, and hope that helps!


- Ice
#3861352 - 11/11/13 11:20 PM Re: How to get started flying with other people [Re: cjcrank]  
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 356
CTR69 Offline
Member
CTR69  Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 356
Bombing missions are easy ones. Select easier campaign difficulty where there are no threats, so you can practice startup, flying on time, following waypoints, dropping bombs on target and landing. Later on you can choose SEAD, OCA or AA missions.

Only then i'd recommend MP, once you get bored of SP missions or know how to fly them.

#3861401 - 11/12/13 01:33 AM Re: How to get started flying with other people [Re: cjcrank]  
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 66
cjcrank Offline
Junior Member
cjcrank  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 66
Thanks for the replies!

I guess my topic should have been - how to do the SP campaigns.
Does anyone know if there is a training tutorial like tanit did on youtube?
Basically a step by step for the tiger campaign?

#3861597 - 11/12/13 06:04 PM Re: How to get started flying with other people [Re: cjcrank]  
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
- Ice Offline
Veteran
- Ice  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
Philippines / North East UK
Nope, and there won't be as each start can be different and even if the start was the same, 2 or 3 missions down the line, they will no longer be similar.

Remember, this is a dynamic campaign engine wink


- Ice
#3862168 - 11/13/13 09:58 PM Re: How to get started flying with other people [Re: cjcrank]  
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 130
Gigolety Offline
Member
Gigolety  Offline
Member

Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 130
Lugano
Best option to learn how to get started is by joining a Falcon virtual squadron. Normally, the best idea is to find one in your continent or country but that is a personal preference. Better if they speak the same language , I think is quite clear. Look in a search engine!

If you want to make a Campaign alone, my personal opinion is that bombing is not really easy. It may look strange but actually air to air missions are easier, mainly because you are not too close to the terrain (Collision with ground are reduced) and you don't have to deal with AAA or low level SAMs like with and air to ground. Weaponery is a bit easier, I don't suggest a beginner to start to handle Maverick, GBU's, MK-84 and Laser Bomb close to the ground and with air to air and air to ground threats. The workload is too heavy! Switchology is pretty complicate and a certain level of experience is required vicevers air to air weaponery is a bit easier to learn!

One of the easiest is to perform an HAVCAP. You have to defend a high value airborne asset like a tanker or the E-3 so you will be well inside friendly territory, any bandit will be engaged normally before and those who may penetrate will be detected well in advance. If they come close enough friendly SAMs can help you or others fighter can give an help as well. So this is one of the best scenario for a rookie. The other is a Barcap but in some cases can become a bit tricky, especially at the begining when the air force oif the enemy is strong, so I suggest to select BARCAP missions at the end of the Campaign after day 5! Enemy air force is heavily damaged and the skies are filled with friednly aircrafts. Remember to hit Key "Q" + "8" to ask AWACS the clearance to leave your CAP station so to get an excellent. Normally you have to orbit around a certain area around 30 to 33 minutes then you can leave. If you do that the system will consider the mission a success.

If I had time I was going to help you but unfortunately real life is punching right into my face.

Good luck Buddy!

Last edited by Gigolety; 11/13/13 10:06 PM.

I speak many languages one of them is cesky
#3862194 - 11/13/13 11:01 PM Re: How to get started flying with other people [Re: cjcrank]  
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
- Ice Offline
Veteran
- Ice  Offline
Veteran

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,082
Philippines / North East UK
I would disagree with doing air-to-air missions. Firing off a missile is easy, it's getting into a position of good PK while not getting shot at yourself that is difficult. You can fire at max range (Raero, Ropt, or Rpi) but the PK is very low. Just as you get into Rtr or Rmax2 is ideally when you want to fire off a missile but the chances are there is also one on the way to you at this point. And this is dealing with BVR. Load up a couple of rear-aspect Sidewinders and get into a turning fight and you will see how bombing a ground target is way easier. With turning fights as well, it is hard to keep altitude and pretty soon, you may have AAA or a SAM coming up at you.

This isn't to say ground attack is easy. Well, it is, provided you are using only dumb bombs. Obviously, once you start using the Maverick, GBUs or LGBs, things get slightly more complicated but still, I think this is less complicated than understanding the fluid aspect of air-to-air combat especially WVR air-to-air fights. Also, a campaign mission is not the place for a beginner to figure out how to handle Mavs/GBUs/CBUs, that is what training missions are for. By the time a campaign mission is flown, use of these weapons should be nearly second-nature.

As for dealing with threats, again, it is easier to evade AAA and SAMs than it is to evade a MiG-29 hot on your tail. AAA and low-level SAMs? Fly high. This is the Viper, not the Hog, and you should be cruising at Angels 20 or higher anyway to get better fuel economy. Climb to Angels 30 and that's sorted. High-altitude SAMs are also easy to evade because 1) you should be able to see them coming, 2) you have altitude to trade for airspeed, and 3) they will take a few seconds to reach you which gives you time to beam/notch it.

Lastly, if you are attacking a ground target that is well-covered by AAA and high- and low-alt SAMs, you are fk'ed even before you take off anyway. Ideally, you should sort out a SEAD flight to take out the SAMs and AAA radars. This would take the SAMs out of the fight although AAAs can still sometimes engage you at low altitude, but without their radars, they are less effective. Only when you have neutralized as much of the anti-air threat should you be sending in Vipers to bomb it.

I would suggest taking missions where you are tasked to bomb buildings, maybe a nuclear plant or a factory or a port. You can take dumb bombs and make several passes, or take GBU-32s and bomb up to 4 targets in one pass. Missions wherein the target is an airfield is difficult as there are more layers of protection that need to be taken out, and missions where the target is a tank battalion is difficult because you have to search for, ID, then destroy the targets. Too much workload. Buildings don't move.

Hope that helps!


- Ice
#3862257 - 11/14/13 02:04 AM Re: How to get started flying with other people [Re: cjcrank]  
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 66
cjcrank Offline
Junior Member
cjcrank  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 66
Thanks for all of the replies guys!

#3862294 - 11/14/13 03:43 AM Re: How to get started flying with other people [Re: cjcrank]  
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,599
Frederf Offline
Member
Frederf  Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,599
Agree.

The mechanics of firing a weapon A2A are easy. The practical skills to fight in A2A are hard.

It's roughly the reverse for A2G.

#3863746 - 11/17/13 03:35 PM Re: How to get started flying with other people [Re: - Ice]  
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 284
Haukka81 Offline
Member
Haukka81  Offline
Member

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 284
Kemij�rvi,Finland
Originally Posted By: - Ice
I would disagree with doing air-to-air missions. Firing off a missile is easy, it's getting into a position of good PK while not getting shot at yourself that is difficult. You can fire at max range (Raero, Ropt, or Rpi) but the PK is very low. Just as you get into Rtr or Rmax2 is ideally when you want to fire off a missile but the chances are there is also one on the way to you at this point. And this is dealing with BVR. Load up a couple of rear-aspect Sidewinders and get into a turning fight and you will see how bombing a ground target is way easier. With turning fights as well, it is hard to keep altitude and pretty soon, you may have AAA or a SAM coming up at you.

This isn't to say ground attack is easy. Well, it is, provided you are using only dumb bombs. Obviously, once you start using the Maverick, GBUs or LGBs, things get slightly more complicated but still, I think this is less complicated than understanding the fluid aspect of air-to-air combat especially WVR air-to-air fights. Also, a campaign mission is not the place for a beginner to figure out how to handle Mavs/GBUs/CBUs, that is what training missions are for. By the time a campaign mission is flown, use of these weapons should be nearly second-nature.

As for dealing with threats, again, it is easier to evade AAA and SAMs than it is to evade a MiG-29 hot on your tail. AAA and low-level SAMs? Fly high. This is the Viper, not the Hog, and you should be cruising at Angels 20 or higher anyway to get better fuel economy. Climb to Angels 30 and that's sorted. High-altitude SAMs are also easy to evade because 1) you should be able to see them coming, 2) you have altitude to trade for airspeed, and 3) they will take a few seconds to reach you which gives you time to beam/notch it.

Lastly, if you are attacking a ground target that is well-covered by AAA and high- and low-alt SAMs, you are fk'ed even before you take off anyway. Ideally, you should sort out a SEAD flight to take out the SAMs and AAA radars. This would take the SAMs out of the fight although AAAs can still sometimes engage you at low altitude, but without their radars, they are less effective. Only when you have neutralized as much of the anti-air threat should you be sending in Vipers to bomb it.

I would suggest taking missions where you are tasked to bomb buildings, maybe a nuclear plant or a factory or a port. You can take dumb bombs and make several passes, or take GBU-32s and bomb up to 4 targets in one pass. Missions wherein the target is an airfield is difficult as there are more layers of protection that need to be taken out, and missions where the target is a tank battalion is difficult because you have to search for, ID, then destroy the targets. Too much workload. Buildings don't move.

Hope that helps!




High Alt is no go if SA-10 is anywhere near target.. very little to no warning and then sudent boom mycomputer

Last edited by Haukka81; 11/17/13 03:35 PM.

I5 8400 , 16gb , GTX 1070 oc , Win10 64bit . Virpil T-50 27" monitor with 2560x1440 rez ... DCS + Oculus CV1 + Samsung Odyssey . (odyssey is better for flight sims)

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