You can turn off the mic and cameras.

if Im not playing Xbox One, I'll Unplug Kinect and turn the Xbox OFF OFF, not sleep OFF (which is still in the software due to eastern restrictions on sleep devices.)

So OFF OFF Xbox, Unplug Kinect, when I wanna play plug in kinect power on.

If Obama wants to watch me play FM5 in my boxers, then he'll get what he deserves...

Cool this is the confirmation I hoped to hear hehe

SkatezillaWe have Sony right where we want them. The PS4 is a failure, the Xbox1 is clearly superior.

PS4 has 8% more raw power

Wow, so almost 65fps instead of 60?
Talk about a non-issue there.



The Jedi Master

What are you using to make that assessment? Is it just CPU power? Our studio's Senior Tech Director* was telling me about 2 months ago that one of the biggest differences was going to be the Xbox One's GDDR3 memory versus the PS4's GDDR5 memory.

Did a quick search and this seems to be confirmed by a number of articles. Just grabbed this one as the first Google result, but it's pretty interesting:

http://www.trustedreviews.com/opinions/why-the-ps4-will-be-much-more-powerful-than-the-xbox-one

I post this out of interest, not fanboyism. As someone whose livelihood is dependent on a strong console market, I want both consoles to be (hugely) successful.


*I actually didn't know a huge amount about our Senior Tech Director's background, so I just did a Moby Games search. Turns out that he worked on some of the true classics - Zak McKraken, Maniac Mansion, Secret of Monkey Island, X-Wing, Tie-Fighter, Dark Forces and Mechwarrior 2 amongst others. Apparently I'm working with an industry legend.

Actually, Hardware wise, the PS4 APU has 32-34% more Raw Shader Power. Period.

RAM Wise, I can find faults with both Setups.

DDR3 Ram in the Xbox One also has and 32MB of ESRAM Embedded onto the APU to boost speed of Memory/CPU Data.
32 MB of ESRAM isnt alot, so hopefully it isnt being use for anything GPU Related,
Cuz I doubt you can render a 1080p/60FPS Rendering pipeline with any kind of detail or FSAA off 32MB of Memory.
Most Likely the system kernels or GPU Driver stack is loaded into that 32mb ESRAM.

PS4's GDDR5 Ram is twice as fast as DDR3, But it's also doing 2x to 3x as much work too now than a Normal GFX Card with GDDR5 would be doing.
That GDDR5 Array is now being fed System Ram Requests, GPU Rendering Requests, and also handling the I/O (spooling and storage) of files from the BDROM
(as PS4 Games are not required to be installed).

However, Loading Time wise, games will prolly load within 2-4% of each other across the two systems, as the loading times are mainly depicted by the Speed of the Harddisk and BDROMs.

GDDR5 is Based on DDR3, It has a lot more bandwidth, but slower latencies as a result.

Since XboxOne is required to install everything, it removes the BDROM Bottleneck (not that the 5400 2.5 Inch Samsung Drive is any faster).

However, BOTH systems are using 8GB of Unified memory on a Single 16 Chip Array.

One has higher Latencies and Bandwidth, one has lower Bandwidth and Latencies.

Lower Latencies allow more tasks to be started per cycle, higher bandwidth allows those completed tasks to complete faster.

So, If your gonna be trying to run everything (System, File Spooling and I/O, GFX Textures etc) from the Same Memory Bank,
Then Lower Latencies will benefit more than Higher Bandwidths, As the Lower latencies will be able to start more of the tasks per APU Cycle.


Every Article that was ProSONY for GDDR5 was Published over 3 weeks ago, and touts the Memory Bandwidth of the PS4,
That insane Bandwidth is only good when the system is using the memory Controller for limited functions (ie GFX).
However; it's not, it's using it for O/S Requests, Texture requests, I/O, File spooling from the BDROM/HDD Requests etc.

The difference between lower latencies and higher bandwidth is prolly marginal in the grand scheme of things,
but to give a Win to Sony simply because that bandwidth number is higher, while the latency is also higher; is ridiculous,

I'm gonna need some of the reviewers/previewers to actually look at the complete specs and what they are being used for.
Lower Latencies for a widely used system Array of memory is better than higher bandwidths, specially considering the Low Clocks of the CPU Cores and Limited TDP.


Xbox Ones DDR3 is at about 17.6 Gb/sec @ DDR3-2133, however if the chips are in dual Channel mode it's 35.2gb/sec and if they are in Triple Chanel mode 52.8, Obviously the AMD Jaguar Compute Unit's Memory controller would most likely run in Dual Channel Mode.
*(MS Spec sheet lists the Micron Chips and memory speeds as 8GB of 256 Bit, 68.3GB/sec DDR3, and 32 MB of ESRAM AT 102GB/sec)


While PS4's GDDR5 would be about 48 GB/s if the memory controller is running 1500Mhz, which I have no data on, but I havent looked at any updated spec sheets. so if they end up running them at Stock 1250Mhz its about 40 Gb/sec and 1000mhz would be about 32 gb/sec.

* Edit: I think PS4 Runs 1375Mhz based on Tech PDFs I just got, so it would actually be about 44 GB/sec x4, 176gb/sec)

So what's faster at moving and processing data, X Functions at 1/4 of the speed or X-Y Functions at 4x of the speed.
So What's better for a Memory Array used by every resource in the system (CPU/GPU/PPU/IO/ etc etc) More Functions per Clock or Less Functions per clock?

The Speed of the GDDR5 is further Hampered by the Single Memory controller in the AMD Jaguar Compute Units,
Are the Jaguar Memory Controllers Rated for that Bandwidth?, I dont even think they are rated for DDR3 2133, let alone GDDR5 @ 5.5Ghz

Both Consoles will be using 16 Chip Arrays, so Power Consumption is prolly marginal differences.

CPU Wise Xbox One will have 32MB of OnChip Ram, while PS4 will have 384 Stream Processors, so that power consumption will prolly be pretty close when you factor in everything. (except KinectOne)

So the only spot PS4 really has more power, is in RAW Shader count, and Technical Bandwidths, whether or not all the bandwidth is used by the controller or not remains to be seen, and whether or not the high Latency configuration of the Memory Array hampers that high bandwidth or not remains to be seen..

384 More shaders at 1080p is kinda pointless, 764 GCN Shaders with direct access to the memory array and directly linked to the CPU front end is enough to run any recent games at 1080p with at least 2x FSAA. Well 384 shaders can give you more FSAA or 120hz/3d. (Maybe).

Microsoft also has IllumiRoom in the works, which will expand the outputted image from the HDTV to the surround wall and floor infront of the gamer.

"The American forces are very far away. I would say they are about, uh, exactly 8% farther away than you think. Yes, I calculate it to be 8%. Do not look behind the curtain please."

My Long post was a proper technical Analysis, not a fanboy PoV.

The Kinect is a gimmick, and not even a very good gimmick. Requiring it to be connected for your console to work is just being a bit thick about the whole thing.

I think it's foolish to think that MS is going to win this battle by posting of specs of each console.

MS has made a huge publicity and marketing error by assuming the public is going to let them heavily infringe on their rights especially in relation to trading or selling games.

In the end this mistake is going to cost MS big time and even if they reverse their horrible decisions against privacy and consumer rights it's going to take years to recover the lost market.

The "battle" will only be won by games. Hardware, online/offline, used games or whatever will mean nothing once the gaming starts. That's just all people have to talk about right now. LOL

I agree and unlike the current gen, with both nextgen having similar AMD hardware, I think we will finally see some apples to apples comparisons of the same game on both consoles, and it could be interesting especially if some devs provide features to enable the benefits of Sony's higher specs on some games.

I would say though that Sony came out of E3 with a lot more consumer and dev momentum than they went in with, mostly thanks to not changing anything and Microsoft's arrogance and taunting of consumer opinion... It will be interesting to see if that momentum affects how game devs and publishers focus on each console.

"Microsoft Touts '100 Percent Always-On' Xbox One To Advertisers"


...and this my friends is what it ultimately is about. Mining the right data so you can sell advertising better. This is why a connection is mandatory instead of being optional.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/andy-plesser/microsoft-touts-100-perce_b_3460771.html

You don't know what you are talking about SZ, plus pulled that 8% out of your backside. Back it up, show how you got to 8%. I'm thinking you won't.

The fact that you think 'file spooling' is a factor in comparing GDDR5 through-put or that 384 more shaders or 18 execution units don't help render (yeah, cause a r7790 works just like a r7870 duh?) basically just made me flip my bozo bit on you.

Also, good job on telling people the PS4 DRM would be the same as the XBones. No credibility, especially after what you said about SimHQ folk back on CombatAce.. sorry, but just meme pictures to deal with you from now on. Loosen up that cheerleader costume a bit and smell the coffee.

I don't much care PS4 vs XBone either way but I can't stand the cheerleaders spreading misinformation and spouting specs.

Oh my...I haven't seen Fearless get that fired up before...keep in mind this is someone that stepped up to moderate the COD forums
during the bloodbath that was the product launch...and did a great job. I guess I will have to watch my step now that he's off the chain!

Been fun. Well, not really, but I'm outta here. I think the "C" in PWEC should now stand for console.





PS...Skate's been a helpful member of the community and getting personal like that is uncalled for.

He has been helpful in certain things...but he was handing out smackdowns to those of us that suggested that the DRM might be different
for Sony...and did so with a certain arrogance as if he knew for sure.

That's not really a biggie...folks do it often. I am however a little disappointed that a member that spends so much time
here would be slamming SimHQ on another forum. It doesn't matter who I squabble with here, I think of SimHQ as my "home" on the internet and like coming to a place with familiar faces.

Good discussion up till now of a contentious topic that tends to attract strong feelings (defensive/offensive) expressed as facts and especially this time with consumer DRM and privacy issues added in.

I think it's good to disagree with each other, call out when things or analysis are wrong or not based on facts, and even rib each other at times, but we should keep the discussion on the topic and not personal.

Hopefully the mods can cleanup where it went over the line and we can continue this discussion over the next few months, as more technical details and benchmarks become available it should reduce the room for opinion as facts.

My $.02