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#3722312 - 01/21/13 03:48 PM Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2
kramer Offline
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Registered: 04/02/02
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http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/a...meTraining.aspx

Quote:
The Army and Navy are seeking out video game technology to engage young soldiers and sailors, and both services plan on awarding major contracts in 2013 for virtual, PC-based training.

The industry needs to find a way to get past the older code that’s sitting out there,” he said. “They [soldiers] look at these simulators, and they don’t take them seriously because they don’t look as good as what they’re playing in their living rooms.

Currently, the Army is conducting a competition for the flagship of its Games for Training program, with an award of approximately $44.5 million over five years. It wants another first-person shooter to replace Bohemia Interactive’s Virtual Battlespace 2 (VBS2).

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#3722396 - 01/21/13 06:00 PM Re: Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2 [Re: kramer]
Jedi Master Offline
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LOL, now the DoD is complaining about eye candy!



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#3722491 - 01/21/13 09:32 PM Re: Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2 [Re: kramer]
Coot Offline
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Heehee biggrin Its a slippery slope from here. Its Rainbow6 to COD all over again.
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#3723712 - 01/23/13 08:38 PM Re: Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2 [Re: kramer]
Apocalypse31 Offline
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Thank goodness. It's about time.

The thing about VBS-2 isnt the graphics, but the horrible gameplay. The terribly programmed AI that normally just run off and die and the bulky and outdated (and UGLY) engine that make it such a pain to use the system.
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#3723716 - 01/23/13 08:45 PM Re: Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2 [Re: kramer]
Coot Offline
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Why not Arma3?
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#3723797 - 01/23/13 11:11 PM Re: Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2 [Re: Coot]
Linebacker Offline
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Originally Posted By: Coot
Why not Arma3?

+1

I was thinking a contemporary version of ARMA 3 or bring in the boys from Ground Branch!

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#3724434 - 01/24/13 09:13 PM Re: Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2 [Re: kramer]
Apocalypse31 Offline
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Anyone play ArmA 3 yet?

It doesn't look much better than ArmA 2, personally speaking.

I'm just not a fan of Bohemia. Id rather see a simulation based off the Frostbite or Unreal Engines
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#3724463 - 01/24/13 10:05 PM Re: Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2 [Re: Apocalypse31]
ricnunes Offline
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Registered: 12/17/01
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Originally Posted By: Apocalypse31
Anyone play ArmA 3 yet?

It doesn't look much better than ArmA 2, personally speaking.

I'm just not a fan of Bohemia. Id rather see a simulation based off the Frostbite or Unreal Engines



Despite having been a OFP:CWC, OFP:Resistance and Armed Assault fan and currently being an ArmA2 fan mostly because there's absolutely no other MODERN FPS/Tactical shooter game besides ArmA2 I must admit that you're right when you say that the ArmA's engine gameplay is very "clunky".

But it's also a fact that there's no other game engine that I know of that has a comproved capability of multiplayer games with large dozens of players (maybe more than a hundred) together with hundreds of AI units while modeling maps with the size of hundreds of square kilometers with enterable buildings where players can roam freely around the map without any kind of limitations and at the same time modeling all sorts of vehicles ranging from cars, tanks, helicopters, fixed-wing aircraft, boats, etc... where several players can even control the same vehicle (for example one player driving a tank while an another player is controlling the gunner position of that same tank and another player controlling the commander station of this same tank). What are the other games or game engines that allow this??

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#3724506 - 01/25/13 12:22 AM Re: Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2 [Re: kramer]
ebud Offline
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Registered: 06/19/06
Posts: 39
I haven't been to IITSEC for a couple of years, but for about 6 years I had to work it every year and never once saw anything that could beat VBS in sheer scope. You would always see something that could do one aspect much better, but never anything that could do half as much, even half as good, let alone have even 1/4 of the content.

Everyone wants/wanted to come up with the VBS "killer" because there is a LOT of $$$ to be made, but from talking to people who still work out in Research Park here in Orlando doing heavy sim work, anything to replace VBS2 basically has to be VBS2, only better, but different. Good luck with that. Just generating the same amount of content would run into the six figures. I used to work for managers who would just come to us every couple of years to write up a requirements doc on what it would actually take to make a replacement. They could never actually believe us when we told them the amount of models needed, the terrain, etc. Just think about what VBS2 can do, what is has and what it would take to duplicate EVERYTHING in a new engine.

I've been away from contracting a few years, but right now VBS2 from what other devs and trainers tell me is pretty entrenched. Just replacing it and writing new training programs would be huge. Also there are TONS of VBS2 related contracts out there spending millions that you never hear about as well. FOr example, I know a guy who is helping to just convert years of old openflight content to VBS2 format. I doubt any of it will ever get used honestly. If I had a penny from eveyone's paycheck who earned it doing something tied to VBS2 I would be pretty well off.

Anyone can complain about certain aspects of the engine but to replace it would take ungodly amounts of time and money. Look at how much money they thew at the Crytek engine contracts to try and get that going. Looked awesome, but from what I was told, was a HUGE failure. I thought if any engine would work other that all the openflight/metavr sims, it would be the Crytek contract.

If they are serious about replacing it, they need to just award it and start from the ground up rather than expecting to find a replacement all done and ready to go with the same features and content plus whatever new requirements they are throwing in. It's just not going to happen.

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#3724791 - 01/25/13 11:18 AM Re: Army and Navy Looking to Replace VBS 2 [Re: kramer]
ricnunes Offline
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Registered: 12/17/01
Posts: 3763
Loc: Portugal
Well actually I always had my strong doubts that the Crytek engine could or would ever be capable of modeling the same or similar amount of content as the ArmA/VBS engine does. Crytek engine seems IMO to be clearly designed and oriented to small map games (such as Crysis).
At best the Crytek engine could model a small scale tactical simulation similar to Ghost Recon 1 or SWAT4 with a few land and low speed vehicles such as tanks operating very closely to the players.
The "proof" of this is for example the new Chris Roberts space sim game (the "spiritual" sucessor of Wing Commander/Privateer) where the team lead by Chris Roberts is having a very hard time to model very large maps and this in a space simulator which naturaly have maps full of nothing (space or empty space). Now imagine in a simulation similar to VBS/ArmA where the maps are full of stuff!

IMO, the only engine that IMO could somehow compete and model similar capabilities as the VBS/ArmA engine is the Outerra engine. Look here for more detail regarding the Outerra engine:
http://www.outerra.com/

What's interesting about the Outerra is that it models the entire planet and it also allows multiple platforms ranging from men/soldiers, to ground vehicles, air vehicles (helicopters and fixed-wing aircraft), etc... Of course one thing is the engine and it's theorical capabilities other thing is the real capabilities when you have a simulation with lots of units and players mixed in a multiplayer enviourment.


Apart from this I completly agree and understand what ebud says and I also agree that perhaps the best way to replace VBS with something better looking but with the same or better capabilities you'll probably need to develop something "from scratch" which of course would take LOTS OF MONEY!

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