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#3594827 - 06/20/12 02:20 PM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: Skoop]
ricnunes Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/17/01
Posts: 3356
Loc: Portugal
Originally Posted By: Skoop
It sounds like you are describing an "Air Quake" TvT environment, but seriously 90 % of dcs mp servers are coop. Most TvT is in FC2.


In my experience the vast majority of TvT games/sessions do become "Quakes" no matter what game or gametype (Flight sim, FPS, etc...) we are talking about and also it doesn't matter if the games are "realistic" or "arcade".


Quote:

I still think it's a great idea for the CH team to explore the possibility of creating a dcs apache module and create some cash for their own project in the long term. I would buy both sims if they are completed.


One of the problems is that there's absolutely NO garantees that CH gets funded or enought funds by creating an Apache module for DCS (and it was Flexman himself that said this!) and together with this you have the FACT that the DCS sims gameplay is basically the complete/total opposite to what will be CH gameplay and finally add the FACT that DCS sims and CH are inded competing sims (no matter what anyone says and also doesn't matter if both devs don't ackowlege this in public) and with this you'll see enough reasons why for Flexman and his staff doing an Apache (or Chinook) module for DCS isn't a that great idea.

IMO, I think that Flexman and his staff would be better of and better funded if they used the "Kickstarter" project. Kickstarter seems really a great way to get funds and I really advise Flexnam to at least give a look at it, perhaps this the best way for "indie" developers to get funds currently available.


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#3594875 - 06/20/12 04:15 PM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: ricnunes]
GrayGhost Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 12/17/03
Posts: 4314
Originally Posted By: ricnunes
In my experience the vast majority of TvT games/sessions do become "Quakes" no matter what game or gametype (Flight sim, FPS, etc...) we are talking about and also it doesn't matter if the games are "realistic" or "arcade".


You're playing with the wrong people ... but then again, the reason why most of these turn into 'quakes' is because the vast majority are unable or unwilling to keep up with the skills needed to play with the 'right people'. Can't blame them much smile


Quote:
One of the problems is that there's absolutely NO garantees that CH gets funded or enought funds by creating an Apache module for DCS (and it was Flexman himself that said this!)


Yeah, that was Flexman's decision, and he knows why he's making it.

Quote:
and together with this you have the FACT that the DCS sims gameplay is basically the complete/total opposite to what will be CH gameplay


How do you know? Flexman and his crew may intend something, but you're talking as if you had a crystal ball here ... it's ok though, a lot of us have been there. I'm not sure how you came up with this antithesis in gameplay when you haven't played CH.

Quote:
and finally add the FACT that DCS sims and CH are inded competing sims (no matter what anyone says and also doesn't matter if both devs don't ackowlege this in public) and with this you'll see enough reasons why for Flexman and his staff doing an Apache (or Chinook) module for DCS isn't a that great idea.


Is that Flexman's opinion? I mean, he may think so as well, but that isn't what he said - so I believe smile

Quote:
IMO, I think that Flexman and his staff would be better of and better funded if they used the "Kickstarter" project. Kickstarter seems really a great way to get funds and I really advise Flexnam to at least give a look at it, perhaps this the best way for "indie" developers to get funds currently available.


He's got about as much a guarantee to get funded through KS as he does through making a DCS module. KS worked for some people. It really does not work for everyone.


Edited by GrayGhost (06/20/12 04:17 PM)
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#3594904 - 06/20/12 04:55 PM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: BANITA]
komemiute Offline
Hell Drummer
Senior Member

Registered: 05/03/09
Posts: 2682
Flex stated he CAN'T use KS, IIRC...
There are other opportunities, luckily.

biggrin

Flexhimself
"It is a frustrating situation. Kickstarter has been mentioned by some readers. They are popular atm, seems every man and his dog is funding re-makes on it. Unless I can find a business development manager to set-up a US based entity it's not going to be an option for us. I don't have the time or experience of US business law to set one up. One UK developer (Carmageddon) recently had to do just that, I envy them."
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#3599409 - 06/29/12 05:24 PM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: komemiute]
CTR69 Offline
Member

Registered: 10/30/11
Posts: 232
Originally Posted By: komemiute
Flex stated he CAN'T use KS, IIRC...
There are other opportunities, luckily.

biggrin

Flexhimself
"It is a frustrating situation. Kickstarter has been mentioned by some readers. They are popular atm, seems every man and his dog is funding re-makes on it. Unless I can find a business development manager to set-up a US based entity it's not going to be an option for us. I don't have the time or experience of US business law to set one up. One UK developer (Carmageddon) recently had to do just that, I envy them."


They should use indiegogo fundraiser system. Beczl is using this for funding his DCS mig21 development. I'd be happy to chip in 30-40 euros in CH, if it would speed up the development process.

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#3600514 - 07/02/12 04:48 AM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: CTR69]
EagleEye[GER] Offline
Member

Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 1012
Loc: Germany
Originally Posted By: blabo
They should use indiegogo fundraiser system. Beczl is using this for funding his DCS mig21 development. I'd be happy to chip in 30-40 euros in CH, if it would speed up the development process.

Thought about that to, when seen that BECZL is using it. Could`t be that hard to set up an indiegogo account? But I think that Flex is aware of indiegogo and surely have thought about it...
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#3601090 - 07/03/12 07:30 AM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: GrayGhost]
ricnunes Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/17/01
Posts: 3356
Loc: Portugal
Originally Posted By: GrayGhost

Quote:
and together with this you have the FACT that the DCS sims gameplay is basically the complete/total opposite to what will be CH gameplay


How do you know? Flexman and his crew may intend something, but you're talking as if you had a crystal ball here ... it's ok though, a lot of us have been there. I'm not sure how you came up with this antithesis in gameplay when you haven't played CH.



If you look into both sims features you have for DCS:
- Static Campaigns (sequence of single missions that you must acomplish in order to play the next mission and end the campaign). This campaign always end in the same way which is after you sucessfully end the campaign's last mission you win the campaign.
- More detail/priority regarding flight, avionics and damage model -> Claimed to be the most realistic/close to reality in these regards ever seen in a sim and even in some cases claimed to be "same as reality".
- Resuming, as opposed to the 90's sims DCS sims gameplay is modeled around the aircraft/platform itself and not so much regarding the "surrounding world".

For CH you will have (at least what is planned):
- Dynamic campaigns where you get diferent missions everytime you play/restart the campaign where you can lose a mission and still play the "next one". Actually the way you play your missions will dictate which missions or kind of missions will "spawn" after and also the campaign's final outcome (success, failure, etc...)
- While realism regarding flight, avionics and damage model is a goal, these realism features are planned to be an aproximation to reality rather than an "exact replica" to reality (as it's planned in DCS). A higher priority is planned to go towards more detailed/immersive gameplay features such as dynamic campaigns with persistent world, pilot career, etc...
- Resuming, just as in the 90's sims CH gameplay seems that will be modeled around the pilot itself and the world around him/her and not so much around the aircraft/platform itself.


Well, I can't see a bigger antithesis in gameplay regarding sims than this! wink



Originally Posted By: GrayGhost

Quote:
and finally add the FACT that DCS sims and CH are inded competing sims (no matter what anyone says and also doesn't matter if both devs don't ackowlege this in public) and with this you'll see enough reasons why for Flexman and his staff doing an Apache (or Chinook) module for DCS isn't a that great idea.


Is that Flexman's opinion? I mean, he may think so as well, but that isn't what he said - so I believe smile


Don't know if this is Flexman's oppinion or not, you'll have to ask him but both sims (DCS and CH) are directed to the same "audience"/customer base therefore like it or not they are competing games (or sims if you prefer).



Originally Posted By: GrayGhost

Quote:
IMO, I think that Flexman and his staff would be better of and better funded if they used the "Kickstarter" project. Kickstarter seems really a great way to get funds and I really advise Flexnam to at least give a look at it, perhaps this the best way for "indie" developers to get funds currently available.


He's got about as much a guarantee to get funded through KS as he does through making a DCS module. KS worked for some people. It really does not work for everyone.


Nope, with Kickstarter you pleage a value (for a certain amount of time/days) without selling anything (at least immediatly) and if you get the designed pleaged value you get that money (again without selling or finishing your game). The worst case scenario would be not to get the pleaged value and you would get back to where you started -> without getting any money but also without losing money.
Selling CH as a DCS module you would first need to finish the game (invest from your pocket) and worst case scenario is if you don't get enough sales you would end up expending more than you get from sales income and all of this for a "direct competing" sim.

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#3601619 - 07/04/12 07:27 AM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: ricnunes]
komemiute Offline
Hell Drummer
Senior Member

Registered: 05/03/09
Posts: 2682
Quote:

Selling CH as a DCS module you would first need to finish the game (invest from your pocket) and worst case scenario is if you don't get enough sales you would end up expending more than you get from sales income and all of this for a "direct competing" sim.



Not true, Beczl with its Mig21 is doing a DCS module that's being funded with an option like Kickstarter = he is getting money before the completion of the module.
_________________________
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Para_Bellum

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MigBuster

"What people like and what critics praise are rarely the same thing. 'Critic' is just another one of those unnecessary, overpaid, parasitic jobs that the human race has churned out so that clever slackers won't have to actually get a real job and possibly soil their hands."
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#3601707 - 07/04/12 11:15 AM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: BANITA]
EagleEye[GER] Offline
Member

Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 1012
Loc: Germany
Hmm, the primary factor is spare time now, me thinks. What is AD doing in the meantime? wave
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#3619400 - 08/03/12 09:09 AM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: BANITA]
EagleEye[GER] Offline
Member

Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 1012
Loc: Germany
Flex`s Twitter:
Quote:
New build of CH completed. First in quite a few weeks.

smile
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#3619680 - 08/03/12 03:06 PM Re: Longbow Combat-Helo, a secret no more. [Re: BANITA]
guod Offline
Lifer

Registered: 09/29/00
Posts: 21670
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