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#3604028 - 07/09/12 11:43 AM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: GrayGhost]
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Member
Registered: 01/12/12
Posts: 171
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To compound this, the B-2 can drop munitions from a fairly long distance depending on its flight profile. The GBU's it drops are essentially glide-bombs, and they will happily glide for a little while ... so there's a bit more stand-off capability than for the F-117.
Did they used JSOW? Because JDAM's "glide" capability is not much different from that of ordinary iron bomb.
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#3604034 - 07/09/12 11:54 AM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Lonewolf357]
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Member
Registered: 12/31/09
Posts: 1733
Loc: Hungary, Europe
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To compound this, the B-2 can drop munitions from a fairly long distance depending on its flight profile. The GBU's it drops are essentially glide-bombs, and they will happily glide for a little while ... so there's a bit more stand-off capability than for the F-117.
Did they used JSOW? Because JDAM's "glide" capability is not much different from that of ordinary iron bomb. They used (calculations based on the receiving side...)  2000lbs (907kg) 609 GBU-31/1 Mk-84 43 GBU-31/3 BLU-109 4700lbs (2130kg) 4 GBU-37/B All-together 656 weapons during 45 sorties with 87% of hit rate.
Edited by Hpasp (07/09/12 12:29 PM)
_________________________
Hpasp Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch" http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home
While Fighter Pilots made movies, SAM Officers made History. (U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
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#3604092 - 07/09/12 01:17 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Lonewolf357]
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Senior Member
Registered: 12/17/03
Posts: 4372
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It's quite different, actually. While the glide ratio undoubtedly sucks, you're not going to 'glide' an iron bomb onto a target from 10nm. You might hit, sure, but with the JDAM you will hit. Those little strakes turn a bullet into a lifting body. It makes some difference. Did they used JSOW? Because JDAM's "glide" capability is not much different from that of ordinary iron bomb.
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-- 44th VFW
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#3604094 - 07/09/12 01:21 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: GrayGhost]
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Member
Registered: 12/31/09
Posts: 1733
Loc: Hungary, Europe
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It's quite different, actually. While the glide ratio undoubtedly sucks, you're not going to 'glide' an iron bomb onto a target from 10nm. You might hit, sure, but with the JDAM you will hit. Those little strakes turn a bullet into a lifting body. It makes some difference. Problem is that the SAM's were could be pop up unexpectedly bit more than ~15nm before the target in your path, with 14nm range, so you need to cross their destruction zone (alltogether ~30nm,from 60 feet till 60'000 feet in altitude), anyway...
Edited by Hpasp (07/09/12 01:41 PM)
_________________________
Hpasp Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch" http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home
While Fighter Pilots made movies, SAM Officers made History. (U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
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#3604100 - 07/09/12 01:30 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Senior Member
Registered: 12/17/03
Posts: 4372
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My mistake anyway, the B-2's back then used GAMs, not JDAM's. GAMs don't seem to have a lifting body kit installed, so the drop range would be shorter.
And yes, I understand about positioning of the SAM ... but it seems they had no effect on B-2 flights. I would guess they were busy with other things.
_________________________
-- 44th VFW
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#3604160 - 07/09/12 03:17 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Junior Member
Registered: 11/03/11
Posts: 37
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I think that someone posted here interview with Zelko where he says that there were some 60+ unsuccessfil fireings at B2's. Serbian pvo know about b2s but didnt have means to shot it down
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#3604193 - 07/09/12 04:03 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Senior Member
Registered: 12/17/03
Posts: 4372
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Zoltan did not even know he had shot at an F-117. How the heck would others know that they were shooting at B-2's?
_________________________
-- 44th VFW
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#3604211 - 07/09/12 04:27 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Junior Member
Registered: 11/03/11
Posts: 37
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I said Zelko(F117 pilot) not Zoltan. And he was referring that stelth doesn't mean invisibility but rather low observability
Edited by Zoky (07/09/12 04:28 PM)
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#3604286 - 07/09/12 06:25 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Member
Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 1318
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Mind you NATO seems to have a blind spot where guidance signals = firing, which just isn't true for most of these...
They did it during Linebacker, the A12 missions some years previously, and seem to be making the same error here. 'Searching' with the FCR for an elusive target visible on a longer wavelength radar and not finding it is not exactly the same as an 'unsuccessful firing', neither is locking a target 'firing' a missile, no matter how strident the ECM gear is about it. Only where a weapon leaves the rail can you talk about a fired missile.
At best the remainder are "unsuccessful engagements", or "acquisitions with no engagement", or "incomplete acquisitions".
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#3604347 - 07/09/12 09:14 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Zoky]
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Senior Member
Registered: 12/17/03
Posts: 4372
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'Everyone' knows that stealth means 'significant reduction in detection range' and not invisible. How would he know what the Serbs knew? I said Zelko(F117 pilot) not Zoltan. And he was referring that stelth doesn't mean invisibility but rather low observability
Edited by GrayGhost (07/09/12 09:15 PM)
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