Saw this video posted over at AVSIM and thought it was pretty cool. The Icon A5 is one of the featured aircraft in Flight. This video shows some of the interesting flight characteristics of the A5. Very good promotional video..





BeachAV8R

Interesting video Beach, thanks.

Still have my reservations about it though, and what it will do in regards to further training into more complex types.
I'm probably showing my age here, but if a student pilot trains on an aircraft that cannot be spun, will he have it ingrained in
him / her the dangers of the spin from day one?

Sure, they could move on to more complex aircraft with full spin capability, but these bigger more complex aircraft seem to be more
aggressive in spin and stall behaviors. I'm not dissing the aircraft at all; in my view, it is awesome that they have achieved this, but when I also think of the docile spin characteristics of the C150 range, well, hardly that aggressive is it?

Also, the pre-cursors to put you into a stall or spin anyway is usually a result of poor airman ship / lack of concentration anyway. I feel that a concept aircraft like this would only lead to ab initio pilots feeling bulletproof if they've done their training in one.

I still have respect for the aggressive stall characteristic of the Beech and Socata lines - and even though I did not have to, after I did my ab initio, I went on to do aerobatics to find out just how aggressive things CAN get if you push the limits. And it taught me a lot about respecting the limits of the aircraft and myself.

AJ.

I thought this was a fake plane for the Flight sim! What they have done is amazing. It enables the hobby pilot to fly a lot more safely and will surely save a lot of lives. Let's not forget how old planes like the Cessna are. If they were cars they would have been outlawed long ago. This is a huge advancement that hopefully will find it's way into other aircraft.

Those familiar with the Ercoupe probably recognize a lot of the goals the A5 is striving for (low stall speed, benign stall characteristics, near impossible to spin..)





BeachAV8R

Looks like they picked the 150 not so much for the reason it is "one of the most proven light aircraft", but rather because it spins like a top. If they had used a 172 the demonstration wouldn't have looked so dramatic. Of course, the 150 is a great training plane so it would be expected to spin well, but i guess we don't go there these days.

If they have gimped the rudder, I wonder how they will end up dealing with crosswinds?

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. I've held a 172 with full aft elevator and just mushed it along with plenty of controllability with the rudders for gentle turns... That was probably a 152 Aerobat model..which is a bit of a sporty Cessna..

FishTaco brings up valid points. I think spin recovery and unusual attitude training should be part of every pilots recurrent training. Spending 15 minutes doing some upset training is time well spent every couple of years. Since the base turn to final, low speed, high bank angle turn still kills so many pilots I think particular emphasis on that during recurrent training is worthwhile. Demonstrating how "top rudder" can kill you close to the ground is a good eye opening experience.

BeachAV8R

Spin recovery isn't even part of initial training anymore. I "know" the steps (PARENT) to theoretically recover from a spin, but I've never spun or been in a spinning aircraft. My instructor told me that there were more spin-related training accidents than actual accidents resulting from inadvertent spins, so they removed it from private pilot training requirements.

The next investment I make toward flight training will probably be an aerobatics course. I've heard it's one of the best things you can do to make yourself a safer pilot.

That shouldn't be a reason not to design, fly in, or learn to fly in a safer airplane.

Spin awareness and recovery can still be emphasized by the instructor during training. One could always have a couple spin lessons in C-172 and then go back to learning in his/her Icon.

Malibu;

I tend to disagree with you, given that the C172 has more docile spin characteristics than a C150/-152 Aerobat. Spins and stalls by their very definition can be extremely violent, and in my experience, this needs to be driven home to the potential pilot at a very early stage.

I'm not sure what the training syllabus is like in the U.S, but here in Australia, even to get your GFPT, you MUST do at least a little bit of spin recovery. Again, I have nothing against the Icon, but also, to make the instruments in an aircraft appear like a car, as apposed to the standard "T-Six" that we are all used to, I still don't think it's going about it the right way.

I can also see this as possibly delaying an individual picking up "the scan" that we all do.

Just everything being made too easy for the newer generations again. Shame.

Andrew.