Well World of Tanks animated me to search for a good tank game, of course something on a higher level so a real tank sim not this WoT shooter level.
Searching around I don't see much, the latest seems to be T-34 vs. Tiger, is there nothing else?

The number of potential customers is too limited, so the developer's focus has been on single player simulations. The masses seem to only want eye candy and fast/easy play.

GraviTeam's work on WW2 tank sims is the most current. http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/forums/238/1/Graviteam_Sims.html .

RO and RO2, but I have stayed a way from that game engine for my own reasons.

There are some indy mods of other game engines, but the length of development depends on the amount of man hours they have available. Hopefully others will tell you which game mods to check out.

I am now under a 5 year NDA with Nordic Games for the Panzer Elite game code, so I can only hobby code unless a serious team could be created to do a commercial product combining PEA, PESE and PEx.

TPA who TWI

Digging further the the Tank sim pool I see that a lot mention Panzer Eite Gold but an over 10 year old game is simply too old.
The rest seems to center on GraviTeams "Steel Fury Kharkov 1942" but what about there Achtung Panzer series?
I don't look thru how many there are besides "Achtung Panzer: Kharkov 1943" I see "Achtung Panzer: Operation Star" and some add-ons for that but there seem to be another title http://www.graviteam.com/games/178.html .

For an old game Panzer Elite looks pretty reasonable, with heaps of game play.



PE is still my favorite tank sim and the PEDG guys have done so much to improve the ole girl.

Indeed that looks better that some videos I saw.
Is there a total mod? Seems like a bunch a smaller mods would be needed to form this improvement.

Here is a good start for you Duke.

http://home.comcast.net/~ab707/pex/

http://pedg.yuku.com/topic/2144/Patch-candidate-1-01

and I am sure Brit44 Aldo will add more info as needed.

The Panther screen shot is from the new Breakout map and missions by slomo and the screen shot is using the new extended view distance created by Brit44 Aldo.

A very nice mission to play from both sides and a real challenge as the Allies.

Wow, that looks totally different than my PE. Time to try out this mod.

Steel Fury is the only contemporary WWII tank sim worth buying. Operation Star is good but it is a RTS wargame and not a tank sim.

For SP Panzer Elite PEX is really great a wonderful job by Slomo and Aldo44 and Steel Fury with tons of new models, mods and new missions.

There's also Iron Front liberation 1944 made with the Arma 2 engine.Loook it up in this forum in the Arma 2 threads.

Otherwise very little WW2 content except for R.O. and R.O.2 and BF2 with WW2 mods

Murkz likes to post images which are a best of because he is either beta testing and/or knows enough to apply the game engine changes to his install. No offence Murkz, just trying to make it clear about the image you posted.

PEx release 1.0 has few graphical improvements to the 3D tank models. There are a few to show what can be done. To the best of my knowledge, Solmo is working on updating PP2 (the project shown by Murkz), and I assume BobR is continuing to work on updating PE3.

Best place to ask about PEx is http://www.pedg.yuku.com/ or PM me through SimHQ if I miss something.

How is T-34 vs. Tiger compared to Steel Fury?

I'm running SF now with the SPM mod and it looks very good, you don't see that the game is already 4 years old, performance worries me as I had framerates under 20 but I new graphic card is already planned for the summer.

Are there mods that pimp TvT in a similar way?

That is true, but adding MP to "Steel Fury" would give a second life to that game because it has the entire necessary requirement to make it a success, and it is already finalized!

Well I doubt that the moders can add multiplayer to the game.

Btw how good is "Steel Armor:Blaze of War"?
I know it doesn't cover WW2 but I wonder if mods could do that.
Maybe if the engine is good enough so an expansion would be something that can be considered, it could cover WW2 or any other era that seems appropriate like Korea or even a fictional WW3 as I find the choice of the current theaters very strange.

I think I remember reading one of the Russian/Ukrainian modders for SF saying that SF models could be imported into SABoW but it would require a lot of work apparenrly.It's probably doable but whether it will actually be done remains to be seen...

However graviteam is or was working on a successor to Sf.Due later this year I think.So you may want to wait a bit...

Otherwise you have WW2 fps like Red Orchestra 1 and 2, Iron Front Liberation( a WW2 mod made for Arma 2) which look pretty good.

A successor to SF?
Well that would be interesting, does anyone know details about it?

There are Mods available for TvsT that cost $$$ as its an ongoing project,
Subscription is good for a years worth of upgrades. There is a free download
that changes Mission 1 Ger&Rus and fixes some bugs in original version
Go to Tanksim and lookup ZEEWOLF
Scootin-Newton

Me and yl99106 (numbers are a guess) are currently doing just this

What are you doing?? Are you importing SF models into SABoW???

That would be great !!!




Txema

Just got PE. Where do I get the PEDG mod from? Looks fantastic.

Got to the site, cant find a mod pack.

If I install PE-X, how would I graphically improve the game?

http://pedg.yuku.com/topic/2109/PP2-x

PP2-x is here.

Ok, so PE-X and then PP2-X?

just PP2-x. PEx is the original PE with the game engine modifications and a few graphical items to show the possabilities. There are only 3 of us doing amy work on this, so progress is slow (and I took the last 6 weeks off).

Thanks! Its great to see such dedicated support for 'the' WWII tank sim.

I'm assuming I have to run it under win 98 compatibility?

Only use compatibility mode if you are having stability issues. Most memory issues have been corrected.

Thanks, it looks fantastic compared to the old vanilla game I remember. Dove head first into the Normandy campaign and wow, the AI is aggressive and smart.

I've been using the Jagdpanther and other tanks - is it me or is the gunsight dialing off? I set to 500M and it goes completely somewhere else. Also is the German aimpoint to the right, because the shell never goes in straight on top of the large triangle.

I am not sure if the gun data of PP2x has all of the calibration done. I did the guns used for PEx. Alt plus KP+ and Alt plus KP- are used to change the optics calibration. To save the calibration, you have to edit the fifth entry of the guns.csv data

The 7,5 cm KwK 42 L/70 should have a calibrations some where around 11.

There is a known bug in the Sflzf optic that is fixed in patch 1.02 of PEx
(Sflzf optic } http://images.yuku.com/image/pjpeg/cad35b673e61efae5c948c48f49e7f20d152190.jpg

German optics did not use a convergance, so the small triangle to the right is used for the main gun and the one to the second to the right is used for the Coaxial MG.

Allied optics in PE still use the original PE cheat of positioning the optic at the bore of the gun. The Germans are hard coded to the left. Wat needs to be done is a vertex added to the 3D model to define the location of the optical. It's on the list of things to do.

Forgive a noob question - PP2 is a 'mod' patch update to the original Panzer Elite game?

So if I buy Panzer Elite SE from GOG.com, PP2 should be the only patch I need?

Yes, and the same is true for PP2x.

PP2 is a subset of the snow/night mod found on the PESE bonus disk. It is the additional playable tanks without the night or snow option. The previous bonus disk had Snow/Night as a seperate mod, with a seperate mod activator. I am not sure which bonus disk GOG has now. On the new version, PP2 is the same as the SN Summer Day mod. If you want just PP2 and not the entire Snow/Night mod, you can find it in my archive (http://home.comcast.net/~ab707/mp/).

Aldo, Slomo - thank you so much for the PP2-X mod and all the work you guys and the others put into what it contains. Just started to explore it and it appears to represent some significant leaps ahead in presentation of the earth as well as the combat elements and their graphics and modeling. I know you have YEARS of effort put into the sim. It shows!

Much of the world editing stuff exists in the original editing tools. You still need to use them to create new maps.

The thanks need to go to the entire community that desires a WW2 tank sim with the quality that the fly guys seem to get with every generation of computer hardware. yes I am envious of them.

Too bad the other PEx programmers could not be convinced, because Nordic Games had offered to grant access to the PEA game code. 2006 rendering and server based MP combined with all the realism work, it could have been sweet. Fortunatly other WW2 tank sim projects are out there.

PE has it's place in the evolution of computer simulation. It continues to be a good learning tool for wanabee modders.

Hey, Aldo. Interesting stuff. Regarding MP servers. Had they been implemented, would they have continued to be HTH/PvP only, no co-op?

Is that game code access offer and all possibility gone essentially forever?

Regardless, thanks again.

I have no partnership with Nordic Gmaes, I simply tell a history.

Since I was alone at code, I did the historical work for PE (what a sorry state NG purchased) that NG needed. The work reminded me of the harsh fealing all of us modders had from PESE. Fortunatly, age and wisdom had tought me to be quiet and continue in my chosen role. it's a role I chose after the second "great mod war".

I have not asked for access to the PEA code, even though I signed the NDA. I know that alone I can not make the PE title profitable again for NG, so why bother. it was also public knowledge how many projects were to release in 2012. A wise friend one told me "PE is a play".

If a project could be commercialy vialble, I am sure Nordic Games would listen to any offer. I will gladly participate in any project that agrees to the original PEx member agreament (fair compensation for all envolved, based upon content and earnings), and agrees to the stipulations of the copywrite owner ( now, Nordic Games).

If Nordic Games chooses to create a new project, as JoWooD did with PE and PEA, I will give the same silence as I did to JoWooD. that is my limit by law.

any one setiously interested in a pay only upon compleation project?

I'm been quietly watching this thread for a little while now, and you've really got my curiosity piqued. How hard is it to put together PE + mods pack playable on Win 7? Is it going to be a really complex mod installation and tweaking? Is there a place that community meets and I could get help setting up?

I've done flight sims, sub-sims (not well), and a bit of ArmA. Now it's time to learn WWII tanking!

Thanks for the information, Aldo. Yes, I would pay for an upgraded PE version.

Question regarding the PP2-X install I have made. The single scenario listing includes 35-40 missions on a side. I had recollections of many PE missions from the various mods, although many may not be included in PP2? I am checking in order to determine whether I have a faulty install. I do see the PP2 logo/name on various places on the menus. When installing PP2-X, I first disabled the PEX mod I already had installed, and then enabled the PP2-X mod with mod enabler. However in my main PESE mission folder I must have something like 90 scn files. They don't get accessed when using one of the mods such as PP2-X?

May I ask what the 'x' after PE and PP2 means?

I'd definitely pay for PE with today's graphics!

Sounds like you did everything right in the install process.

You should have 43 single scenario missions for both Axis and Allied. 40 of these are the original missions included in PE. I added 3 more (Aldo's Brit firing Range and 2 other maps i had been working on for the Brit44/PEx mod.
Then there are 2 more Instant Action scenarios included in the Scenario folder for each side. This would total 90 in all, 45 per side.

PP2x should allow you to play all of the original PE scenarios in either single player or campaign mode.

There are many more scenarios for PE via other mods, but they haven't been added to PP2x.

I have PP2x install on win7 and all works fine.

Installation: Requires PE patched to version 1.2. The GOG version is already patched so install that and then unzip the contents of PP2x (or whichever mod you are interested in). Extract contents into the "Mods" folder located in the main PE folder. Run the ModEnabler also found in root PE folder. Click on the PP2x mod and enable.

Check here http://pedg.yuku.com/directory for more info on PE and mods. Feel free to ask any questions you have.

For me, the "x" in PP2x indicates/acknowledges that PP2(original mod created by the Lenorts for MP action) has been updated to use the PEx game engine and any improvements it provides.

Slomo thanks for the confirmation. And let me say thanks directly for your fine work. Much appreciated.

As Aldo said earlier, It's possible, I may have missed a few of the guns when I was calibrating them.
If you are using the German tanks you'll notice most have at least 2 range scales in the optic. One for HE/MG rounds and the other for AP/APS rounds. It's possible you may have been using the incorrect range scale, as some tanks default to the HE/MG scale but load AP rounds as default.
The "M" key allows you to change/toggle between the two.

Thanks Slomo!

Sorry for the late replies, and thanks to Slomo.


SimHQ has the most former modders and players, they speak if they wish

SimHQ.com and pedg.yuku.com are the easiest to find me. At times I check Nordic Games PEA English forum (http://forum.nordicgames.at/forumdisplay.php?246-Panzer-Elite-Action-English-Board), but since I do not have PEA, I only comment if the thread is directed to PESE.
The Ostpak/PE3 mod maintains a forum at panzerelite.yuku.com/forums/5. If it is game play related, you will likely get routed back to me


The PE mod enabler adds an extension to the file name. If you have not set Windows to show all file extensions, you will not see the new extension. What you should notice in this case is duplicate names.


The original PEDG code mod team took a page from MicroSoft and named the project PE-X (ie FSx), because we got tired of the ever changing name. As Slomo pointed out, an X is added to the end of a mod to denote an attempt to update the mod to the new game engine code.

the rivit counting community of WW2 tanks is much smaller then that of the fly guys, thus you kept getting arcade projects.

GraviTeam is an exception.

The SB team has had the best business model.

It is not about if the limited community would pay for a WW2 tank sim, it's if one could be created for a price that is profitable for a publisher.

Thanks, Aldo. Question: Can one access further scenarios beyond those now in PP2-X, while still enabling PP2-X? Are there any other mods or their scenarios that can be run while PP2-X is enabled? If possible, any advice on how to do this if it isn't straight forward enabling in the mod enabler?

PEx is a game engine modifcation of PE by WingsSimulations. Every effort has been mad to make the pre 2010 work backward compatible.

PE3 is BobR's project to bring PEx into Ostpak. The 2009 mod war between BobR and I is over because 1# PEx can now do what BobR said I could not stop him from trying, and #2 I proved to him that I could rewrite the game engine to " stop " him.

Anyone can update a PE mod to play under PEx. I maintain a mod manual ( http://home.comcast.net/~ab707/pex/files/pex_readme.rtf ) and there is a PEx game code specific forum ( http://www.pedg.yuku.com/forums/10 ).

Any scenerio script file will play under PEx. But, since PEx is a game engine mod, some additional, default information is needed to bring out the realism. The graphical improvements are works that are 75% possible under the original PE.

Thanks Aldo - always good to hear from you.
Does this mean that I can:

1. Enable via mod enabler, for instance Ostpak or Monty v Rommel mods while PP3-X is also enabled;

2. Then start one of them with the PESE root directory application exe and be able to start those mods' scenarios, although the graphical improvements might only include 75% of what PEX can do?

What I am not sure about is exactly how best to access those other mods' scenarios. Instead of the above, should I just copy the associated scenario files into the mod scenario folder for PP2-X, and only have PP2-X enabled with mod enabler?

Thanks for your advice!

EDIT - Should looked at that mod forum first - sorry - I see now that there are some mods converted back in 2007 to PEX, and understand that they may work with PP2-X as it uses PEX engine at least in part. Thanks again

Aldo, sadly those PEx mod forum links for Ost PEX, etc are dead. Do you have anything current to their downloads?

Never mind - I searched and found this:
http://home.comcast.net/~ab707/

However I don't know that these are updated at all for PEX, simply what is out there for the other mods.

Hi Eugene,

There is no easy way to add the scenarios from other mods to PP2x.

It can be done, however not just a simple copy/paste operation. There are to many variables that could cause errors. Each scenario would need to be checked for compatibility and possibly changed to work in game. With the unit and texture limits in place, it's unlikely all maps/scenarios could be reconstructed accurately, especially pertaining to units needed.

As far as I know you can't simply use the older mods with PP2x enabled. The exception to this might be those that were converted to use the PEx game engine, which is contained within the PP2x mod. Even so, I would be surprised if it works.

The most diverse (as in number of theaters, scenarios and total units available) would have to be BobR's PE3 mod and the scenario mods that accompany it.

You can find it on the PEDG forums. http://pedg.yuku.com/topic/1719/Panzer-Elite-three-mod-LINK-containing-Ostpak-MvR--BritPak

Thanks Slomo. I figured that was the case. So I made two working installs. By renaming my PP2x directory (altering the beginning of the folder title not the end), I made an updated version of PE3 to his 2010 versions, and with those mods enabled installed the PEX 1.0 and its 1.2 update directly into that PE root directory. I had to NOT use Win 98 compatibility mode for PE3 to run.

Both run well, just need to rename whichever one that wants to be active "Panzer Elite". I believe this approach offers the most flexibility for upgraded PE. Of course I will watch for further developments!

After 10 years of learning a single game engine, I admit that what I believe is simple may seem daunting.

Last I heard from BobR, he was updating PE3, but that was months ago.

The combat script and scenerio format is not changed, but AI scripts that do not work as the scenerio editor instructions lead you to beleave now give an error in the log.

If a unit is in the unit csv, it will be displayed in the scenerio. If the unit is not present, a default unit will be used. The default unit depends on the structure of the unit csv. This is stock PE.

If a gun listed in the unit csv does not exist in the guns csv, an error is reported in the log. This is stock PE. PEx adds 2 entries to the guns csv. Both default to 1 if the value is not found in the csv. The first is shell caliber in mm and it is used to affect the penetration model. The second is shell drag and it is used to affect the shell travel arc. Small arms are most affected with an assumed 1.0 value. I have a limited number of fire tables, so I hard coded a value that must be found by test firing. If you have fire tables, or range scales for multiple amunitions (like German AT guns), please publish or PM me. why were the German optics better? Because the range for each shell could be found by adjusting the optic rather then the gun, thus the gunner's eye never had to leave the optic.

Ostpak attempted to use maximum object resistance to the original game engine to affect the physics of the world and the logic of the AI. This negitivly affects PEx because we added physics based upon what the PE tools could add to the world and the 3D models. Slomo and I went through the original PE models to correct collision boxes, material attributes, etc. If you can not knock over a tree in PE3, try replacing it with the PP2x version. Ostpak adds many world objects, so they must be adjusted in the PE object editor. Tree types now have unique spotting and shell impact modeling (lollipop, giant pine, christmas and umbrella).

Sorry, I ramble. PE3 uses PEx 2009 code. You can simply apply the new exes and dlls, but the bullistics will be affected by the new rules, as will the collision physics.

Gents, the http://pedg.yuku.com links are all dead to me. I'm trying to get PE SE workin on my system. Currently, I can only get the game to actually load a mission in windowed mode. I was hoping these mods might also fix that issue but I cannot get to them...

which is windowed, the user interface, or the simulation?
PESE 1.2 should work on almost any system. You may have to run it in win98 compatability mode.

The actual simulation. The user interface loads fine. I'll check my version. Worked great in Win XP SP3...

Ok I updated to v1.2, still just kicks me back to the main menu unless I'm windowed...

Hey I can't find the website for T-34 vs Tiger, can I still buy it? Checked out the manual, and gunnery seems extremely realistic ( I'm easy on requirements, modest graphics and excellent gunnery are about it ). Does anybody have a link to a distributor for the game? Seems too awesome for me to miss out on.

That's because they went out of business.The game was unfinished and released in a poor state.
You will find other players/modders here http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/forumdisplay.php?f=203

Good luck finding a copy,probably e-bay would be your best bet.

That sounds like it may be a directx issue. Win7 doesn't come with Dx 9 installed.

I think PE requires directx 9.0c. I know they say Dx 10 is backwards compatible, but it wouldn't hurt to try installing Dx9.0c


You could also try deleting the hwconfig.ini and Setting.Hal files in the Data folder. Run 3d_Control_Center and reconfigure your graphics settings and test again.

so what game might I like? I want one where my point of view can be IN the tank or have my head stuck out. I want to use a joy stick. And I would like to play against my nephew. Eye candy is great but so many other things are more important.

Your choices are rather limited if you want to play 1v1 against your nephew. TvT and PE are the only 2 I can think of that fit the bill. If you don't mind lots of other players in the game, then WW2OL and WOT are worth a look. If you don't mind modern, then SB is the best. I have not played M4 tank platoon, so I can not say how it plays. It has no eye candy, so it gets crushed by the public.

I bought and installed PE special edition from GOG. Well, that I got really is 12 year old graphics. Seems like fun like EAW. Then I read the review here at SimHQ on T-34 vs. Tiger. That looks pretty good. Seems like the game play is good from a Youtub video I looked at. But I wonder if it might be to difficult for my ten year old nephew.

I see it has multi-player and I hope I can play it with just the two of us. But his machine may not have the power to play it.

If you are looking for a good single player WW2 tank sim there's no real alternative to Steel Fury in terms of mods, missions, models and an active community.TvsT is dead both MP and SP( 12 missions repetitive and full of bugs).Only Zeewolf is making mods and missions for TvsT but it's $ 60 a year every year and progress is slow and limited.Panzer Elite is nice but dated in every aspect( it's 14 years old.If you are interested in learning more about Steel Fury then join us on the Graviteam.com Steel Fury forum and you'll see for yourself!

so it looks like PE is it as it has multi player and i guess is stable. He does not seem to mind the poor graphics.

If you are going for PE make sure you get the PPX-2 mod which adds better graphics, modelling, physics etc...Check the PEDG forum.
Aldobrit44, Slomo and other are very helpful and will help you through the mods and stuff.

Installed my Gog version of Panzer Elite. Where I should start installing mods?

If you are looking for mods, a good place to start would be on the PEDG forums. http://pedg.yuku.com/directory