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#3557140 - 04/16/12 11:06 AM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Member
Registered: 09/02/11
Posts: 871
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The air at 20km, where the MiG-25 makes Mach 3 is substantially thinner than at sea level where the MiG makes about 1200km/h.
Exactly! "Foxbat" could speed up on high altitude, therefore it reaches + 300 degrees Celcius and more than 3000 km/h (where VEGA hits +4.5 Max), so why the missile couldn't sustain 3000 km/h ot 1000 meters where MiG had 1200 km/h? We knew that in program 1, the missile accelerates slowly... Anyway, one F-14 is down, now will try to rape some A-7...
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#3557159 - 04/16/12 11:52 AM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Junior Member
Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 93
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Asuluk training ground.
Practice target:
Radar Reflector
S-75M3 Volkhov
00:00, Practice target Radar Reflector launched
00:02:38, V-760 15D Missile launched on Channel-1
Target distance: 20km
Target azimuth: 48°
Target elevation: 14°
Target altitude: 5km
SNR mode: LORO - 75km
Missile guidance method: UPR (Half Lead)
00:02:43, V-760 15D Missile launched on Channel-2
Target distance: 20km
Target azimuth: 48°
Target elevation: 14°
Target altitude: 5km
SNR mode: LORO - 75km
Missile guidance method: T/T (Three Point)
00:02:50, V-760 15D Missile launched on Channel-3
Target distance: 20km
Target azimuth: 47°
Target elevation: 14°
Target altitude: 5km
SNR mode: LORO - 75km
Missile guidance method: UPR (Half Lead)
00:03:09, Missile exploded on Channel-1
Practice target Radar Reflector killed by nuclear blast. (distance from epicenter: 0m)
00:03:22, Missile exploded on Channel-3
Total, SNR On Air Time: 2min 53sec I feel sorry for the radar reflector. But an interesting thing about this shooting is that the nuclear blast actually took out my second missile! Also, just playing around:  The missile exploded and I head a big bang. However, I wasn't taken out! I then dialed the range bore-sight down to as low as it can go, and I heard an explosion, but I wasn't taken out. Probably just the beta version.
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#3557162 - 04/16/12 11:58 AM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Junior Member
Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 93
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This deserves a double post! 13:45 19th of December, 1972.
SR-71 bomb damage assessment flight number one.
S-75M3 Volkhov
00:01:37, V-760 15D Missile launched on Channel-1
Target distance: 90km
Target azimuth: 176°
Target elevation: 15°
Target altitude: 24km
SNR mode: Wide Beam - 150km
Missile guidance method: T/T (Three Point)
00:01:52, V-760 15D Missile launched on Channel-2
Target distance: 90km
Target azimuth: 173°
Target elevation: 17°
Target altitude: 27.8km
SNR mode: Wide Beam - 75km
Missile guidance method: T/T (Three Point)
00:02:04, V-760 15D Missile launched on Channel-3
Target distance: 81km
Target azimuth: 169°
Target elevation: 20°
Target altitude: 28.9km
SNR mode: Wide Beam - 150km
Missile guidance method: UPR (Half Lead)
00:02:37, Missile exploded on Channel-1
SR-71 Habu killed by nuclear blast. (distance from epicenter: 1404m)
00:02:46, Missile exploded on Channel-2
SR-71 Habu killed by nuclear blast. (distance from epicenter: 62m)
Total, SNR On Air Time: 2min 30sec
First time I have seen the words, Habu killed on my screen.
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#3557165 - 04/16/12 12:06 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Member
Registered: 12/31/09
Posts: 1710
Loc: Hungary, Europe
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1, Congratulation for the OPF shot! (In reality it was never achieved) Must have reading for the insights... http://narod.ru/disk/11803446001/%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%8F%2086.djvu.html   2, Vega missile is accelerating over Mach6 at high altitude, where the MiG-25 can achieve Mach3 only. Vega missile is accelerating over Mach3 at low altitude, where the MiG-25 can achieve bit over Mach1 only. Nose overheat was a big real issue during development, and several test shots was failed due the nosecone faliure. Please observe, that overheat caused by air friction is much higher at low altitude. 3, The missile exploded and I head a big bang. However, I wasn't taken out! I then dialed the range bore-sight down to as low as it can go, and I heard an explosion, but I wasn't taken out. Probably just the beta version.Nuclear explosion will take out your SAM missiles also. You can alwasy hear the BIG Nuclear BANG, just wait for its sound to arrive... ... our missiles are travelling with Mach2~3, while the BANG never achieves more than Mach1. To hear a Nuclear Detonation at 25km, you need to wait more than a minute after the explosion... 4, Launching 3 V-760 missile against one SR71 is a real overkill.  I should add nuclear radiation exposure calculation for your site after nukeig half Vietnam... 
Edited by Hpasp (04/16/12 12:25 PM)
_________________________
Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home
While Fighter Pilots made movies, SAM Officers made History.
(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
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#3557207 - 04/16/12 12:49 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Member
Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 1268
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Being a sound wave, it does of course travel at the speed of sound... however, the local pressure is so much higher at short distances that close the the detonation the velocity is somewhat higher than the nominal maximum of 340.5 m/s - this influence rapidly falls away as the pressure reduces with the cube of distance, and for all practical purposes the 'normal rule' applies for longer distances. This is true of all explosions, but the difference is only significant for larger events where the really high pressure extends for more than a trivial distance. Overall, I'd be surprised if it was more than 1 second earlier for any practical device, but just nitpicking the 'never more than Mach 1'  For example, a 6kt warhead's blast wave will reach 610m in the first second. BLAST.EXE (a 'certified' Dos based blast effects calculator for nuclear weapons effects)
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#3557233 - 04/16/12 01:22 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Lieste]
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Member
Registered: 12/31/09
Posts: 1710
Loc: Hungary, Europe
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I used these theories to calculate Nuclear Bomb Effects: http://www.makeitlouder.com/document_bombshockwaveestimation.htmlfor normalizing the over speed of sound shock-wave for Mach1 you mentioned. http://www.fourmilab.ch/etexts/www/effects/For Nuclear Bomb Effect calculation. As the Russians considered 6km safety distance for the V-760 (15kt) missile, and Mr. William Hamby III, Ph.E.'s theory would result 5.93km distance for maximum window glass breaking level, I considered it close enough for the SIM.
Edited by Hpasp (04/16/12 01:56 PM)
_________________________
Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home
While Fighter Pilots made movies, SAM Officers made History.
(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
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#3557296 - 04/16/12 03:20 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Member
Registered: 09/02/11
Posts: 871
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I didn't understand - is nuclear fireball simulated on the screen? the only thing I saw is that target and missiles disappeared?
2, Vega missile is accelerating over Mach6 at high altitude, where the MiG-25 can achieve Mach3 only.
Vega missile is accelerating over Mach3 at low altitude, where the MiG-25 can achieve bit over Mach1 only.
That's why she is 3 Mach, not 6 Mach, right?
I believe that below 80 km range (Program 1), much more effect has the curvative efect of the ground.
Looking at the pictures about Libya, seems they tossed those HARM's from about 55 km, after quick climb to increase his range...
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#3557297 - 04/16/12 03:23 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: piston79]
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Member
Registered: 12/31/09
Posts: 1710
Loc: Hungary, Europe
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I didn't understand - is nuclear fireball simulated on the screen? the only thing I saw is that target and missiles disappeared?
2, Vega missile is accelerating over Mach6 at high altitude, where the MiG-25 can achieve Mach3 only.
Vega missile is accelerating over Mach3 at low altitude, where the MiG-25 can achieve bit over Mach1 only.
That's why she is 3 Mach, not 6 Mach, right?
I believe that below 80 km range (Program 1), much more effect has the curvative efect of the ground.
Looking at the pictures about Libya, seems they tossed those HARM's from about 55 km, after quick climb to increase his range... Please check... Chapter X — Radio and Radar Effects Effects on Radio and Radar Signals 479 http://www.fourmilab.ch/etexts/www/effects/eonw_10.pdf#zoom=100Nuclear fireball is opaque for radar.
_________________________
Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"
http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home
While Fighter Pilots made movies, SAM Officers made History.
(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
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#3557328 - 04/16/12 04:15 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Member
Registered: 09/02/11
Posts: 871
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o·paque (-pk)
adj.
1.
a. Impenetrable by light; neither transparent nor translucent.
b. Not reflecting light; having no luster: an opaque finish.
2. Impenetrable by a form of radiant energy other than visible light: a chemical solution opaque to x-rays.
3.
a. So obscure as to be unintelligible: "opaque, elusive, minimal meanings" (John Simon).
b. Obtuse of mind; dense. See Synonyms at dark.
n.
Something that is opaque, especially an opaque pigment used to darken parts of a photographic print or negative So, which is appropriate for the S-75M's transmition? Is it 1."Impenetrable" or 2."Not reflecting"? P.S. I am not fluent in english, so a bit easier explanation could be better for me...
Edited by piston79 (04/16/12 04:17 PM)
Edit Reason: P.S.
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#3557343 - 04/16/12 04:39 PM
Re: SAM Simulator
[Re: Hpasp]
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Junior Member
Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 93
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@piston, I was more asking why nothing happened when an explosion took place below the safety zone. That thing exploded only 1-2km away from me if not less! I should have been hit by the shock wave before the sound came in. But I was still fully functioning.
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