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#3552323 - 04/07/12 11:39 AM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: Greybeard]
Greybeard Offline
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Registered: 05/12/04
Posts: 1204
Loc: Italy
OK. Let's see if I've understood. Using same criteria by Anthony Williams (see article HERE), I get following diagram, where his actual values are compared with Oleg's one:



Pretty similar.

Complete table follows:



I think William's values show some inconsistencies, although generally valid.

Would be interesting to get also Breda-SAFAT and Ho-103 data now. Neal, are you still in touch with Oleg?
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#3552331 - 04/07/12 11:49 AM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: Greybeard]
IceFire Offline
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Registered: 09/03/02
Posts: 3436
Loc: Canada
Better to ask Team Daidalos than Oleg at this point. Oleg isn't really involved in any direct capacity with Cliffs of Dover and future additions either.
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#3552525 - 04/07/12 07:59 PM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: Greybeard]
Neal Offline
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Registered: 02/02/01
Posts: 1653
Oleg answered questions on forums and through emails for a surprising amount of time given the crap he took.
I last got a personal answer maybe as late as 2007.

Oleg moved on to other business, maybe 2010. Find Luthier over on the banana forum instead.

I used to remember posts demanding Oleg to reveal all the parts and workings of the FM just so they could verify them. Demanded. As in one company's IP behind their sole product should become open source to satisfy a demand.

And the ones making the demands? None qualified in aerodynamics, and a few who had trouble with squares and roots and science in general but read books and have charts and know how these planes should fly... just like in the last sim they modded of course!

Anyone remember Stiglr and Targetware?

PS -- SimHQ has had articles on IL-2 since it hit. I dunno how far the archives go back but between interviews and feature articles there should be a fair glimpse into game workings without giving too much away.


Edited by Neal (04/07/12 08:07 PM)

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#3552561 - 04/07/12 09:55 PM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: Neal]
Boilerplate* Offline
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Registered: 02/23/06
Posts: 5640
Loc: Virginia, USA
Originally Posted By: Neal
Anyone remember Stiglr and Targetware?


Why yes. Apparently he got around because he was headliner over in the Strike Fighters forum years back as well. hahaha
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#3552567 - 04/07/12 10:34 PM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: Greybeard]
IceFire Offline
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Registered: 09/03/02
Posts: 3436
Loc: Canada
Infamous smile

There was that guy, the Ta183 fan, the 20+ page .50cal thread, the 30+ page MG151/20 thread, the countless FW190 bar threads... old times, not particularly good times either. Glad we got those out of the way smile
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#3552683 - 04/08/12 08:24 AM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: Greybeard]
Neal Offline
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Registered: 02/02/01
Posts: 1653
Just be happy you've not seen any F-86 vs MiG-15 doghouse charts.

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#3553042 - 04/08/12 11:12 PM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: Neal]
IceFire Offline
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Registered: 09/03/02
Posts: 3436
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: Neal
Just be happy you've not seen any F-86 vs MiG-15 doghouse charts.


I'm terrified smile
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#3554056 - 04/10/12 06:10 PM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: IceFire]
NickM Offline
Member

Registered: 01/11/01
Posts: 2472
Loc: Concord, Ca U.S.A.
Originally Posted By: IceFire
Whats your testing methodology in game?
Many of the complaints over the years with the .50cal have been justified but some have not. I think there is a certain expectation fed by cherry picked gun camera sequences and over exaggerated combat reports. Just a few years later in the Korean war, pilots complained about the upgraded M3 .50cal not doing enough damage to down MiG-15s. I realize the MiG-15 is a different kettle of fish from a FW190 but it's interesting how quickly opinion soured on the weapon.


Not sure why but later on, the 'victory/damage quotient' against MiG 15s began to improve (at least for the Sabers)---it could be better ammo "mix", better sight, getting closer or just the ability to get more hits on the target due to experience

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#3554181 - 04/10/12 10:15 PM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: Greybeard]
Neal Offline
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Registered: 02/02/01
Posts: 1653
One wingmate wrote that his leader took an 800 yard shot at some high alt and made it. The leader knew the extra thin air would make the shot possible.

Look at the guns on the MiG. That's what kind to bring to the jet party. Golf-ball shooters!

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#3554281 - 04/11/12 08:27 AM Re: .50 Browning in game effectiveness [Re: Greybeard]
Dozer Offline
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Registered: 03/08/03
Posts: 1198
Loc: UK
I was trying to remember what on earth I did with the year 2006. Thanks for reminding me: I spent it reading threads like this.
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