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#3549521 - 04/02/12 08:32 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]
CooLDoG Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 95
I guess this warrants a double post smile...

Okay, on the Sa-4B I have found that the the first Missile (the first missile column left) spins up fine (KOHTP light goes on for a time and then goes off as it should) but after the it finishes its preparation the TOTOBH light does not come on for a long time. I tried the same thing on all the six other missiles and once the KOHTP light went out the TOTOBH light came on.

I'm using the new beta version so it might be a bug. Seems abnormal to me.


Edited by CooLDoG (04/02/12 08:34 PM)


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#3550263 - 04/04/12 06:38 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: piston79]
piston79 Offline
Member

Registered: 09/02/11
Posts: 872



"The Beauty and The Beast"

In 1973-1974 with accordance of decision 83/09.04.1971 were organized shooting exercises with S-200B (S-200) against balistic missile type 8K14.
During tests where commenced 15 launches of 8k14 and 11 launches of V-860VV(V-880) missiles. In first stage of the testing - 8 8K14 and 6 V-860VV(V-880), in second stage - 7 and 5. From 11 launches of V-860VV(V-880), 9 are counted - 6 in first stage, 3 in the second stage.
TBM 8K14 was launched with trajectory with parameters:
Range (D) - 150 km
Max. Heihgt - 40 km
Max. Speed - 1096 m/s

Click to reveal..


Results from I stage of testings:

Click to reveal..

where:
Second column - launch number;third - missile type; from column 4 to column 11 - parameters of impact; column 12 - target is in debrees zone ("Da"-positiv;"Net" - negativ); column 14 - warhead destroyed/not destroyed.

Results from II stage of testings:

Click to reveal..


During second stage of the testing missile launches where with coordinates inside of the destruction zone of S-200, as it follows:
Height - 6.6 km Range - 20 km
Height - 15.6 km Range - 32 km
Height - 20.4 km Range - 37.5 km

Self-guiding error in 3 launches where less than 6 m, in one - 38 meters.
TBM's warhead was covered with debrees in launches 621 and 624. In launch 625, because the miss was less than 1 meter and (probably) direct hit, TBM's warhead was not covered with debrees.In launch 624, because the miss was 38 meters, density of debree's cloud was 0.3 pieces on m2, and posibility for warhead destruction was equal to zero.

SNR mode was "MHI". AS was stable, exept in the moment of detaching of the start engine of the TBM (AS was lost in 8 of 10 events).
RCS of 8K14 was determined to 0.39 of RCS of MiG-17 without external tanks.
Signal level/noise level against range ratio was:

Click to reveal..


Sources:
&#1089;200 &#1087;&#1086; 8&#1082;14.djvu
&#1089;200 &#1087;&#1086; 8&#1082;14-1.djvu
http://simhq.com/forum



Edited by piston79 (04/04/12 01:17 PM)
Edit Reason: Additional information

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#3550300 - 04/04/12 08:46 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]
CooLDoG Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 95
Question about that piston. Did you just learn the S-200? Or did you make that Google Earth based off of a the testing results?

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#3550320 - 04/04/12 09:22 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]
arkhangelsk Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/11/10
Posts: 54
Originally Posted By: Hpasp
Originally it was possible, but shooting civilian planes with realistic SAM simulator can be seen as a terrorist act, so this feature is available only for bug-testing.


Oh, self-censorship...

How about substituting military targets (say, An-124, IL-76, C-141) for those civvie planes?

Top
#3550390 - 04/04/12 11:05 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]
CooLDoG Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 95
^ I like it becuase it gives you a perspective on how fast the military planes go. It also shows how the "practice mode" is actually simulated...

Got a question about the SA-3B:


I'm running an old version of google earth because I am using windows 2000. The boxes are time steps and here is the gpx file if you want to inspect it in your version of google earth (simply copy into a text file and change extension to gpx):

Click to reveal..
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8" standalone="no" ?>
<gpx xmlns="http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/1">

<trk><name>SR-71 Habu</name><trkseg>
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Edited by CooLDoG (04/04/12 11:46 AM)

Top
#3550395 - 04/04/12 11:09 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]
CooLDoG Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 95
That gpx file messed something up with my post...
After action report is here:
Click to reveal..
13:45 19th of December, 1972.
SR-71 bomb damage assessment flight number one.

2K11 KRUG-M1


00:01:55, Missile launched
Target distance: 75km
Target azimuth: 172°
Target elevation: 18°
Target altitude: 23.9km
Missile guidance method: 1/2 (Half Lead)


00:03:15, Missile launched
Target distance: 31km
Target azimuth: 77°
Target elevation: 50°
Target altitude: 23.9km
Missile guidance method: 1/2 (Half Lead)


Total, SNR On Air Time: 3min 36sec

Now it looks to me like I intersected the SR-71's path at the right time. My question is why didn't my missile explode? I armed the proxy charge to arm after launch to give maximum finding ability. I have tried without arming it after launch and got the exact same results. What is up with not exploding? Did I do something wrong? I used the exact same method to shoot down the scud rocket in the firing range as well as various other aircraft (including the U2!!!!).

Top
#3550397 - 04/04/12 11:09 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]
CooLDoG Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 95
That gpx file messed something up with my post...
After action report is here:
Click to reveal..
13:45 19th of December, 1972.
SR-71 bomb damage assessment flight number one.

2K11 KRUG-M1


00:01:55, Missile launched
Target distance: 75km
Target azimuth: 172°
Target elevation: 18°
Target altitude: 23.9km
Missile guidance method: 1/2 (Half Lead)


00:03:15, Missile launched
Target distance: 31km
Target azimuth: 77°
Target elevation: 50°
Target altitude: 23.9km
Missile guidance method: 1/2 (Half Lead)


Total, SNR On Air Time: 3min 36sec

Now it looks to me like I intersected the SR-71's path at the right time. My question is why didn't my missile explode? I armed the proxy charge to arm after launch to give maximum finding ability. I have tried without arming it after launch and got the exact same results. What is up with not exploding? Did I do something wrong? I used the exact same method to shoot down the scud rocket in the firing range as well as various other aircraft (including the U2!!!!).

Top
#3550491 - 04/04/12 01:12 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: CooLDoG]
piston79 Offline
Member

Registered: 09/02/11
Posts: 872
Originally Posted By: CooLDoG
Question about that piston. Did you just learn the S-200? Or did you make that Google Earth based off of a the testing results?

The "Scud" v/s S-200 scenario in the SIM was different than tests, which I've described... Just want to share some information with people here... Personally, I am dreaming for mission builder, where we can set scenarios, similar to those we have documented already, and than compare our results with real ones... thumbsup


Edited by piston79 (04/04/12 03:37 PM)

Top
#3550506 - 04/04/12 01:25 PM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: Hpasp]
CooLDoG Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 95
Yeah, a "mission" builder would be really really cool.

Also, the highlighted box in my screen shot is NOT where the sr-71 is at during the current time step. The sr-71 is located at the last box on the upper path.


Edited by CooLDoG (04/04/12 01:27 PM)

Top
#3550915 - 04/05/12 03:54 AM Re: SAM Simulator [Re: CooLDoG]
Hpasp Online   grunt
Member

Registered: 12/31/09
Posts: 1710
Loc: Hungary, Europe
Originally Posted By: CooLDoG
I guess this warrants a double post smile...

Okay, on the Sa-4B I have found that the the first Missile (the first missile column left) spins up fine (KOHTP light goes on for a time and then goes off as it should) but after the it finishes its preparation the TOTOBH light does not come on for a long time. I tried the same thing on all the six other missiles and once the KOHTP light went out the TOTOBH light came on.

I'm using the new beta version so it might be a bug. Seems abnormal to me.


Please observe the restricted firing zone of the KRUG system.
(at manual page 26, point 6)

The huge (2,4ton) launched missile is exceeding Mach1 right after leaving the launcher.
If you launch it towards the SNR, its antenna system would damaged by the near sonic boom, so it is allowed to be launched only away from the SNR.
If you use half lead guidance method, the restricted zone is quite huge.
thumbsup


Edited by Hpasp (04/05/12 03:55 AM)
_________________________
Hpasp
Free SAM Simulator, "Realistic to the Switch"

http://sites.google.com/site/samsimulator1972/home

While Fighter Pilots made movies, SAM Officers made History.
(U-2 over Sverdlovsk, B-52's over Hanoi, F-4 Phantoms over the Sinai, F-16's and the F-117A Stealth bomber over the Balkans.)
thumbsup

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