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#3535338 - 03/09/12 05:00 AM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: Allen]
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DBS
Member
Registered: 08/24/07
Posts: 286
Loc: Croatia, Zagreb
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Glad to see I was wrong on how much difference the SSD makes, gaming related. I forget that people here play simulators mostly, and if anything this is where the SSD will help the most I guess.  JAMF's link above does a good job of comparing differing SSD approaches. While some SSD perform nearly alike, there are differences -- sometimes large. There can be a big difference in price/performance depending on which SSD one picks -- among the SSD tested. True. Most people only look at the read / write speeds and disregard everything else, the controller type and generation etc. In every day use how SSD handles small 4K files is what makes a difference. Other articles I read indicated that the failure rates for SSD are higher than advertized -- but improving. Maybe a good reason to NOT make the SSD the system drive. As I mention above, I'll be reconfiguring mine to be a storehouse for data/games that benefit from fast data access. Pros seem to recommend that in articles -- along with backing up the data elsewhere -- say on a standard HD Well said. Though I don't see a reason why not use SSD as a system drive. Just save everything important to the HDD if you are worried. Except from A-10, all my games are on a HDD together with all the stuff I am working on for university / work. More so, the Win7's symbolic link - or mklink: http://www.maximumpc.com/article/howtos/howto_master_your_file_system_mklinkhttp://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1138731^^ Very useful if you wish to have a Steam game on SSD with all others on your HDD. I use it to move any cache files from the My Documents folder (i.e. whole CloD's My Documents folder and all A-10 Tracks folder in Saved Games / DCS Warthog are on my HDD).
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#3535396 - 03/09/12 07:26 AM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: T}{OR]
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Hotshot
Registered: 10/13/99
Posts: 5059
Loc: Ohio USA
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...Very useful if you wish to have a Steam game on SSD with all others on your HDD. I use it... Thanks for this link This is perfect. It was something I was going to try to find next -- as not all Steam games need or make good use of SSD. Moreover, if I installed ALL of my Steam games, they would just about fill the SSD. But, I don't play them all enough to want to waste that space -- thus, all my Steam games are not installed on the SSD (they aren't installed anywhere -- your link can change that). I'll give this a try -- move the Steam main folder back to C: -- keep the games that make good use of SSD on the SSD. Meantime, the Skyrim experience is definitely improved with the SSD. Just last night I moved A10C and IL2:CoD to the SSD, but have not played them yet. I'll test out the "split" Steam system on my hardware.
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Crossfire 2x Sapphire HD7970 OC - Eyefinity 5760x1200 24", 1xDell-U2410 H-IPS + 2xHP-ZR24w S-IPS, Ceton InfiniTV 4, Piledriver FX8350@4.6GHz w/Swiftech Water Cooling, 16GB GSKILL PC3 @1866, ASUS Sabertooth 990FX, OCZ Vertex 4 256GB SSD, 4x Seagate + Hitachi + 2x Sg Ext = 12TB, Lite-On DVD, OCZ ZX 850W PSU, CoolerMaster HAF922, TM Warthog HOTAS, TM T-Flight Stick X, TM Cougar+FSSB & CH Pedals, Saitek X52 Pro & Pro Combat Pedals, TrackIR5 w/TC Pro, Windows 8 Professional 64b
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#3535435 - 03/09/12 08:57 AM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: Wrecking Crew]
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Hotshot
Registered: 10/13/99
Posts: 5059
Loc: Ohio USA
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The fix worked  I now have ONLY the Steam Skyrim, IL2:CoD, A10C game folders/files on the SSD. All the rest of the Steam stuff (including some games) is on drive C:. Saved quite a bit of SSD space. And, now I can reload all my other Steam games to drive C:. Then, move (quick/easy copy and paste -- plus a cmd line command) only those benefiting from SSD to the SSD (copy and paste back to C: if necessary -- actually, I just rename the game-folder on C: -- change name back to original name to "move" back to C:). Again, haven't actually played the flight sims yet -- did launch to see if worked; but did not stay and play. A small amount of Skyrim testing shows improvement in those few spots that had a bit of disk induced hesitation (don't want to oversell it -- as Skyrim played very acceptably on the HD -- smooth almost everywhere on HD -- thus, a "small" improvement in overall gameplay).
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Crossfire 2x Sapphire HD7970 OC - Eyefinity 5760x1200 24", 1xDell-U2410 H-IPS + 2xHP-ZR24w S-IPS, Ceton InfiniTV 4, Piledriver FX8350@4.6GHz w/Swiftech Water Cooling, 16GB GSKILL PC3 @1866, ASUS Sabertooth 990FX, OCZ Vertex 4 256GB SSD, 4x Seagate + Hitachi + 2x Sg Ext = 12TB, Lite-On DVD, OCZ ZX 850W PSU, CoolerMaster HAF922, TM Warthog HOTAS, TM T-Flight Stick X, TM Cougar+FSSB & CH Pedals, Saitek X52 Pro & Pro Combat Pedals, TrackIR5 w/TC Pro, Windows 8 Professional 64b
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#3535549 - 03/09/12 11:49 AM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: Allen]
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Senior Member
Registered: 01/08/09
Posts: 4325
Loc: Vancouver, BC
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The fix worked I now have ONLY the Steam Skyrim, IL2:CoD, A10C game folders/files on the SSD. All the rest of the Steam stuff (including some games) is on drive C:. Saved quite a bit of SSD space. And, now I can reload all my other Steam games to drive C:. Then, move (quick/easy copy and paste -- plus a cmd line command) only those benefiting from SSD to the SSD (copy and paste back to C: if necessary -- actually, I just rename the game-folder on C: -- change name back to original name to "move" back to C:). Again, haven't actually played the flight sims yet -- did launch to see if worked; but did not stay and play. A small amount of Skyrim testing shows improvement in those few spots that had a bit of disk induced hesitation (don't want to oversell it -- as Skyrim played very acceptably on the HD -- smooth almost everywhere on HD -- thus, a "small" improvement in overall gameplay). As mentioned 3 pages ago http://www.traynier.com/software/steammover
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#3535687 - 03/09/12 03:46 PM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: Allen]
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Lifer
Registered: 09/29/00
Posts: 21656
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Other articles I read indicated that the failure rates for SSD are higher than advertized -- but improving. Maybe a good reason to NOT make the SSD the system drive. Two considerations here. Move the pagefile to the nose of the D drive, and don't allow the C drive to run disk defragmenter on a schedule. Manually do it maybe once a month and that is it. Some brands got a rep for being grenades early on but now they are getting better.  Okay, okay.... I'm still pushing the idea of a 60GB or 128GB C drive SSD (with just the OS and primary utilities); a 128GB or 256GB D drive SSD (with the pagefile on the nose); and a stout mechanical HDD (like a WD Black 500GB with 64 cache) as drive E. BTW, if you have a SATA II mobo but get a SATA III SSD(s), you'll see an improvement when you upgrade. IOWs, getting an SSD on a board that is SATA II still leaves out some juice.
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"That's at least a third canine dog barking"
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#3535691 - 03/09/12 04:08 PM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: Wrecking Crew]
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Senior Member
Registered: 01/08/09
Posts: 4325
Loc: Vancouver, BC
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I must admit, the 'write life of SSD' in 2012 doesn't worry me. If this was 2007, then I'd be worried. Windows 7 disables auto defrag, pre-cache and readyboost on SSD's automatically anyway. Microsoft also recommend just leaving the page file on the SSD as well, as the read/write pattern is ideal for them. http://blogs.msdn.com/b/e7/archive/2009/05/05/support-and-q-a-for-solid-state-drives-and.aspxNow people do lose SSDs, but that's more to the quality/price thing shaking itself out (lots of manufacturers getting into the market with bad NAND stuff). If you have data you don't want to lose on a PC that's not backed up 'off' the PC entirely then whether it's HD, RAID 5 or plain ole SSD isn't pretty much a wash. For me the O/S and 'games cache' drive is pretty much throw-away-able, although I've not yet lost a SSD in a few years of using them (but admit, it does happen of course..)
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#3535710 - 03/09/12 05:25 PM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: FearlessFrog]
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Lifer
Registered: 09/29/00
Posts: 21656
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Windows 7 disables auto defrag, pre-cache and readyboot on SSD's automatically anyway. Microsoft also recommend just leaving the page file on the SSD as well, as the read/write pattern is ideal for them.
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/e7/archive/2009/05/05/support-and-q-a-for-solid-state-drives-and.aspx Great info FF! Thanks!
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"That's at least a third canine dog barking"
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#3535956 - 03/10/12 07:12 AM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: Wrecking Crew]
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"just do it"
Member
Registered: 07/10/07
Posts: 403
Loc: EL Centro, Cailfornia
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m y GTX MSI 580 fits in that case.
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#3536528 - 03/11/12 11:56 AM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: Wrecking Crew]
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Hotshot
Registered: 10/13/99
Posts: 5059
Loc: Ohio USA
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Originally, this thread mentioned A10C load times. I very briefly tried my original HD install and the copy-paste SSD install. Long load times were still there -- but, I did not time them (I assume they were a bit shorter with SSD and I did not notice).
What in-game settings/mission/situation gives "roughness" or "stutter" in the "visible" frame rate that might be due to disk access? Never actually noticed stutter. But, then, I don't push A10C to the max -- call me a "casual" user. What should I do to get "stutter or hesitations" -- so I can test with and without SSD.
Though A10C is installed, I'm reinstalling it from scratch and updating the patches. As noted above, there are a couple very easy ways to switch A10C back and forth from HD to SSD for testing. Just looking to do a relevant test. I'll also retest load times.
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Crossfire 2x Sapphire HD7970 OC - Eyefinity 5760x1200 24", 1xDell-U2410 H-IPS + 2xHP-ZR24w S-IPS, Ceton InfiniTV 4, Piledriver FX8350@4.6GHz w/Swiftech Water Cooling, 16GB GSKILL PC3 @1866, ASUS Sabertooth 990FX, OCZ Vertex 4 256GB SSD, 4x Seagate + Hitachi + 2x Sg Ext = 12TB, Lite-On DVD, OCZ ZX 850W PSU, CoolerMaster HAF922, TM Warthog HOTAS, TM T-Flight Stick X, TM Cougar+FSSB & CH Pedals, Saitek X52 Pro & Pro Combat Pedals, TrackIR5 w/TC Pro, Windows 8 Professional 64b
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#3536702 - 03/11/12 07:36 PM
Re: New SSD? For A-10C...
[Re: Wrecking Crew]
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Hotshot
Registered: 10/13/99
Posts: 5059
Loc: Ohio USA
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Tried the A10C mission load times -- 4 different missions. Timed with a stopwatch.
First Number Hard Drive time, Second Number SSD
43s 36s
34s 31s
40s 34s
36s 33s
Not a big difference. Long both ways. I can see why I didn't notice a difference in the tests I mentioned above.
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Crossfire 2x Sapphire HD7970 OC - Eyefinity 5760x1200 24", 1xDell-U2410 H-IPS + 2xHP-ZR24w S-IPS, Ceton InfiniTV 4, Piledriver FX8350@4.6GHz w/Swiftech Water Cooling, 16GB GSKILL PC3 @1866, ASUS Sabertooth 990FX, OCZ Vertex 4 256GB SSD, 4x Seagate + Hitachi + 2x Sg Ext = 12TB, Lite-On DVD, OCZ ZX 850W PSU, CoolerMaster HAF922, TM Warthog HOTAS, TM T-Flight Stick X, TM Cougar+FSSB & CH Pedals, Saitek X52 Pro & Pro Combat Pedals, TrackIR5 w/TC Pro, Windows 8 Professional 64b
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