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#3528116 - 02/28/12 03:54 PM CH Fighterstick problem
PapaG39 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/25/07
Posts: 138
I have a CH Fighterstick. It is several years (S/N 6809) old So I'm sure it's out of warranty.

It always flys with the right wing low, and is getting quite hard to fly with any type of accuracy.

It flys ***Right Wing Low*** Same scenario in il2 original, Rise of flight and in il2 Cliffs of Dover.

I have calibrated it via the CH manager.

Using the in game Rudder trim is no fix.

I also tried the dead zone in each game or via the CH control manager.

Tried Un-plugging from the USB & re-engaging, that is also no help.

Using in XP Pro and now on Win 7 is no difference...still right wing low.

Is anyone else having this problem with the fighterstick?

I was think about getting new springs and that pointimeter...??? spelling? and trying to fix it myself
but after taking the 4 screws on the bottom out, I couldn't get the stick apart.
I didn't want to force it so I just put the screws back in I see if anyone could give me some definite info on repairs.

I really don't know if that is the problem anyway.

Anyone had any experience with this type fighterstick problem or repairs?

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#3528522 - 02/29/12 05:24 AM Re: CH Fighterstick problem [Re: PapaG39]
531 Ghost Offline
USMC
Veteran

Registered: 09/17/02
Posts: 10850
Loc: Elizabeth City NC
Is the POT trim wheel centered? I know, sounds stupid, but it's usually the little things that get us.
_________________________
Originally Posted By: Abraham Lincoln
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.


For your CH Products programming needs, come on over to: The CH-Hangar
Current System Specs

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#3528737 - 02/29/12 12:08 PM Re: CH Fighterstick problem [Re: PapaG39]
PapaG39 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/25/07
Posts: 138
Yes, the wheels on the right side and the back of the stick are centered in the detent when I calibrate.
There was a good write up several years ago by one of your team that explained very well that
the wheels on the right side and back of the stick were only for calibration purposes.

I never did understand why that was not made a "sticky.

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#3529359 - 03/01/12 04:08 AM Re: CH Fighterstick problem [Re: PapaG39]
531 Ghost Offline
USMC
Veteran

Registered: 09/17/02
Posts: 10850
Loc: Elizabeth City NC
Sorry for the late reply. I'm traveling, posting from my phone. Does the problem get worse as you fly, like a constant aileron trim input? If so, perhaps a stuck key/macro used in your .map for aileron trim?
_________________________
Originally Posted By: Abraham Lincoln
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.


For your CH Products programming needs, come on over to: The CH-Hangar
Current System Specs

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#3529705 - 03/01/12 12:53 PM Re: CH Fighterstick problem [Re: PapaG39]
PapaG39 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/25/07
Posts: 138
The problem is constant.

I just got a new keyboard so don't think it would be a stuck key.

Don't use macro.

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#3531519 - 03/03/12 04:19 PM Re: CH Fighterstick problem [Re: PapaG39]
Bob Church Offline
Member

Registered: 08/03/00
Posts: 306
Loc: USA
Hi PapaG,

When you go into the Control Manager calibration screen, there are a group of "Raw Data" values. What are they showing with with the stick at full left, at center, and at full right? That shows you the data coming from the hardware, it's the only display that actually shows the data without going through some modification first and will tell you whether the hardware is working correctly or not.

Also, the center values should be too far off 128. It's not real critical, I think I'm getting just over 100 on one of mine, but if it's way off that can create problems.

The other settings, the ones like "Sensitivity", "Deadzone", etc. If you're using a map, then the settings are made at the axis they apply to in the map itself. If you're just running in Direct Mode, the same setting are available in the CM Calibration screen. There's a tab up at the top labeled "Axis Settings". Select that and you'll have eight sets of settings, one for each possible axis.

The first thing to check is the "Centered" box. For axes that return to center, usually just the X, Y, and R axes, the box should be checked. For other axes that don't center (throttles, toe brakes, sliders, etc.) should generally not be checked. There are times when you might want to do it, but those situations are pretty rare.

It's important to have that right, because Deadzone and Gain are only active when the "Centered" box is checked, and the Sensitivity is scaled off the two ends. If it's unchecked, then no Deadzone or Gain, and the sensitivity only affects one end or the other.

Once that's done and if the values aren't wildly off, a broken wire or something like that sending it down near Zero or up around Max, then the calibration should correct it. You'll always need a little Deadzone on a Centered axis. I think the default is "4", but you need to make it large enough so that whenever you release the stick or pedals and it goes back to center, the scaled value is 127-128 without the need to actually move it there. If you just let the stick pull your hand back to center, the scaled value should go to the 127-128 value.

You can't see the calibrated value in the calibration screen, though. What you see there is just what's coming from the stick. The X/Y grid and the axis bars see the scaled values, but they're under-resolved, they're showing you 1 pixel for a change that should be about 3 times that, so you can't really see what's there.

The trick is to Download the map. Then open up the Calibration Screen. It will list one or more "Control Manager Devices", pick the one that has the axis you want to check. Look at the Raw Data display again. The CM does the scaling, that becomes the Raw Data for the Map, and so the Raw Data will show you what's really going to Windows. Mins should be 0, Centers should be 127-128, and Max should be 255. If it's a non-centering axis, then Min should be 0 and Maxx 255, no center. Either way, run that test with the Sensitivity at 100% or it will show up as a high min or low max for a non-centered axis. For a centered axis it will show both those.

If you do the Deadzone test there, get the stick back to center as you would when you're flying it, then it should always come back to 127-128. If it doesn't, you need to increase the deadzone enough that it does (Centered axes only). If it takes more than you think it should, you probably need to replace the gimbal mechanism, it's usually just worn to much for a set of reasonable settings. You'd need to contact CH for that. It seems to me they used to sell them on their "Parts" page but I don't think they're there anymore.

Best regards,

- Bob

The StickWorks
http://www.stickworks.com

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#3531865 - 03/04/12 06:02 AM Re: CH Fighterstick problem [Re: PapaG39]
531 Ghost Offline
USMC
Veteran

Registered: 09/17/02
Posts: 10850
Loc: Elizabeth City NC
As always Bob, Thank You. Soon I'll be moved in and off the road...
_________________________
Originally Posted By: Abraham Lincoln
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.


For your CH Products programming needs, come on over to: The CH-Hangar
Current System Specs

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#3532117 - 03/04/12 02:53 PM Re: CH Fighterstick problem [Re: PapaG39]
PapaG39 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/25/07
Posts: 138
Bob...
Thank you for that very fine explanation.

On my fighterstick on the X axis with the stick held left it would read something different each time...
Such as: 6, 21, 3, 25, 35, 15, 7, etc etc... never the same reading.

Your explanation with pictures should be a "sticky" on the CH Forum right at the top of the list...

I use to have something similar, but lost it during a reformat some time ago.

I copied/saved yours because I don't retain that information to well anymore...

Anyway, Friday I sent the stick into CH repair to have the springs and potentiometer replaced.

I looked in the bottom of the stick & just put the screws back in. If even touched anything
inside that box the stick would never work again...sooooo... I sent it to someone who knows...ha ha..

Thanks for all of you helpful input guys...hopefully it will be all better when I get it back from the doctor...



Edited by PapaG39 (03/04/12 03:07 PM)

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#3532175 - 03/04/12 04:42 PM Re: CH Fighterstick problem [Re: PapaG39]
Bob Church Offline
Member

Registered: 08/03/00
Posts: 306
Loc: USA
Hi PapaG,

You're certainly welcome. I kind of wish you'd not sent it back if it's out of warranty. It just sounded like something was continously off, not changing values each time. USB doesn't really suffer from dirty pots that much The way the circuitry is set up cancels the main problem. With the values wandering around that far, it was very likely just a loose connection to the pot itself. They use a "push-on" connector, those oxidize over time, and the connection can get a little bit flaky. The problem with not being able to open the FighterStick that you mentioned was most likely just that there are actually 8 screws holding it together. Four of them are under the rubber feet, then four more in toward the center that are visible, they give a bit more strength to the gimbal mounting. Once all 8 are out, the bottom just lifts off.

Usually it's only a matter of sliding the pushons off and on a few times to clean them, maybe squeezing them with a little with pliers to tighten them on the pot terminals. It's not always the case, the terminals on the pot can get intermittent, but if it's out of warranty, it can't hurt to look. But having CH go through it can't hurt either. After 12 years, it could probably use a good looking over, maybe something else has worn. It's just a pain to be without a stick if that's the one you normally use. Hopefully it will be back home soon!

Best regards,

- Bob

The StickWorks
http://www.stickworks.com

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#3532318 - 03/04/12 08:35 PM Re: CH Fighterstick problem [Re: PapaG39]
PapaG39 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/25/07
Posts: 138
Yeah Bob...It sure is lousy to be without my stick, but I am not electronically inclined and your

info just showed up a bit to late...lol..

Oh well, better this way. I most likely would have screwed something up.

I do have 4 old MS force feedback pro sticks...heck, one of them has never even been used.

I never could get them to work on XP so I just put them back in the box & there they sit.

They were all on warranty and one of the buttons quit working so they just sent me another new one.

If I know of someone here in the Phoenix area that could get them to work on Win7 it would be nice.
I always liked that stick.

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