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#348707 - 05/24/03 10:14 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Tatsu Offline
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Joe,
I get the slowdown as soon as I turn on the air to air radar. However, I can still control the plane it's just slower. So what I do is turn on the radar, lock, fire, and turn off the radar. I get a hit in both the aim 9 and aim120 training missions that way and the slow down is only for a few secs.

Tatsu


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#348708 - 05/24/03 12:15 PM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  

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I dont think this issue is related to the radar at least it doesnt appear that way on my system. You can have the radar on constant and just pan away from your hud and the FPS jump up. I'm pretty sure it has to do with the HUD when using FSAA and not the radar. If it was the radar then you could shut radar off and you would also see the slowdown in A/G mode as well.
If you load up a flight with a clean loadout (no missles) and go to A/A mode the issue disappears. If you load up just a couple of Aim9s or a couple of AIM120s then as soon as you go into A/A mode the issue appears again.
I am confident it has to do with the hud symbology for your missles in the HUD itself and how that interacts with your FSAA.

Try this: load up just the standard runway takeoff training mission with 2 AIM9m missles and go to A/A mode. once airborne fire off both missles while never leaving A/A mode and I guarrentee that as soon as your missles are off the rails and you are now clean your FPS will jump up to normal. Radar on or off will not matter.

#348709 - 06/12/03 08:53 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Folks:

Not at all sure why, but on my system I can run FSAA at 2x without the grid problem. But with AA at 4x or above get multiple problems, including corrupted or blurred fonts in cockpit.

This is with 44.03 drivers on a GeForce4 Ti4200. But also with the 4X.XX drivers generally. Curious, no?


"Wait until you see the whites of his eyes."
Sailor Malan, 'Ten of My Rules for Air Fighting', no. 1
#348710 - 06/12/03 05:45 PM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Quote:
Originally posted by CatsEyes:
Folks:

Not at all sure why, but on my system I can run FSAA at 2x without the grid problem. But with AA at 4x or above get multiple problems, including corrupted or blurred fonts in cockpit.

This is with 44.03 drivers on a GeForce4 Ti4200. But also with the 4X.XX drivers generally. Curious, no?
There have been issues with 2x FSAA in some of the 40.xx series drivers not working. i.e. there is actually no AA at the 2x setting, which would result in no gridlines. Do you actually see an IQ improvement with no grildines and 2x FSAA?

#348711 - 07/16/03 05:02 PM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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FAQ updated with the fact the the new ATI cat 3.6 drivers no longer display gridlines as per this post. Can somebody confirm?

#348712 - 07/25/03 02:24 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  

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Am running XP - Radeon 9000 with latest drivers for all. Eliminated Grid lines and A2A Radar frame freezes by... Setting Radeon card Anti-Aliasing to "application default" and de-selecting Jane's F/A 18 "low level mapping". After messing with all drivers, changing video cards etc. this suprisingly simple fix worked,

#348713 - 07/25/03 03:31 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Tatsu Offline
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That is confirmed Joe.. must have FSAA enabled though. Still a slow down in Air to Air.

Tatsu


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#348714 - 07/25/03 06:06 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tatsu:
must have FSAA enabled though.
Very strange that disabling AA fixes the grid for nVidia users and enabling fixes it for ATI users...
graphics drivers are screwy.

Joe,
still motoring along in Win98 grid and A-A slowdown free \:\)

#348715 - 07/25/03 08:03 PM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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For additional information pertaining to this thread, see the following post from the thread at http://oldsite.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/boards/bbs/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=32;t=007145 :

Quote:
Originally posted by ghost2003:
Am running XP - Radeon 9000 with latest drivers for all. Am running sim at full res, eliminated grid lines and A2A Radar frame freezeing, hud display blur... By setting Radeon card Anti-Aliasing to "application default" and de-selecting Jane's F/A 18 "low level mapping". After messing with all drivers, changing video cards etc. this suprisingly simple fix worked.


'Doc' (aka '195th_Doc')
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#348716 - 07/30/03 12:16 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Check out the post below from the thread at http://forums.frugalsworld.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=46971 :

Quote:
Originally posted by Norseman
Downloaded DirectX 9.0 b today.

Compaq PIII, 500 Mz, nVidia driver 44.03, with Win Xp Home, Sparkling Water, Low Level Noise Mapping and everything else turned ON at max, high, far, best ............, all of a sudden no text/grids on water, can see something like waves. However, not sure whether this actually is "sparkling".

However, better than yesterday !


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#348717 - 09/08/03 08:58 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Joe:

Just caught your reply to mine, a few posts back up the thread.

I think you're right. I've tried both of the most recent NVidia drivers sets (43.45 and 44.03, from memory), and my impression is 2X FSAA is doing nothing much all round. Doesn't matter what I do with RviaTuner, either. I had thought this was game-specific.

So yes, it may be no-gridlines because no AA.


"Wait until you see the whites of his eyes."
Sailor Malan, 'Ten of My Rules for Air Fighting', no. 1
#348718 - 10/20/03 07:14 PM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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'Doc' Offline
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The posts below from the thread at http://oldsite.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/boards/bbs/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=32;t=007530 may be of some help:

Quote:
Originally posted by 'Doc':
Just a heads up that I hope turns out to be helpful: The posts below from the thread at http://forums.frugalsworld.com:614/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=50452 may contain the solution to the Radeon/ATI graphics cards' problems in Jane's F/A-18.

Quote:
Originally posted by Dusty Rhodes
...Credit to Griff from the Buddy Boys for even telling me about it....I'll send him a link to this thread to maybe help you out.
Quote:
Originally posted by Griff
Okay, here we go. First of all, many F/A-18 faithfuls have been battling with ATI cards and the various graphic corruptions. As I'm sure you experienced, turning on FSAA with all the normal options selected, things work fine. However, once in air to air mode, FPS drop to nearly zero. Well, along came radlinker which still does not allow you to use FSAA. We, the buddyboys, use the TSH patches, which allows the sim to be ran at higher resoutions. Here is what I use. I run the sim at 16X12 and since at such a high resolution, I don't see the need for FSAA. But, that is a personal choice. Then, I created a rad link which allows me to set various direct x values for the sim. I don't know the technical reason why rad linker works. It is a nice utility which allows a person to create various profiles for each sim. True, the latest catalyst set allows the user to create profiles for each sim. The only difference I see in the options using radlinker is the Z buffer option. Anyway, here are my settings: AF- 8x quality, FSAA-application pref., Texture Preference- high quality, Mipmap detail level- High Quality, Z buffer depth- 16,24,32;8 bit stencil, Vertical sync- app. preference, Alpha dither method- alpha dither method, Alternate Pixel center- disabled, Truform - enabled, W buffer-default.

All my settings are activated in Janes F/A-18, ie sparkling water and low mapping noice. I do use tex fix 2.5 with the art manager. I hope this provides some help for you.

Many emails have been sent to the catalyst crew concerning these problems and either a) they don't care since it is an older sim (which I find hard to believe since they seem very dedicated to get each game/sim to work or b) they don't know how to fix the described problems. Only the catalyst team knows the answer to that. Anyway, hope this helped.

Griff
Quote:
Originally posted by tozziFan
\:D \:D \:D

Griff, thanks a lot: graphics are now fine, and text is ok

\:D \:D \:D
Quote:
Originally posted by JuJu Man
Griff,

Many thanks on that one............great advise.....Frug should make this one a sticky for all the Radeon users.........

Again, cheers

JuJu

\:D


'Doc' (aka '195th_Doc')
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#348719 - 12/08/03 08:06 PM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Joe Offline
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I'm bumping this, as it seems people are still missing it.

I have added the info about Radlinker to the top post.

#348720 - 12/08/03 08:58 PM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Ok, who gave Joe the opener for this can of worms?? hehe! ;\) :p \:D


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#348721 - 12/09/03 05:07 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  

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Excellent FAQ Joe. Your timming for this is great since my PC is being made and soon to be had.. So, if I was to get win 98, 30.xx drivers from http://www.guru3d.com for my ti4600, Run DirectX version 8.1, turn off AA, the sim should work good? Have a 20" monitor and fresnels lens and plan to run 1600 x 1200. Anything else I should know? Getting a seperate HD for F-18 since my main use for it will be the Hornet. Thanks for the detailed F.A.Q.

#348722 - 12/09/03 05:54 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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It should be noted that if you use DirectX 8.1 (or any DirectX less than 9.0b), you have certain security vulnerabilities that need to be corrected with the appropriate MS patch, which is discussed and is available at http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/technet/security/bulletin/MS03-030.asp and which is discussed in more detail and is also available at http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=819696 .


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#348723 - 12/09/03 06:17 PM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zorro:
Excellent FAQ Joe. Your timming for this is great since my PC is being made and soon to be had.. So, if I was to get win 98, 30.xx drivers from http://www.guru3d.com for my ti4600, Run DirectX version 8.1, turn off AA, the sim should work good? Have a 20" monitor and fresnels lens and plan to run 1600 x 1200. Anything else I should know? Getting a seperate HD for F-18 since my main use for it will be the Hornet. Thanks for the detailed F.A.Q.
Sounds good. It's been a while, but I beleive you can even enable AA with those drivers without any negative effects. It might blur your fonts enough that they will not be legible enough, since they will already be small at 16x12.

#348724 - 01/21/04 04:27 PM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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For ATI Radeon (9700 Pro and possibly other 9X00) users (Catalyst 4.1 and possibly other versions):

Joe, Giff and others have mentioned all this earlier in the thread. I'm just trying to consolidate the info and links a little.

1) If you are experiencing gridelines, you can use Radlinker to get rid of them; (here is a link to instructions that may help you download and use it).

2) While AntiAliasing does a beautiful job of getting rid of the "jaggies" (and ocean gridlines), its use, IMO, is much less important if you use one of the higher resolutions available with the TSH v1.0 addon (and Radlinker). While a resolution of 1600x1200 is available, I humbly recommend using 1024x768 or 1280x960 as this eliminates much of the "jaggies" while still allowing the HUD to be of a readable size, IF you use the Large HUD Font Fix, (downloadable here )

#348725 - 04/21/04 02:11 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  

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OK, lots of tweaks and stuff here that is supposed to "FIX" poor graphics. BUT, just changing to Nvidia GeForce4 TI4200 from ATI 9000 Pro fixed EVERYTHING for me. OK again, here is my system:

P4 2.4 GHz, 1 GB RAM, 40 GB 7200 RPM Hard Drive, Win XP Home, Nvidia GeForce4 TI4200 128 MB. Works perfectly. Substitute ATI Radeon 9000 Pro 128 MB, works like crap.

AND my Sony laptop with P4M 2.8 GHz, 512 MB RAM, 40 GB 5400 RPM Hard Drive, Win XP Home, Nvidia GeForce4 420 Go. Works perfectly.

Tell me what I am missing. ATI is crap.

hawk

#348726 - 04/21/04 05:26 AM Re: FAQ for graphics issues - last update 1/30/05  
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Since I wrote this FAQ, I have upgraded from Win98 to WinXP (with a new system), and then I moved from a nVidia Ti 4200 to a Radeon 9800 Pro.

In a few weeks (hopefully by late May) I will go through the FAQ steps with both brands of cards to verify everything myself. Until then, things will have to wait. They tell me I'm graduating in a few weeks (imagine that), so I'm a little busy until school is over.

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