I'm about 10 days into this game and still haven't had anything close to fun.

I have read and re-read trying to figure this game out, but no joy as yet..

In Reference to the control settings. When I fire the guns the zoom zooms in which ruins the heck out of my visual
reference to any target.

I use CH controls and track IR and have the zoom out set to a button, but this zooming out each time is still is a pain.
Is there a default setting that causes this zoom in action every time I shoot?
I hate to start deleting those controls settings without knowing what I am doing.

You can always reset to default, so start changing things to your liking, and then save under a different name.

Also remember to 'apply to fly', otherwise your changes will not take.

RoF isn't any more complicated than other combat flight sims, and yes, it is worth the learning curve so please stick with it for your own enjoyment's sake.

You just have buttons that are conflicting. Just go into controls and change any settings that are conflicting. It's no different a process than any other sim. Click on an action you want to change and then hit a new key or joystick button.

Jason

O.K., then u guys are saying that there is not some "in-game master setting" that is causing it to zoom in
when shooting etc" but that there is a conflict somewhere...
great, what I am now wondering is...which of those 50 or so camera, head etc control settings might be causing this conflict.

It's not that big of deal Papa. Look at the different categories and familiarize yourself with all the controls and key commands. Just like you probably did with all the other sims that you own. In your case you probably have a couple things programmed for Head Zoom which can be programmed to an axis or Head Zoom In and Head Zoom Out which is meant for a button or key stroke.

Jason

Well, having the default button (I guess will bring all controls to normal) helps
I deleted a few things and that zoom in seems to be gone now.

I have spent hours and hours in the controls section going back and forth between deleting something the getting back in the aircraft and
checking it out. It is just very very time consuming.

I only have one other game. Il2. I'm not an avid gamer.

I just thought I'd try this game because it is a flying game.

I may have the controls set fine for now, but tweeking the aircraft via that responses thing is my next attack scenario.
after i do a change & hit save/apply & go to the load button & then to an aircraft.
I do not notice any changes and I don't know if I am getting it into my game or not.
That nice tutorial is o.k. but the fellow keeps referring to "just like before...but I don't know how it worked before...

Ha Ha. at 72 things like learning these damn computer operations is very slow work...

You can tweak the controls while flying. Just pause the game and open the menu (no need to reload the mission).

Be glad you didn't get DCS - Those jet age sims require quite a bit of tweaking (there are a lot more controls to map + the response curves)

I guess all of u younger guys were raised with these computer games, but they are a big mystery to me...ha ha..

I think I have my basic controls set well enough for now though. I can see that the devs have done a lot of work since I last (two years ago) tried this game & just gave up in total frustration.

right now I have been trying to fly7 the Camel, but when I release the controls it goes into a loop.

I have been trying to temper the nose up a bit, but I must be missing a step because it does not pickup when I go
back into the game to fly it.

I save, I apply and I load it...Don't know what I'm doing wrong...

I have watched the guys video on responses, but I think he is leaving out an important part of the explanation because it ain't worken for me...

May I suggest trying something other than the Camel? It's just about the most ornery plane in RoF! No wonder you're not having any fun...

My recommendation would be to try a career with either the Albatros II, the n.11 or n.17, or the Sopwith Pup.

Papa, I'm on the backside of the '40s myself, and I only started fooling around with computers eight years ago, so I know how frustrating some of this can be. I will tell you, RoF is worth the pain. Once you get into it, you'll have a blast.

I've recently been playing with the 'curves' section myself, and I think I'm just going to go back to using the trim wheel on my CH stick to take care of the elevator trim. Trying to set individual curves is a real pain in the @$$ for me, and no one curve fits all aircraft.

I can't fly the Camel (or any other rotary as far as that goes) to save my life. I would suggest starting with the SE5, Bristol, or RE8 if you want to fly Entente. Then work your way into the more difficult planes. I'm no noob when it comes to sim flying either. I started on Il-2 about eight years ago, and I beta-tested RoF. I just can't get the hang of those rotaries and the gyroscopic effect they have.

Also, most ac tend to go nose up with the hands off the controls.

I know that most acft tend to nose-up as you gain speed, but they don't loop...or shouldn't ha ha..

I think I'll take you fellows advice and try to find something more tame... I just always wanted to fly a Sopwith Camel.
I'm sure there is a video made by someone on how to fly it I just haven't run across it yet.

from the patch reads it looks like the RoF builders have done a lot of tweeking since I last tried RoF so I'll just have to stay with it &
see how it goes.

I tried the CH trim wheel, but it did nothing for me so I didn't think it would work in Rof...If it works for you I will
have to try it again...

Thanks for your input guys...

Actually the Camel was historically rigged tail heavy, so it would loop hands-off. AFAIK most of the Sopwith A/C were like this in RL... Glad to hear you're giving it a go! You won't be disappointed.

These WWI fighters were unstable. It was a tradeoff for maneuverability.

My first love (after some bad experiences with other planes) was the Fokker D7! Give it a try. Even with few changes in the response curves you can get a pretty stable plane to start with. Btw, if you do a quick search on this forum you will find good information (and examples) about responses. Good luck.

Cheers

Well guys, I assume that all of these games have a fairly large learning curve, but for me it takes just a little longer.

I have been trying to find a scenario where there is a column of vehicles in close proximity to a base so I can do strafing
runs and fiddle with the responses to get just a small bit of the nose porpoising and the rudder side sashaying out.

right now my controls are set way to loose so all I get is a ...HUGE...side swing and the nose is just bobbing up and down.
Heck, I can't get a shot even close to where I want to hit.

I don't understand the rudder adjustments responses. it is just a straight line.

Oh well, time & distance. I suppose I will come across the right moves sometime...

Playing with the throttle will swing the nose around on an attack run, particularly with radial engined fighters... so maybe that's part of the problem. You might try shooting a balloon rather than the trucks, it's a larger target and you don't have to worry about the ground coming up and wacking you

Personally, I don't fiddle with the response curves, I just leave them all as straight lines. I just learn (or try to) each plane's idiosyncracies and adjust myself.

The straight line means that your rudder input translates into a linear 1=1 in-game rudder response.
It seems like what you want/need to do is increase the deadzone around the middle since you appear to find the controls overly responsive to your input.

C...G... I hear what ur sayen. The idiosyncrasy of each aircraft is very necessary to learn because some of those
short comings can kill ya.

I usually set the power and then leave it alone. A lot of power jockeying is normally not necessary.

However, This is just a game on a computer, and each store-bought set of controls will be a bit different.
Some will fit right in with a particular game and other controllers will be just a bit off one way or the other.
Those a bit off will be needing some tweeking to put things into a useable format.

Also, as you get older you will find that you will loose that fine sense of control that you had at 25.

I have the CH rudder pedals which are about 6 years old and have been restored at the CH repair shop, but that was a coupla
years ago. They are getting a bit sloppy again so I really need to figure out what to do in the yaw portion of the responses.

I had to go over to my Dad's house to help him set up his stick because like you his was giving him all sorts of zooming and looking up whenever he fired the guns. I found the easiest thing to do was adjust a small bit of Down into the Pitch curve and slow down the yaw in the middle and I was fine for about 80% of the planes I have, a few like the Dr.I require a bit more and ones like the D.VII requires less.
I'm not sure how to do it but maybe there's a way to create a save of some basic curve set ups that can be shared.

PapaG, try these settings and see if this doesn't make your enjoyment of the sim significantly better.

I'm pushin' 60 so I hear ya loud and clear!!!

If you need some more "pictorial" examples, just let me know.

Papa,

If you have the CH fighterstick, you can use the trim wheel on the right side of your stick to fix the nose up tendencies of most of these RoF planes. That's what I do. Some require almost full trim. I don't fiddle with the curves either.

The only problem I have is every now and then I forget to roll back that trim before I jump back into IL2. Air-starting a coop with the trim like that is a bit of a shocker. Come to think of it, taking off is kinda rude too.

-dxy

These pics might look better....






If you set up these curves you'll still need to ad some forward cyclic-ooops, I mean stick to fly the following planes but it will be a minor hindrance compared to trying to fly them with the "standard" curves. The Pfalz DXII and the SE-5 are closest to level at full throttle.

The little dead spot for the yaw axis is just as important as it is in the pitch axis. If you don't set it you'll jump all over the place when you try to squeeze off some rounds-bigtime.

I can comfortably fly the Pfalz's (both) Ne28, SE-5, all the Albatross birds, DVII and the two seaters/bombers. Give it a try.

Someone could upload a pre-made profile for him...that might be easier, tho learning to adjust the controls will come in handy as you fly more

I have been trying to make a very small setting profile for the fokker Dlll and I thought I was on to getting it right
when I went to save a train and actually saved it from destruction.

Then I went to shoot up three trucks which the game then directed me to do, and oh boy was I in for a surprise.
using that same profile I couldn't even get close to hitting any of the trucks. My nose would go everywhere but across a truck.
It was horrible.

I have never experienced anything like this before and I really don't even know what those line changes are suppose to do.
I don't even know enough to ask an intelligent question.
I really need to read up on what ever you call this kind of programing to get an idea

I use that picture that copterdvr shows.."thanks copterdvr" but it doesn't seem to be working for me..

HMMMM just checked the wiki and it looks like the devs have up dated the responses area...gota go read...

Well, onward & upward...ha ha..

I can probably give you all a few years... but we seem to be having the same kinds of difficulties with ROF. Is it too much to ask for some decent documentation ?? (lol)

Regarding the Camel, Papa, you might like to get a copy of "Winged Victory" by Yeates. He describes flying the Camel.... " but the Camel had to be flown carefully round with exactly the amount of left rudder or else it would rear and buck and hang upside down and flop and spin. ... Take your hand off the stick and it would rear right up with a terrific jerk and stand on its tail." He also makes the point... "..it was just this instability which gave Camels their good qualities of quickness of maneouvre."

These were the guys doing it for real, so if we have a few similar problems, we're in good company!

BTW, there is a dearth in ROF of practical advice about tailoring curves and aircraft and engines - the IRFC Requiem tutorials in Gen. Discussions are extremely valuable. They all tell us what to do, but it would be nice to have some real working curves which we could tailor for ourselves? Do they exist??

Have fun...

Hey, Copterdrvr, been studying your response curves.... these seem to be for aircraft with inline engines, like the Pfalz and SE5, etc. Have you played around with curves for rotary engines (like the Camel!) ??

ROF does give us the "all aircraft" option, but is it possible to have a generic curve for ALL aircraft??

Regards...

I just finished flying the NE 17 (already knew the NE 28 flew great), Camel, Fokker DRI, DVIII and the Pup. They all flew great.

I don't change my profiles right now-too lazy yet to set up for specific aircraft. I will though-I fly this sim for fun and I want my bird to basically fly level at full throttle.

PappaG, don't forget that you have to name your profile or save it to a particular plane and after adjustments you do have to hit "apply". I've named my personal profile "mine" because if you saved it to the default profile it would be erased-at least it used to work that way. By giving it my own name, it doesn't get written over by an update. If you're not seeing a huge difference in being able to fly the aircraft, you are doing something wrong in the "saving" process as you aren't apparently saving your adjustments.

If someone could tell me where to find my profile, I'll send a copy of it to you via PM. I'll start looking when I get back to my sim computer to see if I can find it...

As I said my profile is named "mine" and I don't currently change it so it's applied to everything I fly.

Hope this helps.

I think I found the files for my inputs and they are listed as mine.responses and mine.actions.

They were found in Program files/Rise of Flight/Data/Input. I can't figure out how to post them in here but if you would like I'll pm them to you. If that doesn't work, I'll get your email via PM and send them to you that way.

I'm pretty sure these are it as they're the only files that have the "mine" name attached to them and that's the name of the "profile" I'm using. They are not a normal text file-I can't open them or even really find out what kind of file they are but I should be able to send them to you via email-I hope!!!

Copterdrvr... c;/program files/rise of flight/data/input is where you will find those created profiles.

I seem to be saving the profiles correctly, I'm just not doing the lines correctly in all cases.

I did get most of the pitch-up out of the camel and just a small amount out of the fokker D7, but where I am screwing up is on the rudder sensitivity and the roll (one wing down) adjustments.

PappaG, look at the last picture in my post---do you notice the 4% that shows up on the top and bottom of the graph?

The lines on the graph show that I've dampened out the effects of my input and the 4% values are the "deadspot" I've added to kill any small or "fine" inputs around the zero axis. You need to do both on the rudder and the elevator or else breathing on the joystick will cause a control input!!!

PapaG39, I am 77 and with chronic heart failure the blood don't get to my brain like it used to so I had trouble learning these new things. Stick with it and ask questions. I was an RL biplane pilot and find the rudder ( I too use CH equipment) too sensitive.
Experiment with the response curves as I did. My curve now is just a fraction off default. On the stick I found it best to use the button on the left side half way down the stick as my machine gun trigger. The stick is sensitive and pulling on that trigger can deflect your aim. Dropping the base of the thumb on the button causes no deflection.
I haven't worked out all the camera thingies yet and some day I might, but for now with CH and TIR 5 I'm as close to flying as ever I was.
I love the Camel but it takes time. You just don't let that nose come up too high on a turn. Also switching from one turn to another is an easy way to stall. The nose comes up unless you are careful. Having said all that follow the advice given and start with any Hun crate except the Dr1. The Albatros DVa is so docile even a brain dead chimpanzee with boxing gloves and divers boots couldn't do anything wrong.
Oh just on the bit about rudders. I find flying in socks helps. The little tootsies can feel what's happening

PapaG, I think I have a temporary answer for you. When I first bought this game I was very frustrated and I wasn't having really any fun at all. The bobbing effect was so painful I couldn't hit anything. Being a long time flyer of sims, it was hard to do what I'm going to tell you. Before you go into a mission, click on the options on the bottom then tick the boxes that say "easy avionics" and "easy piloting". Not 100% sure if that is the right wording because I'm at work and can't check. This is something I have not done in any other sim because I like full realism.

Even though it says easy, it doesn't really mean that it turns it into an arcade experience but it does lessen the "bobbing" effect enough so you can hit stuff. After awhile of getting used to it, I turned those back off. Doing this was the difference between this collecting dust on my shelf, and having a blast.

Hey R...S... It's nice to know that there is another "old fart" out there enjoying this type of flying.

I spent my younger years flying the bush in Alaska and knew what it was like to fly a plane that was caked with mud or snow and all bent out of shape, and needed constant control to keep it straight & level...ha ha..

After flying a very long day in crappy weather I'd be so wiped out all I wanted was a drink & the rack...

Now I'm just not in the mood to fly something that just bobbs up and down & is constantly shashaying from side to side.

I don't particularly care what the kids say about how a "real" WWI aircraft flew...been there done that already...ha ha..

God love em, but I want a more peaceable, smoother flying piece of wood & rag to have fun with. After all..It is just a play game!

I just have to hit on the correct placement of those lines in the responses section and it should work out for me..

I was looking at those training films by Requihm (spelling ???) and I notice that his demenstrations of this, that and the other thing were ones of rock solid flying...not a sloppy movement of the aircraft at all. I believe he has tweeked his controls to the best that can be done.

Anyway, thanks for the input guys. I'll try everything you all suggested.

Papa, I think what might help is to fly in Fly Now mission. Get your endorsement before combat. One possible problem I have found, I don't know whether it is in the game or the stick, is an odd lag in elevator control which is intermittent. Now before each flight I do my flight checks on stick and rudders, full movement on each before I start the engine.. I don't use anything but the default responses on stick and find, even in the Camel, I can control the movement and have no twitch. That short stick does need a tender hand. You'll probably find you need less rudder than you are used to in RL. Keep the questions coming. The guys here all want to help.

Hey sheppards;

Yeah, that's exactly what I have been doing along with a whole lot of reading everything that I can find on this game.

The settings stuff is exceedingly difficult to sort out of all the assorted chit chat and BS.

The devs seem to take the time to put some stuff in the wike, but they don't go into detail on exactly the procedure from start to finish.

They are great at saying..."you can do this or that" but damned if they will go into a step by step on what you can do with this or that...

I do not read in between the lines and I do not know how they did things before.

For instance: you can make a game profile...Yeaaa such a deal... now what the blazes do you do with the dots on the line?
do you put them close to the center or far..what is the difference between the straight linear line and the S curve except one is straight and the other curved... and please...don't give me that X over Y + P or some damn high math answer...I don't
know what your talking about.

On my CH controls the left wing is a bit low causing me to hold a constant stick to the right along with a bit forward.
I have been trying to get a close to level aircraft, but I have no idea where to put the little dots or wiggle lines.

This may take months to figure out.

But on a good note...I am having fun learning to fly the Sopwith Camel. I got the nose toned down a bit & if it starts bobbing I just extend out & come back around for another shot. I am by no means good, but I am clear up to fair...ha ha...

The issue might also be that many different people have lots of different hardware--they can't write a step-by-step for each brand of joystick and its controlling software (in how many different languages as well, RoF has an international following). You need to be responsible for learning your own sim tools.


Sounds like you might need to calibrate your joystick, here is a place to start CLICK HERE.

And if you don't want that feel of a WWI crate/bus, with all its idiosyncrasies and wandering, then do try turning off the advanced physics, you may get better FPS as a bonus.

My joystick is calibrated just fine.
If there is a way to lift the wing a bit via the responses I would like to know how to do it.

PappaG, I can tell you're getting frustrated-all I can say is print the "example" I posted for you that shows the profiles and do your best to try and replicate them on your machine. Blow them up when you print them (if you can) so you can move the reference points to the desired location.

It really is pretty easy if you just try to follow the example given. Even if you're just close, it'll be way better than what you're dealing with now...

Hey Copterdrvr...

You can tell huh...ha ha..

Thank you for posting the pic's...and Yes, I have copied your scenarios exactly and am using them on the Se5a and the Camel.
they work very well, but I did tone them down a bit.

I have spent a lot...I mean "A LOT" of time searching through the sim HQ and the other forum trying to find some useful
info. It is very hard to find the pointed information. However, I just keep trying I know that in the years since this game came out that a lot of people have taken there time to try and help others, but that info is very difficult to come across...mostly by accident...ha ha..

Possible my controller is the fault where as the left wing is always a bit low, but it causes me to really work hard to keep it level and
fly an accurate firing attack and a ground target. I find myself in a cross control situation sometimes and it is terribly difficult to hold steady, or to get even a 1/2 sec directly on a target and to fire accurately...

Anyway, I have spent a lot of time trying to figure out where to put the dots on any line that would lift the wing just a bit,
but I just can't get anything to work for me.

I know that people that have the CH joystick keep saying to use the little dial on the back side of the joystick, but that
back dial is NOT for trim, it is for calibration only...Just check on the CH forum..One of those CH tech guys wrote a very good synopsis
on the CH calibration of the fighter-stick a few years ago...

Oh well, onward and upward....I am having a bit of fun learning the Camel. that little rascal can get a body in a heap-a-trouble in a heart beat...ha ha..

Good luck with it Papa, I find my left wing dipping as well I use the CH stick and try to resist the urge to use the calibration wheel. I found the best way to test the settings was to start a quick mission pause it go into the controls change a dot or two and resume the mission. At 42 that's the best way I can find to hone each plane to where I like it, its not bouncing or dipping one way or another. Its a real pain though to do it for every plane..I got them all. Just keep at it, you'll get it where you need it.

PapaG, I'm going to see if I can come up with a profile that will cause my aircraft to turn right, which might help your situation. I'm thinking it's a joystick issue-none of my planes want to turn except for the gyroscopic effects of the particular aircrafts engines.

I'll get back to you when I get some results!

Thanks for that wing low info Logan. I'm glad that I'm not the only one. ha ha... Either that or it's a characteristic of the
CH fighter stick.

In any case, it really needs to be fixed because it's a real pain to fly that way.

I have tried different things with the CH control manager, but no joy there either.

Chopterdrvr...

We both hope you can come up with something from your end....Gives you another little project to occupy your spare time...

And, from my testing..It is not a rudder problem either because all right rud does is causes it to turn right but with a little weft wing low.
right rud does bring the left wing up a bit, but not enough...

This game is the only one that had the left wing drop for me. I have only "fixed" half of the planes or less, but I'd be more than happy to send you what I got so far.

Howdy L

Well, Wonders never cease to amaze me...I finely figured how to lift the wing.

In the roll area I did a linear line and just put a bunch of dots on it and moved them just a tiny bit to the left and
danged if it didn't start to work. Then fine tuned the lines a bit & i'm back to a normal level flying aircraft.

I am not an avid gamer and so far I have spent around 40 hours just trying to learn the responses and control stuff,
of which about 75% turns out to be totally useless to me.

I have spent so much time on this that I am getting more behind then when I started...ha ha.. if that's possible..

The CH products (joystick, throttle and pedals) have a control manager which also puts inputs into the controls,
and along with the RoF responses inputs I am wondering if between the two of them it is causing a conflict of interests..

I have completely destroyed my il2 flight settings though. I know there is a-way to do profile settings, but damn...I'd have to have a set for il2 and another for ROF plus all these settings for each aircraft in RoF...I'd be a year just screwing around wasting my time on this fool game...