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#3478428 - 12/21/11 06:48 AM Re: Pfalz Impressions [Re: totalspoon]
PatrickAWilson Offline
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Registered: 01/19/07
Posts: 656
Loc: Tx
I would find it hard to believe that in real life a Pfalz could make a right turn in anywhere near the radius or turn rate of a Camel. That rotary engine pulls hard. Again, left turns are a different story and I freely admit that I have no idea what the results would be there.

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#3478470 - 12/21/11 07:47 AM Re: Pfalz Impressions [Re: Bandy]
RoFfan Offline
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Registered: 06/20/10
Posts: 372
Originally Posted By: Bandy
Originally Posted By: RoFfan
...I wouldn't be surprised if the Pfalz D.IIIa had a smaller turn radius than the Camel.

Well, to use historic accounts, pilots say they could turn so quickly to the right with a Camel that they could be buffeted by their own slipstream. Truth or willful exaggeration? Usually there is a grain of truth in statements like that, and I do believe the Camel could turn quicker to the right owing to torque effects.


Let me clarify, I mean, in the simulation called RoF I wouldn't be surprised if the Pfalz D.IIIa had a smaller radius than the Camel. cheers

In Mig-77's tests, the Pfalz D.IIIa turns a complete circle in ~11 seconds at 120kmh (sustained). The Camel completes a circle in ~9s at 130kmh (you can get slower but it takes a while to settle down that much!). So, it looks like I'm wrong about the smaller radius. My guess second guess would be that the Pfalz D.IIIa has a very good instantaneous turn, and it takes the Camel a long time to lose airspeed during a hard turn. Those two things together might give the temporary impression that the Pfalz D.IIIa can turn with the Camel.

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#3478835 - 12/21/11 05:03 PM Re: Pfalz Impressions [Re: Bandy]
R_Suppards Offline
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Registered: 06/06/10
Posts: 711
Loc: melb australia
Originally Posted By: Bandy

Well, to use historic accounts, pilots say they could turn so quickly to the right with a Camel that they could be buffeted by their own slipstream. Truth or willful exaggeration? Usually there is a grain of truth in statements like that, and I do believe the Camel could turn quicker to the right owing to torque effects.

Hitting your own slipstream is truth. In the Tiger Moth it was a source of pride on my part to cut my own slipstream in a tight turn. It indicated I had balanced elevator and rudder properly. It was not buffeting but a slight jerk on the controls. This is why I have raised the issue of the Pfalz turn. On more than one occasion I have been in a sustained turn which would have washed off any residual energy the Pfalz may have had and still the best I could do was to maintain distance and arc. On a few occasions I have been the one with the energy advantage yet still am unable to close.
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