I just got a new computer that can run RoF two weeks ago, and got RoF last weekend, so I guess even though this thread is old it's all new to me.

Having played both sims now (although I have more time in OFF), I have to disagree with Wodin and state that, to me, RoF is far more immersive.

I have really tried to like OFF and I have the original as well as the Hat in the Ring expansion. I do like the extraordinary range of aircraft in the game and I have had some tense moments of flying and fighting.

However, immersion comes in many forms. I can appreciate what you are saying about the whole "war going on around you" in OFF and I like that aspect of the campaign. I've run into some amazing situations in Falcon 4 when going about my mission and coming across some AI flight doing something completely unrelated. Yet, I find that when I crawl into my virtual plane in RoF, I feel so much more like I am really flying a WW1 bird over a warzone than I do in OFF. This is likely a function of graphics, flight modeling, and little touches that it is hard to quantify but in total add up to the whole experience. For example, I love the whole flare mechanic. I can't believe how much I love the rain drops on my goggles when it rains or when I fly through clouds, or the oil that spatters me when my engine is hit. I love that I can actually navigate by the terrain, can distinguish things on the ground and identify landmarks. These are all things that are missing in OFF, and while the spawning aircraft thing in RoF might not be as immersive in the "big picture" as a true AI war, I much prefer that than to be stuck in 1x time compression for 20 minutes while an enemy AI flight is off doing something completely unrelated to me in OFF, whereas in RoF I can just zoom on past and get on with it.

I enjoy having the entire planeset immediately available in OFF. At first I was opposed to the whole DLC airplane thing in RoF. However, now that I've done the math, and spent some time with the game, I find that I don't mind it much at all. I spent $10 for MSCS 3, $30 for BH&H, and another $30 for HitR (or more, I can't remember, they were at least $30 apiece). So let's call it $70 total conservatively. I spent $10 to get Iron Cross RoF which comes with 7 planes. The average plane on RoF is $8-10, with discounts if you buy in bulk. Let's say I buy 10 planes at a 30% discount...that's $80 total for 17 planes. I have to say that, if that's not close to what is in OFF, it has to be in the ballpark. Given the detail with each plane, that's a lot of flying. I also find that spending a few bucks when I'm ready for a new "toy" is easy enough compared to dropping $30-50 a pop.

So, in closing, I find RoF more immersive than OFF. I've bought OFF and I encourage others to give it a try- especially if your computer won't run RoF. I'm now in the opposite corner where my blazing rig won't run OFF without something to turn off 3 of my cores...and I'm just not ready for that. Maybe if Phase 4 brings something revolutionary to the table.

They are both great sims, and we are very fortunate to have such choices to make.

Everyone has preferences, for people different things count for immersion. However many people like more than one sim or game at the same time - something personally I have always encouraged. WW1 sims especially need support - they are a very rare breed and without good support from sim fans none will continue to exist. Also PC flight sims are not a great return on the vast amount of work involved believe me. OFF has a whole world going on around you and we worked hard to make you feel like it's not a computer generated situation but like Red Baron you stumble into situations that are going on if you are there or not rather than spawning nearby. Something we killed a long time ago.

For the record, anyone considering OFF and watching the pennies the cost of Over Flanders Fields: "Between Heaven and Hell" and the "Hat in the Ring!" expansion was reduced by $10 each a few months back (HITR is $9.99! for example) so there is no reason to not own if you like WW1 sims.

We have improved BH&H and HITR several times after release, adding features too, but of course for the last couple of years or so we have been putting all of our efforts from our small team working very hard on the next version of OFF which we think people will enjoy greatly

Will BH&H and HITR be required for Phase 4?

No they will not. Nor are they compatible.

Phase 4 - now being referred to by the Dev team as OFF 2 - is a total re-write from the ground up, not unlike Skyrim was to Oblivion, if you follow the Elder Scrolls series of RPGs. Yes, it uses the same basic engine, but the re-write of the code was so substantial that it is not a compatible product. It will still require a few CFS3 files, but other than that it's a whole new ballgame.

From the list of improvements that they have shown in their preview video and screenshots as well as what they have hinted at and described, it'll be a revolutionary step for the series, not an evolutionary one. The improvements and additions are vast, comprehensive and well thought out.

Hellshade

Thanks for the info.. really looking forward to it!

So OFF 2 is the next Skyrim?

Sign me up! I'm in! Here...here's my wallet...just take whatever you need!

It'll be "the Skyrim of the WWI skies". Have you been over to the official site and viewed the screenshots and preview movie? Tremendous work has been done in every area of the sim. Winder (one of the Devs) even leaked out that Flak will become more intense and more accurate as the war goes on, just as it did in real life. Personally, I can't wait.

Hellshade

I've now been flying RoF for one year. As a member of a squadron, I appreciate team flying in MP. For solo campaigns I use Pat Wilson Campaign Generator, although I must say the game Career has been improving with the last releases. I also enjoy navigation with landmarks on the map ( for MP evenings I usually display the map on my laptop nearby ). Graphics are beautiful, even on my 3 year old Core Duo E8500 with XP.
I had been looking at OFF for a while now, and seeing the new price I ordered BHaH. Right after the first flights, I bought HitR expansion plus picked up a few mods on Combat Ace while it was still online... So far I like the immersion and the early war capabilities as RoF is more 1917/1918 oriented.
I think we are lucky to have two good WW1 sims and will share my flying time on both, looking forward to "Wings over Flanders Fields".

Indeed, Corsair, the reall simmers enjoy them all, instead of debating over them.
I fly MP with RoF with some guys every now and then, and for my most immersive
campaign flying, I enjoy the historical depths of OFF.

When WOFF is released, I will definitely give MP another go there too.

OFF has another thing going for it in terms of immersion: OFFbase, my role-playing simulation of life between flights. With CombatAce down, I've posted info over here.