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#3382390 - 09/04/11 05:56 PM
Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
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Junior Member
Registered: 12/18/10
Posts: 52
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Been going back through the main campaign and was just wondering what your thoughts are on some of the missions.
Probably one of the most difficult I've ran into was the Alpha Strike on the Kuznetsov. The briefing tells me that the AI-controlled SEAD flyers should have knocked out all the ship-board SAMs making this mission a relative milk-run, but of course, that's a lie. Even with a division of SEAD dedicated Superhornets I added to my own flight, I'm still beaming and dodging SA-10, SA-11, and SA-15 launches before I can get into range with my Paveways.
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#3382410 - 09/04/11 06:54 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 10/22/10
Posts: 350
Loc: Canada
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The one where I have to either bomb the nuke containment facilities and the convoy moving them. Gets me everytime. D:
EDIT: Also, Paveways? Did you run out of harpoons or something?
Edited by NPOSuperhornet (09/04/11 06:56 PM)
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#3382419 - 09/04/11 07:13 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Lion]
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Junior Member
Registered: 12/18/10
Posts: 52
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The one where I have to either bomb the nuke containment facilities and the convoy moving them. Gets me everytime. D:
EDIT: Also, Paveways? Did you run out of harpoons or something? The briefing recommended either the GBU-24s or the Walleyes. Also in my experience the naval SA-11s do a pretty good job of shooting down Harpoons, even if you set them to low-altitude skimming flight.
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#3382453 - 09/04/11 08:17 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 08/26/01
Posts: 1098
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Intercepting the attack on the carrier by the Tu-22s. I always loose the carrier unless I stack the loadout and aircraft # in my favor.
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#3382760 - 09/05/11 08:26 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 10/22/10
Posts: 350
Loc: Canada
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The one where I have to either bomb the nuke containment facilities and the convoy moving them. Gets me everytime. D:
EDIT: Also, Paveways? Did you run out of harpoons or something? The briefing recommended either the GBU-24s or the Walleyes. Also in my experience the naval SA-11s do a pretty good job of shooting down Harpoons, even if you set them to low-altitude skimming flight. The briefing also recommended 3x 480 tanks for TARPS escort missions. After that nightmare, I learned to stop taking the briefings recommendations. 
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#3383147 - 09/05/11 03:26 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Junior Member
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 90
Loc: Santiago, Chile.
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Escorts missions are the hardest. Staying alive is not that hard, just being very selfish running in and out fast will do, but helping a careless TARPS F-14 is a different story.
Also missions from phase 3 are very difficult, no only because of those nasty Su-35 but also because I couldn't shoot SA-11 sites back (object limiter didn't loaded those SAMs, however the still could fire!)
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#3383791 - 09/06/11 10:29 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Mediocrity Above All!
Senior Member
Registered: 12/30/00
Posts: 4598
Loc: Randolph, NJ
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The briefing recommended either the GBU-24s or the Walleyes. Also in my experience the naval SA-11s do a pretty good job of shooting down Harpoons, even if you set them to low-altitude skimming flight.
I thought that issue was fixed in TSH 4.02. Originally, there was an error in the RCS setting for the Harpoon. It basically had the radar signature of an F/A-18 and was very prone to getting shot down by SAMs. A workaround was to use a SLAM against Naval Targets since the RCS was correctly set as much smaller, and had greater probability (though not 100%) of penetrating the anti-missile defenses. My tactic (often resulting in untimely ejection, I have to say ) was to fire the Harpoon/SLAM at max range, then burner in at low level so I pretty much overtook the missile and had an envelope to launch HARM. Since the HARM travels faster than the Harpoon/SLAM and was fired somewhat ahead of it, there was a good chance to take out the radars directing counter-fire at the shipkillers before they could engage them. Holding wingies out of range and ordering them to fire only after HARMS could do their job also allowed their Harpoons to get through. I don't know that I actually succeeded in the campaign mission with this tactic, but it worked against smaller naval groups in custom scenarios. Even better in Multiplayer where you could have a section of devoted HARM shooters with the AGM-84's carriers hanging back.
Edited by Recluse (09/06/11 10:34 AM)
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#3383807 - 09/06/11 10:50 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Recluse]
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Junior Member
Registered: 04/05/11
Posts: 18
Loc: Canada
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The briefing recommended either the GBU-24s or the Walleyes. Also in my experience the naval SA-11s do a pretty good job of shooting down Harpoons, even if you set them to low-altitude skimming flight.
I thought that issue was fixed in TSH 4.02. Originally, there was an error in the RCS setting for the Harpoon. It basically had the radar signature of an F/A-18 and was very prone to getting shot down by SAMs. A workaround was to use a SLAM against Naval Targets since the RCS was correctly set as much smaller, and had greater probability (though not 100%) of penetrating the anti-missile defenses. My tactic (often resulting in untimely ejection, I have to say ) was to fire the Harpoon/SLAM at max range, then burner in at low level so I pretty much overtook the missile and had an envelope to launch HARM. Since the HARM travels faster than the Harpoon/SLAM and was fired somewhat ahead of it, there was a good chance to take out the radars directing counter-fire at the shipkillers before they could engage them. Holding wingies out of range and ordering them to fire only after HARMS could do their job also allowed their Harpoons to get through. I don't know that I actually succeeded in the campaign mission with this tactic, but it worked against smaller naval groups in custom scenarios. Even better in Multiplayer where you could have a section of devoted HARM shooters with the AGM-84's carriers hanging back. I can't remember if it was 4.02 that fixed that or if it was TSHs weapon mod that saw limited release...
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#3383922 - 09/06/11 12:18 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Veteran
Registered: 04/05/02
Posts: 17731
Loc: Bridgewater, NJ
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Nope, the Harpoon RCS error (and it is a confirmed error) has not been fixed in a public TSH release.
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#3384081 - 09/06/11 02:25 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 04/17/09
Posts: 103
Loc: IA
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The original install of just the disk didn't have the Harpoon problem, almost all of them would hit. When Jane's released the 1.01 patch that was one of the "fixes", that ships defences were increased. Before I knew TSH exsisted and you had to have the patch to download their mods, I unistalled my patched version of JF-18 and reinstalled the disk without the patch for that reason.
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#3384859 - 09/07/11 12:30 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Veteran
Registered: 04/05/02
Posts: 17731
Loc: Bridgewater, NJ
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The actual problem, though, is the RCS (radar cross section) value for the Harpoon. It ostensibly should be the same as it is for the SLAM missile (same missile body, different warhead and different terrain-following capability). However, the RCS value for the Harpoon is the same as the Super Hornet! That means the missile has just as much chance of getting shot down as does an F-18E when in-close to enemy carriers (or less chance, since it doesn't have an afterburner and is less maneuverable). As we all know from getting shot down by the Soviet fleet defenses, it's a tough situation to survive. The Harpoon should be a lot more survivable because it is a much smaller object than an attack aircraft.
If there is ever another TSH release, the Harpoon RCS will be fixed. It is tough for me to find time these days to work on modding.
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#3385027 - 09/07/11 03:35 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 10/22/10
Posts: 350
Loc: Canada
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What about the possibility of just a small patch for the Harpoon? Or does it require extensive effort to correct that particular problem and would be better off with an entirely new release?
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#3385104 - 09/07/11 05:01 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Junior Member
Registered: 04/05/11
Posts: 18
Loc: Canada
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Hey Joe, any chance TSH might just release the weaponeering mod that's already complete, rather than waiting for the next TSH version? I went back through my files and it looks like the RCS problem mentioned above is fixed in that mod...
Edited by HighAlpha (09/07/11 05:04 PM)
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#3390935 - 09/15/11 03:22 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Junior Member
Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 23
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The escort missions have to be some of the most ridiculous missions in the game. The mission that I have been stuck on for a while is in Phase III escorting the flight of F-18Cs to destroy the HF signals facility (2931444). It seems that either the SA-10 or the Russian MiG-29s lay the F-18Cs to waste.
Second up is the mission where you have to destroy the nuclear bunkers. Way back when, I used to be able to use a SLAM-ER+ or two to take out those bunkers. Now, they are invincible! I think I read on here that the bunkers are "floating" off the ground and thus can't be destroyed?
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#3391009 - 09/15/11 05:53 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 10/22/10
Posts: 350
Loc: Canada
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I personally use the MK61 nuke mod for that particular mission. :p
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#3391239 - 09/16/11 04:40 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 04/17/09
Posts: 103
Loc: IA
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4 JDAM-31s will do the job also.
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#3391266 - 09/16/11 05:19 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Junior Member
Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 23
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I kind of refuse to use the KM61 nuke mode.  FOUR JDAM-31s??? Man, I tried just about every type of ordinance on those bunkers but not FOUR of them!  Maybe that could have gotten me away from this insipid F-18C escort mission!
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#3391353 - 09/16/11 07:55 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 04/17/09
Posts: 103
Loc: IA
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Most of the time 3 JDAM-31s will take it out, but once in awhile it wasn't enough so I started using 4. This is a fairly easy mission if you find the way.
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#3391375 - 09/16/11 08:29 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Junior Member
Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 23
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I agree. I equate most of the mission's original difficultly in that I was 13 years old when I played the mission in 2000; I was surprised how easy it was to fly up to the bunkers yet dismayed when nothing appeared to dent the bunkers! 4 JDAM-31s on 1 bunker is kind of expensive though.
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#3391376 - 09/16/11 08:30 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Junior Member
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 90
Loc: Santiago, Chile.
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Two GBU-24A will destroy a bunker. As for the F-18C escort mission, I modified the F-18C flying altitude on their ingress and set them a pop up attack, it ridiculous to bomb a target flying at 15000ft within range of an SA-10, with Su-35s all over the place.
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#3391381 - 09/16/11 08:38 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: khriztian]
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Junior Member
Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 23
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Two GBU-24A will destroy a bunker. As for the F-18C escort mission, I modified the F-18C flying altitude on their ingress and set them a pop up attack, it ridiculous to bomb a target flying at 15000ft within range of an SA-10, with Su-35s all over the place. Yeah, I should probably do that! It is practically suicide for those planes to fly at 15k feet for that mission! I've done an 8-plane flight, fitted half the flight with CAP and the other half with SEAD to no avail. I've tried to go commando and take out the SAMs along the F-18C flight route only to find the F-18Cs destroyed by the SU-35s (even with F-14 escort and my flight with CAP armaments set to "engage bandits")! I didn't have any problem with the other escort missions previous to this one. That SA-10 takes the cake!
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#3391551 - 09/16/11 12:54 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 04/17/09
Posts: 103
Loc: IA
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OR, you can take out the SA-10 yourself. Take off and fly low at 34 degree heading, 67 miles from WPT WO you'll come to a shallow valley (the terrain will be lighter green) follow that valley until the the light green spreads out left, make a 45 degree turn, fly up to the ridge in front of you, pop up and when the SA-10 turns its radar on let go with a HARM. The SA-10 will only be 10 or 15 miles from you so turn as soon as possible because it will start shooting. The SA-10 is flagged so as soon as the radar is hit 2 MIGs take off from a nearby airfield. Your close enough to the target so you can either take it out before the MIGs get there or wait for them to close the range and shoot them down. The SU-35s have never bothered me in this mission and I've flown it well over a hundred times. Their reaction range must be set very low because they just keep flying their CAP waypoints.
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#3391759 - 09/16/11 07:56 PM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Junior Member
Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 23
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I got fed up and just changed the altitude of the F-18Cs to 1500ft. It was a much more pleasant experience!
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#3468987 - 12/06/11 10:41 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: HighAlpha]
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Veteran
Registered: 04/05/02
Posts: 17731
Loc: Bridgewater, NJ
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Hey Joe, any chance TSH might just release the weaponeering mod that's already complete, rather than waiting for the next TSH version? I went back through my files and it looks like the RCS problem mentioned above is fixed in that mod... The weaponeering mod never was completed; most of the groundwork was layed, though.
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#3469554 - 12/07/11 07:06 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Hotshot
Registered: 01/16/03
Posts: 6440
Loc: Austin, TX
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Is anyone aware of a way to hack the game to reduce the RCS of the Harpoons?
That one fix alone would be pretty huge!
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#3469602 - 12/07/11 08:25 AM
Re: Stock campaign missions you've found the most difficult?
[Re: Agiel7]
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Member
Registered: 10/22/10
Posts: 350
Loc: Canada
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I just started using SLAM-ERs instead of harpoons.
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