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#3302222 - 05/24/11 05:02 AM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign **** [Re: Para_Bellum]
Zero Niner Offline
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Registered: 11/25/99
Posts: 1365
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Your grim situation makes me wonder if rather than a broad front assault in the initial stages (which is the impression I get from reading the AARs) one would be better served by conserving forces and selecting points of attack - one of the key principles of the attack, if memory serves me.
It will be interesting to see how the rest of the winter pans out.


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#3302290 - 05/24/11 08:29 AM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign [Re: vonKhan]
Para_Bellum Offline
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Originally Posted By: vonKhan
Does the game let you train new formations?


The Red Army commander can create new formations (within certain historical limits), the German player has to make do with historical reinforcements. For example: in the current turn (30) I got two fresh infantry divisions from OKW. Now I just need to rail them from Berlin to Moscow...


Originally Posted By: Ssnake
It would be interesting to know whether you can choose to build new formations, or to train reinforcements that then get assigned to existing divisions. In the "Kampfkraft" study by Martin van Creveld this was identified as one of the points that gave the Wehrmacht an edge.


Ah, one of my favourite WW2 books!

You can't create German formations the same way you can create Red Army formations. But what you can do as German commander is, for example, disband the Luftwaffe field divisions (or actually any other unit) and have their manpower and equipment be used as "normal" replacements.

Originally Posted By: Zero Niner
Your grim situation makes me wonder if rather than a broad front assault in the initial stages (which is the impression I get from reading the AARs) one would be better served by conserving forces and selecting points of attack - one of the key principles of the attack, if memory serves me.
It will be interesting to see how the rest of the winter pans out.


Keep in mind that it's not the combat that is killing me, but rather the weather conditions during the Blizzards. My casualties up to the 1st week of December were actually pretty light (~400.000).

Combat losses during the Blizzards are still (somewhat) sustainable despite my divisions having their combat value drastically reduced while the Red Army units have theirs doubled and trippled. But the 80.000-100.000 additional casualties due to the cold are brutal.

On a happy note: the first convalescents are starting to return to their units. I hope it's enough.
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#3302346 - 05/24/11 09:30 AM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign [Re: Para_Bellum]
Zero Niner Offline
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Registered: 11/25/99
Posts: 1365
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How long does it take you to plan then play a turn?

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#3302366 - 05/24/11 09:47 AM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign [Re: Para_Bellum]
Para_Bellum Offline
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It really depends on the turn and how much micro-management you're willing to do.

Some turns can be done in 10-15 minutes, others might easily take an hour or more. I'd say on average I need about an hour for a turn.
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#3302538 - 05/24/11 12:44 PM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign [Re: Para_Bellum]
vonKhan Offline
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Well here's hoping come spring time you can open a can of whoop arse on Ivan.
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#3302649 - 05/24/11 02:53 PM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign [Re: Para_Bellum]
Heretic Offline
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Originally Posted By: Para_Bellum
@ Heretic: if I understand the manual correctly, until the end of February. Which would be another 8 weeks. I have no idea how I can cope with the losses if the casualty rates stay that high.


A soft retreat à "lure in and cut off"?



Originally Posted By: Nixer
Your infantry casualties remind me why I choose Armor when I joined the Army!


The panzer force - where the equipment is more precious than the men manning it...at least that's what I was told in my day.

"You [conscripts] are expendable, this Leopard 2 is not." biggrin
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#3302952 - 05/24/11 11:46 PM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign [Re: Heretic]
Nixer Offline
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Originally Posted By: Heretic
A soft retreat à "lure in and cut off"?


Yeah...maybe on the southern flank before the spring thaw and mud. Then try to bag a bunch and get Stalingrad?

The again, it may just be unwinnable????
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#3303009 - 05/25/11 03:41 AM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign [Re: Para_Bellum]
Ssnake Offline
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Registered: 12/16/99
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Well, in historic comparison he got substantially farther than the Wehrmacht did in 1941, and historically the biggest advance wasn't made until about September 1942, so there's still a fair chance to win, it seems. The question is whether the game cheats by giving the Russians more resources than they should have (especially here in this example, after the fall of a few important industrial centers in 1941 already), and how many forces will later be tied down with policing the area against the partisans.

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#3303288 - 05/25/11 12:04 PM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign [Re: Para_Bellum]
Immermann Offline
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Originally Posted By: Para_Bellum
Turn 28, December 25th 1941

East of Novgorod the 58th Infantry Division, gallantly supported by more than 80 aircraft, repulsed attacks by 3 Soviet rifle divisions, 2 rifle brigades, 1 naval infantry brigade and several artillery regiments, inflicting over 5.000 casualties, while suffering only light losses (363 men). In the Vyshnyvolochek sector the 251st Infantry Division helds its position against 3 rifle brigades, 2 tank brigades, a rifle division and a cavalry corps! South of Voronezh the 71st Infantry Divisions fought back 3 rifle divisions, 2 tank brigades and 2 naval infantry brigades.


Ah! So this is where those elusive Iron Crosses grow!
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#3303496 - 05/25/11 03:40 PM Re: WitE: Grand Campaign [Re: Nixer]
Heretic Offline
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Originally Posted By: Nixer
Yeah...maybe on the southern flank before the spring thaw and mud. Then try to bag a bunch and get Stalingrad?

The again, it may just be unwinnable????


I don't know how the Wehrmacht prepared for Fall Blau in summer '42, but I think they got at least a few reinforcements and pulled some units from the northern front. They kept the Soviets busy around Rzhev (to suggest a threat for Moscow), but instead broke through the rather weak lines down south to capture some oil and industrial areas.

As Snake said, Para is in a much better position than the Wehrmacht was historically, so I guess the "A-A line" (Archangelsk-Astrakhan) isn't an entirely utopian goal for the winter '42-'43.

The main point until February is not giving up any important strategically important cities...
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