Looks like it may be out for Summer 2012,

http://airlockalpha.com/node/8384

Good choice of the two.
I guess this is also some insight into the future of actual Clancy books to go movie---not happening in favor of just using the characters name for a regular movie.

As for ST2, I hope they get the story right. It's hard to bring it with movie #2.

As far as I'm concerned, all of the Clancy films after Hunt for Red October have ranged from mediocre to bad so maybe it's best for Paramount to just retire that franchise.

I'd still have liked to see Without Remorse made into a film with Liev Schreiber (sp?) or Barry Pepper as the lead.

well, at least we know of 1 good scifi film on the (semi-distant) horizon, what with all these stinkers over the past year or so

Without Remorse, Rainbow Six and a proper Clear and Present Danger---that one was pretty much a 90% rewrite. I liked it, but they could do that real story in another movie and it would be really good.
And no Harrison Ford please, I like the guy but haven't ever liked him in this role. Thought Baldwin was far better in Red October.

Over the past 5 years the only good new sci-fi films I've seen are Inception and Star Trek. Tron Legacy was ok but nothing special.

You and I are carbon copies here. I really like Ford and admire a lot of his work but he was just dull and forgettable as Ryan. Too bad they couldn't get Baldwin back.

Filming in the fall and released in summer doesn't seem to leave a lot of time for post-production work for a big, effects-heavy movie. Isn't 2 years more the norm?

Don't forget Pandorum and Sunshine.
Other than those...can't think of much, certainly not big releases.

Funny, I thought all of those were equally mediocre except ST. Sunshine, Pandorum, Tron, Inception...all were fine to watch and then forget.

As for Clancy films, I think Cardinal of the Kremlin would've been excellent, but when the USSR went away it seemed Hollywood had no interest on making films that involved it unless it was during WWII. CotK could easily have taken place during the late 80s, in fact it even had a Soviet SDI-type program and Afghan jihadis in it, but it seems the only time they have stuff take place in the late 80s now are flashbacks or hot tub time travel films.

I always thought the odds of Rainbow Six getting made were slim because the bad guys were environmentalists and Hollywood probably found that too close to their own viewpoint!



The Jedi Master

Nah, they could have just changed the bad guys to Neo-Nazis like they did in Sum of All Fears. Problem solved!

I have not read any of the Jack Ryan books, but I always thought the idea was that he was a desk guy, and not really a field agent, and that's part of the twist that made his involvement with a lot of the things he was doing a little different than a spy, and I thought Harrison Ford pulled that off pretty well. He's not a highly trained spy, just an analyst with a sharp mind who doesn't expect to have to shoot his way out of a situation.

I'm just hoping the next Trek film is better than the last. To me, even though it was shot with ADD action sequences, overall it was just kind of blah. The story wasn't very compelling and the characters were thrown together and developed too quickly, in my opinion.

I know some people might label me as an old-school Trek fan who insists on following canon, but I think one of the things the last movie was missing was the cadets coming up through the ranks. I think that builds character, and to have them just jump from cadets to starship command crews was unrealistic and less interesting.

I understand they had to get them into the action, but then maybe they could have started with them already serving on ships or something, and then coming together as a command crew, instead of the academy thing.

The latest Star Trek was IMHO the best Trek movie since "Star Trek VI: THe Undiscovered Country".

ALl the Next Generations movies seemed like overlong TV episodes to me.

No argument from me there - Nicholas Meyer FTW!

I thought First Contact was very good but Generations and Insurrection were meh. I actually liked Nemesis quite a bit as well.

I'd rather watch the Best of Both Worlds from the TNG series than any of the movies. 2 hours much better spent.

Sunshine? Ugh. That's all I have to say about Sunshine. Other than it made The Core look good.

How about Moon?

That's not saying much!

Moon I'd agree with, I prefer the slow cerebral stuff over the whizz-bang new-Startreks but I beg to differ on Sunshine - along with the also-underrated Pitch Black it's one of my favorite Sci-Fi films of the past couple of decades.

Best soundtrack, without a doubt. Underworld's To Heal, Mercury, and John Murphy's since-used-in-other-movies-but-will-be-forever-Sunshine Adagio in D absolute standouts.

Visuals, it's hard to think of any better. It's absolutely beautiful to look at. Even if you didn't like Alex Garland's story (which I did) you have to give it that. And Boyle is a great director.

Still, I acknowledge Sunshine is like Sci-Fi Marmite - you either love it or hate it. I love it!

It seems 2001 A Space Odyssey is also like that. I know just as many people who think it's a total bore as those who think it's a work of genius. I'm one of the latter folks.

Get off the ladder, they don't need you up there.



The Jedi Master

I agree with all of that. ST is still the best SciFi movie I've seen for at least 5 years though.

Regarding the ST canon, maybe they could start the next film using the 'Dallas' approach with William Shatner coming out of the shower showing that everything since TOS was only a dream.....On second thoughts, maybe not.

Watched 'Sum of all fears' the other night and it wasn't anywhere near as bad as I thought it was going to be. I'd have preferred it if the baddies were the same as in the book, as that made much more sense....and I can only speculate it was for political reasons.

Bingo. Everyone hates Neo-Nazis so they're a safe villain for Hollywood to use. Islamic terrorists though? That's a no-no for Hollywood!

This.

Problem with Sunshine was the cliched bad guy.Other than that it was pretty good.

**trying to restrain himself**

..... I ...... Must .... NOT .... post ..... My ..... thoughts ...... about ......startrek ....... Franchise.......

...... Must not...... Noooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
(i bet there will be silly acting, capital ships darting around like rabid weazels with no G effects, somewhere someone will say - "if we tweak the orgazmatron to the Nth variant of the alpha wave, that will get us out of the deathly situation" - or undoubtedly they will go back in time or have some craaaazy (and never seen before) space time continuum anomolly where something or someone is going to have a trip in that fancy delorian at 88mph.


................ Aaaahhhh there, i think i did it. No one will notice that little comment

That's why they have inertial compensators on the ships, so they don't have to be concerned with G. FTL wouldn't be much good if every time you wanted to use it you had to endure months of acceleration at 1G, and then months more of deceleration at the destination end. (Any higher and the normal day-to-day routines on the ship that still had to take place would be difficult or impossible to do.)

Making complaints about what was done 10, 20, or 30 years ago in ST isn't very productive as it has moved on now.

If you want to complain, talk about how pointless watching sports is!
"OOH! I care about a bunch of grown men in silly outfits playing with a ball because the name of a town I live in/near/used to live/grew up/liked is on their shirts!"
Sports are to be played, not watched. Might as well just watch a workout video instead of exercising. Far more ridiculous than anything Star Trek ever did.


The Jedi Master

Well, the same can be said about any form of entertainment.

True. Entertainment as with so many other things is a highly relative thing. Gaming though seems to be an exception when it comes to women. How many of us here have heard our significant other say "oh, what exactly do you see in those games again?" or "what do you get out of playing those games?". lol

Sunshine was pretty wretched. Interesting first half and laughably bad 2nd half.

District 9 is another of the few good scifi films made in the last 5 years.

I wasn't speaking about the differences between one form of entertainment and another so much as the ridiculous hypocrisy often inherent in criticism of one form over another. Obsessing about the details of any entertainment, such as the combination on the safe being too long or what some over-paid under-educated dude's stats are, is in itself ridiculous. To then see someone criticize someone who obsesses on form A while they themselves obsess on form B is the height of hypocrisy.

For more perfect examples of hypocrisy, please listen to politicians arguing why when THEY do something it's good, but when their opponent does the exact same thing it's BAD because when you compare them to 70 different aspects 2 differ.



The Jedi Master

This thread is starting to remind me of this classic Onion article:

http://www.onionsportsnetwork.com/articles/walking-sports-database-scorns-walking-scifi-datab,1442/

Classic!!!

Actually there are several theories for FTL travel which do not require constant G acceleration.
1. Folding space (instantaneous piont to point travel) as in Dune.
2. Bubble of space (where as you rapidly accelerate a portion of space in which you remain at a constant velocity inside this bubble) Which i think is closest to star trek.
3. Portal entry into an alternate space whereby travel is vastly faster than normal space (jump to subspace) as in babylon 5

Anyway, when the starship encounters turbulance or does manouvers sometimes you will see the crew doing a bobbing around inside the Cabin. So (to me) its not too realistic nor a constant that on screen this mammoth of a ship can turn and judder whilst the crew may or may not move inside.



Actually i give a lot of leeway to the older treks. Actually i think the original far outwieghs in some aspects the modern. You will find that i did not rate the very latest ST movie for the exact points above (which will make the trek fans start spitting romulan venom).

Lets take the story lines (ohhh my here we go) anyone who has watched almost all the episodes from the original to latest (for me that is excluding deep space nine as i could not take it anymore). How many times are they going to just remake the exact same story lines. Just think about all the ST movies, how many times have they saved themselves or planet or universe by use of time travel. Hell if time travel was so easy it should be called time trek. Pretty unbloody creative and boring if you ask me.

As for watching sport being pointless. Well i can't agree (unless you are talking about soccer/english football - bunch of fricken panzies) But hey each to their own. You don't like sport, and i hate that almost all scify is ripoffs and nothing new (which really #%&*$# me as its my favourite genre)

Well if you don't mind fit birds in skimpy clothing moving in provocative ways..... then yeah i could sit through a dvd or two of that - as long as the wife doesn't catch me

But that is my gripe and i am sticking to it. I am starting the revolution of Professional Engrossing Notoins In Syfy

So if you are sick of reclaimed syfy trash and want new and innovative shows. Say no garbage and yes to P.E.N.I.S

What sucks is that the few times when there has been something really new in sci-fi on tv, it usually gets cancelled pretty quickly.

Totally agree Panzer.

Firefly comes to mind. refreshing fairly novel and appealed to a broad audience. For shock value, even my wife (whos eyes go blank and mind switches off when the word science fiction is said) enjoyed that show.

Ahh well.

I know there have been some good remakes like BSG - but with the likes of BSG, V series etc. getting such massive budgets, i just get a little dismayed that all we can create now is a retold story.

Have we actually expired all enjoyable aspects of scyfy and all we are left with is remakes that are revamped to todays audiences ?

They're rebooting Spiderman only 10 years after the first film, only 6 after the 3rd.

What do you think of their creativity?

Regardless of what the GOP says, Hollywood is run by the most conservative, tight-fisted, cheap-ass people on the planet who can only see mega-budget or indie-budget for SF. They make what they think is going to make big bucks (even though anyone who saw ANY description for Sucker Punch with an IQ over 50 would've had to say "this is going to suck and lose money") and don't even try to just accept that certain things are niche and would go over well if they would accept a film making only $50m.

It doesn't help that going to the movies has become so expensive that people only want to pay for a "sure thing". You're not going to get a decent budget for a film that doesn't get a theatrical release, and as Serenity showed the market for modest SF films is small.



The Jedi Master

What do you bet that they'll resort to that old Trek standby:

NAZIS IN SPAAAAAAACE!!!!!!!

God, I hope not.

Miao, Cat

Oh come on, I'm really looking forward to Nazis in Space!



As to the general drift of the thread, generally I value original storylines far more than remakes, reboots, sequels and prequels and it is getting increasingly depressing to see the acceptable span before "remaking" something is tending toward a couple of years. Discerning audiences deserve better - I guess the trouble is that audiences aren't particularly discerning.

A Moon, Sunshine or Pitch Black is worth a lot more to me than yet another rehash or ultra-derivative.

They made that tragic mistake with "Enterprise". JJ Abrams is too smart to make that same mistake.

I hardly think something that was done once can be called a "standby".

I don't count Enterprise's foray, just as I don't count a lot of what it did.

Time travel is an ST standby, appearing in a full 1/3 of the films and more of the episodes than I can recall.

Other well-worn ST plots: possession of a character by alien body/energy, character framed for crime on alien planet, character killed and brought back by mysterious alien process, crew unexpectedly caught in the middle of a alien war/conflict/revolution, new invention causes havoc/death/disaster due to lack of hubris by creator...



The Jedi Master

You forgot

1. Enterprise being infiltrated and taken over by an alien species.

2. Travelling to an alien world that is stuck in some alternate past of Earth history.

#2 was really only TOS that did that. TNG did it I think once.

They only did that for budgetary reasons so they could use the backlots and costumes they had lying around.



The Jedi Master

Lol, no doubt. I about died when I read Shatner' book and he was talking about how the set crew would dumpster dive looking for interesting things for the sets.


Wheels

To me that is a testament to what an incredible job both cast and crew did with ST: TOS. They had virtually no budget and yet they pulled off making a show that is still very well remembered 40+ years later.

True, but it was something that had never crossed my mind about them being on a shoe-string budget until I read Shatner's book. They even used Desilu studios because they could film there much more cheaply than one of the major studios. IIRC Star Trek was the last series that filmed at Desilu before it folded.


Wheels

Well they did have the HoloDeck to play around in.

Voyager had a few Holideck Episodes with earths Past conflicts (WWI / WWII/ Civil War Etc) The Killing Game Part I / II was when the Hirogen's took over Voyager and turned it into one giant holo ship to train their soldiers.

Yes, but it wasn't another planet, it was the holodeck! Granted it got overused on both TNG and Voyager (somehow DS9 avoided it for the most part with the exception of Vic's in the last few seasons), but at least we weren't supposed to buy into "parallel development with Earth EXCEPT..."

Some of the stuff on Voyager wasn't even the holodeck, but the Q continuum's civil war. I just recently watched The Killing Game and Jeri Ryan looked great as the lounge singer.



The Jedi Master

Holodeck is a TNG tech. Nothing remotely like that in TOS.