Played 'em back-to-back after several weeks away from flight simming. I have to say ROF:ICE still has the superior graphics which adds to the suspension of disbelief. However, OFF has more immersion, more "I'm really there and part of something bigger than just me. OFF graphics have gotten close to ROF, and OFF has far more tweaks to the settings available in the "Workshop." One thing I love about OFF is that fabulous music. It is positively stirring. Before I fly a mission, I just sit there with my speakers turned up for several minutes listening to the music and getting into the mission as if I were in a movie. The two sims seem to be equally challenging when it comes to shooting down the enemy A.I. I have tried ROF:ICE in multi. It was okay, but I prefer missions and campaigns. I've not tried OFF in multi. I don't even know if it works in multi, but I'm primarily an offline gamer anyway.

Bottom line: both sims are very solid, but for regular play, I prefer OFF:BH&H with the Hat in the Ring expansion.

+1...I find RoF flying more of a challenge then OFF...RoF is great for a quick flight here or there and Pats mod helps the SP side of things...I feel that if you love Simulators like FSX or play multi player combat then RoF is probably more for you..if you enjoy offline combat and an avid WW1 historian and find simulators like FSX a little dry because you need more than just the flight experience then go for OFF.

Well put. I dont have Off yet. However,It is on my to-do list. I guess im waiting to see what ROF's new career mode cranks out. Im hoping it creates the atmosphere I here people with OFF describe. Anyhow, Im an avid FSX user, but find Im getting a little bored with just flying from A-B. ROF gives me a nice diversion and great graphics but also leaves me a little bored sometimes because it lacks the emmersion Im craving. Im not into the online flying much. Once in a while, but Id rather get something that makes me feel like Im taking part in the war. The only games I ever got that from are Falcon, Gunship 2000, Tornado and EAW.

Rob

Scoobe...wait for OFF pahse 4 then buy it...you wont notice the difference in plane graphics etc once you start your campaign and I say again due to the cloud effects and the scenery I've seen far more dramatic screens portrayed by OFF than RoF...if you want to feel part of WW1 I feel OFF is the one for you not matter how good th RoF career is I'm pretty certain it still wont match OFF's...neither could be beat by the other in what they do best.

I couldn't agree more!
RoF with the addition of Pat's Campaign Generator has made giant leaps towards OFF, but still the lack of a proper planeset comparing to OFF's one and the lack of proper maps, (some modders are working on that too), will be still far away from creating the kind of immersion OFF does, (not to mention the little details that RoF still lacks, to make you believe there is a War going on).
RoF is growing day by day, OFF with Phase 4 will touch it's limits.
I now play mostly OFF with interims of RoF, (modded with the immersion enhancements I noted above).

Here we go again, so let me put in some remarks as a OFF3/RoF owner.
I was one of the early adapters of OFF3 because at that time there was still no decent alternative for RB3d. The introducing price was much to high, but it is now reduced to a acceptable level. Short after OFF3, RoF was released and after the "bug" period, I deleted OFF3 on my HD and went for RoF.

Campaign mode of OFF3 I think was good, but not perfect, graphics on maps/flight plan were clumsy and I never could get a claim on a balloon as a sample of its limited campaign engine. In-game campaign mode in RoF is still in development, but right now OFF is still the winner.

Adjustments of the OFF graphics in the CFSconfig was very complex and without a manual or explanation a secretbox, still can remember after one year there were still discussions going on for getting the right adjustments and maybe there still going on.

OFF weather graphics are made by people who think that the weather was always dark & cloudy and OFF3 planes do not have that realistic look like the planes in RoF.

Scouts, on the first hand it appears that OFF has more scout planes but actually they put in the cleaver idea to use derivative planes like the Triplane with one gun and a Triplane with two machine guns or the Fokker D7, D7OAW and the D7f etc.
2seaters, OK you will find a Gotha and the HP in RoF, but for two seaters, RoF is not the way to go for and fighting a late war Breguet in your EIII is no fun.

Hardware, RoF eats it, OFF3 is because of its limited game engine, friendly to a moderate PC.

Flying additional planes, in RoF you have to pay for it, in OFF3 not. But for OFF you have to pay for every game update like HITR or OFF4, which to me, looking at the previews, still appears as a upgrade and not something complete new.

First let me please state that I own and fly BOTH sims regularly. I've posted enough videos of both sims that that should show I'm not interested in bashing either sim. I did start as purely an OFF player but as RoF:ICE has been updated I have developed a good respect for both the sim and 777 studios. That said, the follow things are factual statements to the best of my knowledge.

RoF you have to pay for additional planes to fly, however you can fight against or escort any plane available in the game. RoF:ICE starts with 9 planes and I believe most of the additional planes sell for $7.62, with the exception of the two bombers for $14.99 each. Sometimes they do have plane sales. OFF:BH&H starts with 39 planes for $29.99 and HitR adds 6 more for $19.99. You should add the $9.99 cost for CFS3 for OFF:BH&H if you don't already own it.

Cost breakdown: RoF 23 total planes currently available. Total cost (not on sale) $121.42 in planes + $39.95 RoF:ICE = $161.37
OFF:BH&H + HitR = 45 total planes (including some variations of the same planes). Total cost $9.99 CFS3 + $29.99 OFF:BH&H + $19.99 HitR = $59.97 + any shipping costs.

OFF:BH&H does not charge for game updates. Every patch up to and including the BH&H Superpatch 1.32G and the HitR 1.47 patch have been completely free. HitR is an expansion including 6 new planes (along with the historically accurate squadrons that flew them and hundreds of additional skins), updates and new options to the Workshop and a whole list of other features that few people would expect for free, including the addition of an entire Dynamic American Campaign (hence the name - Hat in the Ring). You can see the complete list of features here: http://www.overflandersfields.com/Addon1.htm Expansions always have a charge. Patches and updates do not.

Phase 4 of OFF has not even had it's feature list released yet however the Devs have stated that it's a comprehensive overhaul and that it will not be able to be installed over the top of OFF:BH&H (also known as Phase 3). Just like you can't install Civilization V on top of Civilization IV. It's not an upgrade. It's a new game with fundamental changes and there is no release date yet listed. We will have to wait and see what OBD Software (the Devs)are cooking up for us. To date they have only released screenshots of Work in Progress. Nothing is currently finalized.

RoF on the other hand is getting a new Campaign upgrade to enhance it's single player side officially from 777 as another single player option to choose from in addition to Pats very fine mod. They have listed the features they hope to include, however no official list of what WILL be included for certain has been released nor is there a release date currently available. I have not seen or read anything that leads me to believe there will be a charge for this update and I believe it is presumed by all will be completely free.

Personal opinion from someone who flies both sims nearly daily:

RoF:ICE - PROS: Beautiful graphics, Great Flight Model, Great Damage Model, Great On-Line multiplayer support. Does a great job of making you feel like you are in the moment of combat. Great Developer support.
CONS: Currently a very limited campaign / career system. Smaller plane set. Higher system requirements. Potentially very expensive. DRM may turn off some people.
FUTURE: New Single Player Campaign being worked on. New planes always in the works. No release dates yet listed but features they intend to include have been listed. Developer working hard to build a quality product.

OFF:BH&H + HitR - PROS: Very Good graphics, Good Flight Model, Good Damage Model, Incredibly deep and immersive off-line single player Dynamic Campaign. Incredible job of making you feel like you are actually in a huge war. Lots of planes. Great Developer support.
CONS: On-line multiplayer possible but not officially supported. CFS3 requirement may turn off some people. Not available in stores.
FUTURE: Phase 4 in the works. No offical feature list yet available. No release date yet listed but work in progress screenshots have been released. Developer working hard to build a quality product.

If anyone wants to see videos of both in action (plus Wings of Prey and a few non-flight sim games) please visit www.youtube.com/hellshade68

Hellshade

I gave up ROF after trying to do the bombing training mission and failing all the time.
Haven't touched the game much since only trying to finish that mission and failing.

If I can't do that ,what hope have I got?

Wings Of Prey is my fav flight sim atm.

Doesn't cater for the top 1 perecent of the gaming audience and you can feel good about yourself and have fun instead of wanting to suicide playing the sims I can't understand.

I doubt many people mastered that particular mission and if you really wanted to pass then just chuck on unlimited ammo and bomb the hell out of everything.

Have you played ROF since the new patch? The game is very different now from the one you seemed to have played last.

I doubt you'll end up doing any bombing unless you decide to fly the two-seaters.

"I doubt you'll end up doing any bombing unless you decide to fly the two-seaters."

Trust me, there are plenty of gamers out there/here who like the idea of flying two-seaters!

I've spent what seems like an age nurturing a BE2/RE8 pilot, and, believe me, it's a different war and a very different challenge. Problem I have with RoF (apart from having a low end system and the lack of money with which to feed an expensive plane purchasing habit), is the paucity of realistic two seaters. Two for the whole of WWI isn't acceptable, end of.

Cheers,
Si