I just pre-ordered the Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog and as we all know, they don't come with rudder pedals.

IMO, to experience flight or at least get the most/best experience from a desktop flight sim platform, one needs rudder pedals.

I've never had a "pit" instead just my desk. I've been w/o a good flight platform for 10 years and completely w/o since upgrading my PC since Win 7 does not support game-port controllers and even though I dual-boot to XP, I've been too lazy to install my old sound card that has a game port (old PC was a Pentium II that had a ISA slot for my Thrustmaster Advanced Game Port w/ variable speed) and my (unmodified) TM TQS, F-16 FLCS, and RDS pedals all of which require game port and AT keyboard w/ PS/2 adapter and to say the least are old. I was spoiled using the Thrustmaster RDS for many years until the pots started to get old, dirty, wear out which is one of the other reasons for not flying for years and is a big concern to me for any new rudder purchase.

Today's choices for "good to great" rudder pedals are few and until this week (just found Pro Combat Flight Rudder Pedals by Saitek coming soon), no new products had been created for many years.

The choices:

- SIMPED-F16/USB by dhs-electronic in Germany list price, well, delivered to USA 270.29EUR: So as of today that's $376.25USD (280EUR list +35EUR S&H to USA less 44.71EUR VAT not required for sale to USA that's built-into the 280 price =270.29EUR or $376.25USD) (low quality pic does not do it justice)

So what makes this more expensive. Metal construction and digital high precision electronics with non contacting Hall Effect Sensor for rudder function and pressure sensitive sensors for toe brakes which are independent; automatically center point calibration of the rudder function. Great reviews and recommendations on the net as the reasonable high-end for rudder pedals. Issue is only sold by company in Germany, but even then the recommendation and comments at sim type forums are that these folks are great to work with even purchasing from the USA.
http://www.dhs-electronic.de/index2.php?id=215&lng=en
http://www.dhs-electronic.de/index2.php?id=200&lng=en
Good details and explanation of why this is high-end:
http://www.dhs-electronic.de/index2.php?id=230&lng=en

- Pro Combat Flight Rudder Pedals by Saitek list $199:

So, a new one on the block or will be very soon is from Saitek called "Saitek Pro Combat Flight Rudder Pedals" and this is very different from their Saitek Pro Flight Rudder Pedals (w/o the Combat in the name) I assume the Combat in the name is to matchup with the recent release of their X65-F Combat Control System HOTAS. Seems this one is more metal, looks and acts like a modern fighter pedals etc. No info however what if the Combat ver uses POTS or Hall Effect Sensors like the X65-F, TM Warthog, and a few other high-end controllers. It has toe brakes and they are Independent of each other (important for steering on the ground, etc) but does not say if it has pressure sensors in the brakes. Issues except for not available yet, unknown.
http://www.saitek.com/uk/prod/compedals.html
On Line Store:
http://store.gameshark.com/viewItem.asp?...;idCategory=313

Non-Combat pedals: http://www.saitek.com/uk/prod/pedals.html List $119.95


- CH Products Pro Pedals USB Flight Simulator Pedals ( 300-111 ) list $122.95: Well respected inexpensive rudder pedals but have the same issue as TM's RDS is the POTS are a mechanical link subject to considerable wear and is affected by dust/dirt and tarnish on the wire wrappings.


I'm also looking at the TrackIR 5 bundled with TrackClip PRO delivered is $185.53USD http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/products/trackir5/

Possibly get a good Yoke with Throttles but that's more dream, but could go with Saitek Pro Flight Instrument Panels cause these are very COOL: 3.5” color LCD screen, the Instrument Panel can display 6 of the main cockpit instrument panels from Microsoft’s Flight Simulator X. Reacting and updating in real time with events from the game
http://www.saitek.com/uk/prod/fip.html


So, go Hall Sensors and spend more $$ but have a better experience now and for many years to come, or save money and have possible problems at some point due to non-Hall type??? Money is a concern, especially with the TM Warthog purchase, but I've been w/o for a long time and itch to fly is great, so I may be able to justify to myself the higher end. Could save by not getting anything else but SIMPED-F16/USB and TrackIR 5 - could always add more later. Just not sure, so what should I do?

I have the gameport version of the Simped (2 years) and I love them, well worth the $$. I also have the CH pedals (5 years) and they're great as a cheaper solution.

I'm considering changing my CH Pro Pedals to the new Saitek pedals, they just look great and I'd like a bit further distance between my feet.

Staffan

I too just pre-ordered the HOTAS Warthog and needed pedals. I looked at all of the above and went with the Simpeds. They came in from Germany and work great! With hall sensors I can see using these pedals for a decade without ever having to touch them. The Saitek combat pedals look good too, but without mentioning that they have hall sensors I doubt they have them.

If a manufacturer was going to upgrade to much costlier / higher performing hall sensors over crappy old POTS I am sure they would mention it on their website / advertisements.

Where did you guys pre-order? (USA folks only please)

If I'd buy another set of pedals, I'd get the Simped F16/USB ones.

The Simped Varios have served me well, but I also would like to build my own pedals somewhere down the line.

Can my RCS with Cubbys rudder HALLS be converted to a usb plug from game port?

I do not want to use some adapter, I would like this to give that final touch for my pit.

Ok, so I've realized you guys are joking...because I can't find anywhere taking Thrustmaster Warthog preorders. What is with all the Warthog "made my preorder" "just got my Warthog" jokes around here? lol

I preordered from this site. They are getting in their first shipment Oct 30.
http://www.shopblt.com/

So rereading my preorder message from shopblt, they were told that their order is being shipped Oct 20th (ie: to them) then they are shipping to customer immediately after they received them. Did someone from blt tell you they won't arrive to them until the 30th? ie: maybe since they are shipped from Europe to the USA?

Just saw this date which is the 1st date I've seen listed to date. Saitek won't or can't say what date or even a time frame that they are targeting for release of the Pro Flight Combat Rudder Pedals. However, they are just state the same details that's on Saitek's web site - so still no answer to what's used as a sensor POTS, Hall, ???

http://www.simw.com/hardware/rudder/pro-flight-combat-rudder-pedals.html


Anyone see details on the sensors or release date?

I don't know if that will work or not. I would think you might have to convert the whole setup over to USB for that to work correctly.

That Saitek unit looks great!More info Saitek PLEASE!

-Skater

Annoying - was just about to buy a set of the old ones.
Have to wait now!
Cheers,
Keith

JBuzzman69,

I"m working on an adapter that will allow you to connect your DB15 RCS rudder cable connector to a DB9 connection (the DB15 pin out is not a standard joystick port wiring scheme when using hall sensors).

This will allow you to use a USB adapter cable from Leo Bodnar. It has the USB electronics molded into the cable, quite a nice unit, gives you a longer cable to boot. If testing goes OK this is the best solution to convert the RCS's to USB. It would also allow the RCS's to still be used thru the Cougar (if one chooses to keep it for F-16 sims) and allow the RCS's use as second controller so no axes on the Cougar have to be sacrificed when Toe Brakes are used. It also would allow use with other controllers (as a second controller) like the Warthog. The USB adapter cable can make use of the software Leo provides to alter the axes if needed.

I have the components for the adapter here now, just arrived today. The USB converter cable should show up any day now. Testing to follow shortly after everything arrives.

So, hang on to your RCS, there's still life in the old girl!

yes I just checked they have not recieved a shipment yet.

This is the current real-time availability of item #BDE6442 as of Wednesday, October 20, 2010 8:22:15 AM Eastern Time.
You may order this product, regardless of availability:

Not in stock, but 117 are on order.

so more than likely we wont see it until 11-02-10.
According to the sales rep, at BLT TM has pushed back delivery dates on the TM WartHog.

So how much will everything cost and what is the scope of work involved to convert my RCS completely to Halls and USB. Please provide links & instructions on how to get all the parts and details on how to do it.

BTW, what do you mean toe brakes, Thrustmaster's RCS does not have brakes?

Go here Cubpilot's Hangar for the link to email me. You are correct, the RCS rudders did not come with Toe Brakes originally. But my RCS's have Toe Brakes. These rudders are really quite good and sturdy, most of the problems they have can be fixed. It would be a shame to toss away such a robust set of rudder pedals. I have replacement springs available for them also.

At the moment I only have the rudder axis kit available. This kit really transforms these pedals with a very smooth action (more than the original) and the hall sensor does away with the old pot problems.

The Toe Brake kit is almost ready but I need to do the pricing on that yet. Some of the materials are no longer available locally to me now, stores aren't stocking things like they were due to the present economic conditions. It is designed to be a pretty straight forward installation with no soldering required and does not require cutting (hacking) the pedal mounts. Some work with a drill will be required, could not get around that. The TB's use hall sensors.

I'm testing the USB converter now. It will consist of a conversion box that the RCS cable I supply with the RCS rudder axis kit will plug into, then a USB cable will go out to your computer USB port. This will allow you to use the RCS thru the Cougar (w/o USB converter) or the RCS as a second controller (w/USB converter) with the Cougar or Warthog or any other controller.

My plan is to start cutting metal before the end of the year if there is enough interest.

- How about a ballpark estimation of price or range including the toe brakes so state +/- what ever your comfortable. ie: will this be significantly less than new at 200-375 for hall rudder pedals (yes this is a very subjective questions/answer)
- So, I always experienced what seemed to be to friction caused jerkiness while using the RCS from the design plastic against plastic at the cross bar or what ever they called it (parallel and under each foot rest and perpendicular to the base frame) and if I lubricate its surface, then it just picks up carpet debris and dust. Does your antistatic friction tape completely resolve this?
- Once converted, what if any limitation exist when in use?
- What if any problems have risen when in use during your history with this modification
- Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I don't own the Cougar, seems that once completed I'll have a "2nd" controller just as if I purchased another pedals like the USB version of CH or SIMped F16/USB. (ie: same so don't have to buy new)
- If everything goes according to plan, you get immediately the interest/qty that makes you start work again as you are planning, how long until you can start shipping.

I thought others would be interested in these answers and may increase interest

You're still working on that toebrake kit? And here I thought that was pretty much canceled given the lack of updates on it...consider me interested if you ever get one in production that can easily be wired to the main +HS cable's spare leads.

Does it change the angle of the pedals, by any chance? The default RCS pedal inclination doesn't seem to be steep enough for cockpit use.