I've thought about the upcoming Thrustmaster Warthog. It looks totally awesome. But I can't see spending 5 big ones for something that's just an upgrade over my Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS, i.e. heavy and cool looking but no force feedback. I miss FFB, especially for flights sims of older aircraft (WWI and WWII). So, I've decided to put out 3 big ones for the G940, if it is sufficently backwards compatible. But as anyone with experience with FFB knows, the sticks suck for games that are incompatible, that don't register FFB or recognize the stick. Here are my flight sims. How backwards compatible is the G940? Will all of the following recognize the G940? Will all of the following provide FFB with the G940? Thanks in advance.

On PC with WIN XP3:
Red Baron 3D w/Full Canvas Jacket
CFS1
CFS2
CFS3
Janes WWII Fighters
Janes F/A18

On PC with WIN 7(64bit):
IL2 1946
FSX
OFF BH&H
First Eagles 2
Strike Fighters 2 series (SF2/Israel/Europe)
Lock On:Modern Air Combat
Rise of Flight: Iron Cross Edition
DCS: Black Shark

I know my G940 worked well with IL-2 1946 and ROF, but my MSFF2 is still more precise. I'm waiting to check out the Thrustmaster Warthog and hopefully I will finally be able to retire the MSFF2.

Force feedback is great but I prefer having the most precise stick possible. I'm hoping the Warthogs gimbal_less system will be smooth, and precise, with an adjustable centering tension.

So if the Warthog stick proved to be even more smooth and precise, but without FFB, you'd ditch the SWFFB2?

For DCS: Black Shark, it had better have a tight centering force with no force deadzone/slop. In short, like the SWFFB2, NOT like the Strike Force 3D. Word is that a firmware update has fixed this, but other users report even more issues.

Yes
I like Force Feedback, but its not my highest priority.

A stick must have....No deadzone
....have Smooth Precise movement {gimbals can be a little clunky depending on build quality}
....adjustable tension...I'm not sure the Warthog has this feature...its unlikely it will have the tension I prefer, but if everything else is to my liking I would mod it to suit.

Does the G940 have center deadzone? Chivas, you own the G940, what about it? I'm not going to spend 800-900 bucks on two separate HOTAS setups. I need only one. I already have the Cougar, why would I buy the Warthog? It's just a better version of the Cougar, No FFB; no rudder pedals. Doesn't the G940 have everything?

I've owned mine since about this time last year, my thoughts, and hopefully some useful answers:

On the issue on dead zones: As far as control, there is NO DEADZONE, the stick can provide a response from 0 to full travel. HOWEVER the force feedback has a dead zone around center, that it seems is uncorrectable. The recent firmware update corrected this to a degree, it used to be a FF deadzone of about 45% travel. Now the FF dead zone is cut in half, but still noticeable. Logitech says this is to prevent motors from binding against each other. I think part of the issue is the use of gears as apposed to belts to provide feedback. The belt system in my fanatec wheel has a much smaller deadzone, and it feels more realistic b/c the belts have some natural play, where as the gears make for a hard stop. I generally try to adjust games so that the two zones are in sync, but in certain sims like FSX, where you can fly anything from a camel to a hornet, it's tough to globalize it. As far as sims that don't support FF, it's not a huge issue, as the profiler software allows you to set simulated spring tension as you see fit.

That said, I'm not a fan of the FF in the G940. Frankly, I'd pay the $300 for this system if it was just a normal stick. The parts all seem of high quality, and it's survived a year of use (which, if reviews are any indication, means it's beating the curve of a lot of saitek products...). The stick itself feels nice in the hand, and solid to the touch, as do the throttle and pedals. A side note, and a major disappointment, is the lack of support for the lighted buttons on the throttle base. The buttons work fine as a normal, assignable button, but LT touts the changing color feature as a major selling point, and so far its gone unsupported.

Bottom line: I'd keep your MS stick if I were you. This stick seems like a rare miss for Logitech. I like it just enough to keep it and not bother selling it, but not enough to go about singing it's praise. I'll probably just get a CH stick and use it with the throttle and pedals.

No the G940 does not have a deadzone and is very precise. The G940 had a very large forcefeedback and stick centering deadzone that made the stick very sloppy around the center and made targeting difficult. Most of the problems has been addressed in the latest patch, but I find my old MSFF2 still does a better job than the G940.

I also have the Cougar but the joystick is a piece of crap for fighter jocks, but it was ok for flying bombers and jets, because of its very stiff and clunky gimbals. The Warthog should be a huge upgrade over the Cougar, but that remains to be seen. If you have the Cougar you probably already have rudder pedals so the Warthog could be a good option.

That said, the G940 is still a decent setup now that they've updated the drivers, but I'm looking for something better. The G940 may or may not have further problems as I only used it for a short time and put it back in the box, until my MSFF2 dies. It may stay in the box if the Warthog is as good as it appears to be.

Yes, I have the Saitek Pro Pedals but I'm not completely satisfied with them. They move on carpet. I'm not sure what to do about it. I agree my Cougar HOTAS is not very useful with WWI and WWII fighters. But I don't see how the Warthog will be an improvement over that, not for vintage combat prop fighters. I do have an X45 HOTAS that works just fine, but I kind of miss FFB, especially with WWI and WWII sims. The Warthog won't satisfy that need. I find myself increasingly favoring prop fighter action over modern jets. Killing something that is beyond visual range with radar and missiles with 20 mile ranges I'm finding less fun than it used to be. I haven't played LOCK-ON in a long time. I bought Black Shark when it first came out but have booted it up only 3 times. I have FSX but I use the Saitek yoke with it.

The main problem with the Cougar joystick was its very stiff clunky gimbal system. I believe the Warthog is using some sort of single ball "gizmo" that should be a huge improvement over the Cougar. This alone should make the Warthog the most smooth precise stick on the market.

The G940 uses a very course motor system to supply forcefeedback and tension. On the good side you can adjust the sticks tension electrically.

The posts in this thread are confirming that finding my next HOTAS is going to be a major PITAS(S).

I was as excited about the Warthog as I could be given Thrustmaster's quality record. But at $425 street - without pedals - I don't care if it is the 1977 Mercedes 450SL of game controllers. (Warning-link NSFW for language and getting you busted for laughing really loud.) That's just too much money to drop on playing with flight sims.

The Saitek X-65 looked interesting, but the reviews I've seen indicate that nothing has changed since I bought an X45 system years ago. Saitek has great ideas but they always come up short in executing them. And $350 w/o pedals only looks good compared to the Warthog.

That leaves the G940. I like the price a lot and the reviews have been solid. But like aggessorblue - I'd gladly trade the force feedback for the kind of precision you can get from a modified Cougar. I gotta believe that if Logitech can make a profit on the G940 with the complexity of force-feedback, they could do an amazing non-FF stick at that price, too.