I'm having a lot of trouble trying to shoot down aircraft.

I know how to work the radar of the SU27 and know about the missiles (SARH vs IR). However, I never get any kills.

I have setup a practice mission with 4 SU27 vs 4 F16. I am flying about 3,000 m, with jammers on when I get contact. I authorize my other flight to engage and tell my wingman to cover me. I usually then try and climb about 3 or 4,000 m above the contact.

Scenerio 1
I climb about 3 or 4,000 m above the contact.
If I am not jammed, I see the aircraft coming in head on. I try an manouver left or right keeping him on radar while I get within range of the target. Usually I am in a head on closuer rate and fire within the first bracket set. All times the enemy defeats the missile so, I try and get within the second set of brackets so that he has little chance of defeating the missile..I usually get hit at this point

Scenerio 2
I stay at his altitude, and am in a headon closure. Again I fire a missile when in range of the first bracket stage but I usually get hit first, or I may get the arcraft but then get hit myself right away.

In both cases my RWR is telling me the contact is locking me, and when it screams that I am being shot at,,I try to manouver away to 3 or 9 o'clock and either climb or dive..but not successfully

So far most engagement I have always lost Blue (NATO) has more kills the Red (me - SU27)

What is the best tactics in these scenerios. I have also tried getting in range of an IR long range missile,,,but again get hit before I have a chance to deploy it.

Stay below your opponent so he can't notch your missile (this applies to you too, you can't notch a missile if you are above your opponent). This my not be an ideal situation in anything other than a 1v1 BTW.

Your first missile will most likely miss as he manoeuvres to defeat it. The first missile is to make you opponent defensive, the subsequent missiles are to keep him defensive until one hits.

If you are waiting for a launch warning from F-16's you are already dead. By the time you get a launch warning, the AIM-120 is on the final phase of flight and about to hit you. You must assume that your opponent has launched when you did or even before and fly accordingly.

Nate

Thanks Nate,

So you are saying to dive...?

I always thought that it would be better to stay at high altitude because this will make his missile lose energy as it climbs and gives you a better chance of defeating the missile as it must manouver with you...

Just curious...what do you mean by notch ? Maybe it is losing in translation for me.

What I try and do is put the bandit on my gimble edge and try and get behind him. But on a head to head engagement,,,I agree firing a missile first will get him defensive especially if it is a IR on.

Apologies, the Notch is the Doppler Notch of your Radar. Should your enemy put you on his 3/9 line (Beaming) while being below you, he will enter your Radars Doppler Notch, and your radar will lose lock and your (SARH) missile will miss.

The AI has an uncanny ability to notch, so you must stay below him to prevent this.

In order to defeat his inevitable counter missile, I'd recommend slowing down and putting the bandit on your gimble edge (as you said) the very moment you fire your first missile.

If he has fired a SARH missile hopefully this will make him break lock before you have to. If it is an ARH missile I'd recommend keeping your speed up slightly, in order to be outside the missiles seeker field of vision, after it goes terminal.

You must keep your enemy on the defensive, if he gets one ARH missile off a medium range, you aren't likely to survive.

In general IR missiles are last ditch visual range missiles, I wouldn't use these in a BVR fight unless you have a big positional advantage

To be honest just go head to head against 1 opponent, out at sea, to get a feel how the AI fights. Also use TacView to analyse your fights.

Nate

I had some of the same ideas as Nate. Go low instead of high, going low forces your opponent to pick you out on the radar from all the ground echos, or at least forces his computer to pick you out of the mess. This will be a lot harder than picking you out on a clear background like the sky. It's certainly a trade off though, the extra altitude forces his missile to waste energy, but by going low you may avoid the lock in the first place.

But also, do you have any idea what kind of missiles they're firing at you? I'm guessing you do not, unless you have labels on, but if they're firing Aim-120's at you jamming is not going to help. In fact, since jamming lights you up like a christmas tree, and since the US has missiles like the aim 120 that can home on jam, have you tried the same tactics with jamming off?

Just some thoughts.

Take a look at this site http://flankertraining.com/ironhand/a2a.htm

Some very good info

I think your first step should be the academics.
Understand how your (in game) radar works and why.

Understand how your - and your enemy's - missiles work and why. In what ways can you defeat a missile? Which components of it can you 'attack' to make it miss? How d oyou combine counter-measures with your own maneuvering? What kind of maneuvering?

Follow this up with giving some serious thought into your intercept geometry. Do you really want to be taking your bandit on head-on? What speeds should you use? Why? Have you tried a large range of speeds? Do you know how to fly your plane and make it do your bidding? Can you go from Mach 0.95 to 1.4-1.5 during the missile flight time? How? Why would you?

Realize that you are the underdog, and you are, in theory, supposed to lose more than you win in a SARH v ARH duel.

It's a lot of stuff but it'll work out in the end.

Tactics play a big part. Last night me and a squadmate killed a very good F-15 pilot while flying Mig-29G's. Look at the site I told you and practice.

That's not necessarily true. Unless you're really close to the bandit, he's not going to have the chance to pitbull his missiles, so you'll get the launch warning while he's still at a distance. In that case, it all comes down to keeping a close eye on the RWR- re-read the section on prioritized threats. And keep an eye on the signal strength indicator.

Again, Ironhand's videos are absolutely vital if you're going to learn to fly and fight the RUFOR aircraft successfully.

Thanks guys...
Over the last several days, I have become better at surviving interceptions and dog fights in my training setups with F5, F16's and Mirages.

Looked at Ironhands stuff and alot of useful information...need to use the clock better but still get hit a bit...but not as much as before