I may be wrong but I'm sure I read on this forum that the Flaming Cliffs 2.0 patch was coming out in January. Well, its the 29th and I haven't heard anything about it for quite awhile.

Anyone know if its coming...or been pushed back....or God forbid, already realeased and I missed it ?

I am really looking forward to it and was hoping it would be out by the 31st.

Thanks
Tracy

Patience...patience. It's coming. Finishing touches are being completed.

Lol, that`s two weeks then !!

I thought for sure the initial announcement said January, but later it just said "early 2010." I don't care so much about the delay, I am just relieved to see that my memory hasn't completely failed and that someone else remembered the January announcement as well.

Hey Arthonon,
Thats exactly what I was wondering too. I am about ready to start knocking on age sixty's door here but I was sure they had said the patch was coming in Jamuary. I missed the "early 2010" post.

I also agree, I can wait, I really enjoy this game and this patch should make it even better !

Tracy

January update from ED

Edit:- Just so you are aware, 2.0 isn't a patch it is a paid for upgrade.

Nate

To me "early 2010" would be Jan or Feb or March or April. In the same way that May, Jun, July, August would be the middle of 2010. In the same way that September, October, November, December would be late 2010.

So they have a while yet. Also bear in mind it's not a legally binding contract with anyone.

The Devs are careful nowadays about giving timescales. When they were unable to meet the promised release dates for things in the past, they were savaged on the Forums. They wisely resist giving specific dates anymore because of that and I dont blame them, but they still try to give a rough idea of what their plans are.

In their place after seeing the hostile and savage postings they got in the past, I'd not tell anyone a d*mn thing other than it'll be ready when it's ready.

+1

I'll happily wait as long as necessary for a final product that's complete and doesn't require half a dozen patches and hacks to make it playable. We can all think of sims that have died painful, fiery deaths because of that, after all.

Three weeks.
(with a nod to Frugal's)

I can't wait either. 2.0 will resurrect LOMAC on my PC. Can't play with FC due to SF. Hope the new patch will really fix that. Can't wait to see how it runs on my quadcore and GTX 295.

That a reliable estimate or a guess?

Its a perpetual 3 weeks.

Nate

I am really looking forward to 2.0. I have to say that I find it remarkable that ED is producing an update to this sim after all these years. It would seem that the hardcore Lomac group is pretty loyal to the sim since judging from the retail price of either FC or LOMAC and the age of the product I wouldn't necessarily thought that there would be much profit in producing this update.

Not just remarkable, it's fantastic.

I don't think it's about making a quick buck. It's to maintain the wider community, and build it even further.

It will also enrich the online experience, with FC2 + DCS:KA50 + DCS:A10 + DCS:AH64 etc all playing on the same servers in the long run.

By adding FC2, in one sweep they have added 7 flyable aircraft to servers that would have only had 1 or 2. Variety prevents boredom, and keeps the game alive.

Players of one sim, will eventually move to the others. I started on DCS, and have now bought FC1, and will buy FC2 and any other DCS sim as I'm sure most Black Shark users will.

Have to admit I am a little excited to hear about the unification of LOMAC with the DCS line of sims. Purchased the LOMAC/FC gold pack several years back, did some take offs and landings in the Su-25 and A-10, but never really played it much beyond that. One of those games that I've been meaning to get around to playing, but still spending all my time loving IL-2.

This upcoming super patch already seems money well spent, since I think I only paid $20-30 on my gold pack. Paying another $15-20 just to dust it off for some new gameplay seems like a bargain to me.

+1

Another patient customer waiting to get his hands on this! We're getting a further improved feature rich product. Look forward to flying alongside KA-50's!

Any word on release date for 2.0? Still is early 2010, so not late - but wondering now that March is upon us if it might be delivered this month.

We are close.

However, there is some erroneous information here regarding compatibility between FC2 and future DCS modules. All we can say for now is that FC2 will be online compatible with DCS: Black Shark. Whether this will remain the case with future DCS modules is not yet known and has not been stated.

Thanks for the update, and best of luck.

I hope that all the good addons like Walmis F-15 model are fully compatible with FC 2.0. The dafault model is so uglyand i rarley fly the Russian birds.

None of the most important mods and none of the Missions and Campaigns are compatible with FC 2.0 , the work of the past 5 years done by the community is almost completely incompatible with FC 2.0

Are you kidding?

LOMAC with Black Shark looks and functionality? I'll wait.

I'm currently running an HD4850. It runs LOMAC:FC v1.12 flawlessly. Anyone think I need a new video card?

pfunk

No, I am not kidding, and I don't think Black Shark functionality is enough - as much as I would like to move to FC 2.0, the fact I can't import old missions and mods is enough to make me stay with FC.

And right now, I am much more interested in making skins for FSX than spending a huge amount of time making new missions for FC 2

That would be really bad!
AFAIK, i have read somewhere that one/some beta tester(s) said, that some mods are compatible and or only minor changes are necessary to make them work with FC 2.0.
No idea how reliable that statement is though. I only really care about the F-15 model, as that is my favorite ride. FC 2.0 will feature a better terrain system anyway and a new SU-25 model. I hope the highres cockpit skins will work soon after the release. Guess mods for FC 2.0 have to be identical to BS mods, in order to show up. Most modders who did stuff for FC, are currently working for BS i suppose, so once FC 2.0 has been released, updated FC mods can be expected.

that beta tester was probably talking about skins.

Any Mod that changes configuration files can't be compatible - the CAW mod isn't, the AdA Mod, the Merzifon Mod, none of the Models are and so on and so forth.

Missions, which is what we fly, aren't compatible - it takes me a couple months to create a single 10 mission pack, and I don't care for the missions that come with the sim, I don't want to start from scratch again.

Most of the modders that did those mods aren't around anymore, someone else will need to do it.

I would love to fly the FC 2.0 Su-25T, I was one of the very few that made missions for the 1.12 version, we made the CAW Mod with a couple of dozen skins and 100+ missions for the Su-25T , here comes FC 2.0, has a new Su-25 model and improvements to the Su-25T ... can't use mods, can't fly missions, can't set up my favorite mods ... what I am going to do ? to move all the DCS Black Shark models to the FC 1.12 continue flying it and skip 2.0, because there won't be any content in FC 2.0 for me.

Eagle Dynamics is not releasing FC 2.0 to the FC 1.12 community because for this many (4) years have been clamoring for a patch, but because they have a new tie in with Ubisoft and want to take advantage of that, nothing wrong in that - but that will do no good to me.

Most people don't seem bothered by the fact that they're getting a more powerful ME that will allow them to create more interesting missions.

Of course, I could be wrong.

I'm looking forward to the changes, but then I never used any of the mods. Not that there was anything wrong with them, I just never got into FC that much (because of some of the weapons performance issues, mostly) and therefore didn't put the time into sorting out all the mods.

you could be wrong,

amazing as it sounds , I am one of the few that dedicated time in making Missions for Lock On FC Su-25T, and I am much more concerned about backwards compatibility than looking forward to a new sim that has ZERO content for me to play.

Maybe you should worry about guys like me that do not look forward to starting building misions for Lock On FC 2.0.

Of course, what do I know ? I just run your main support Website.

... I could be wrong.



-

by the way GrayGhost, you should add a signature that you are part of Eagle Dynamics Team, I do that I belong to LockOnFiles team.

Kinda difficult to have backwards compatibility with half the map replaced. But anyway I do see your point, and I appreciate the work you have done.

However if it was sold as a sequel called DCS:-Lock On, I don't think you be expecting or asking for Backwards compatibility, this is the scale of the engine change from FC the FC2. Game(sim) engines move on over time, design and structure is improved to cope with new features. Mods for ARMA aren't instantly compatible with ARMA 2, if at all.

In order for Backwards compatibility to work, ED must either forgo New engine improvements and new features or invest a lot of time and money in shoe horning in and testing old bits of code in the new engine. For me, I'm more interested in new features than mods.

Lomac missions didn't work in FC. FC missions won't work in FC2. And I'm sure there'll be an engine update to DCS that breaks all missions in the future too (There was talk of a true Globe terrain eventually IIRC).

There comes a point where real innovation requires casting off the legacy.

Nate

It is not quite like that, backwards compatibility in a case like this is fairly easy to achieve if you know how to, it is just a question of wanting to allocate the resources to achieve it.

Take Jane's F/A-18E, once you were finished with campaigns that came with it, you were also finished with the sim, it had a wonderful Mission Editor, but no missions were available to it.

LOMAC missions I made, all worked on LOFC, so much so that half of the Crimean Air Wars missions are old LO 1.02 missions, what happened is that I had to balance the missions again, and some details were missing, no big deal.

Once Eagle Dyamics releases LO FC 2.0, we will find ourselves in the same situation as we were in Jane's F/A-18 - lack of what to do with the sim.

The strength of (any) community is the amount of word done by its members.

there are 1,500+ mods made for LO, it took us 5 years to get there.

FC 2.0 has ... in a year will have what ? 50 ? maybe

FS 2004 is alive and well because the bulk of the mods are being done to it, FSX has a fraction of the attention.

What would you rather invest your time in ?

As a mod maker, where do I want to invest my time - in something that will get me 500 downloads or one that will get me 50 ?

I want new features, not reworked old code.

pfunk

You are kidding, right? You don't actually believe this? Janes has had a lot of campaigns created that are good content. I've made one or two of them myself, but you know what, I'd happily waive it all goodbye if we could upgrade to higher resolution, better gfx, etc. But even with it as it is today, there isn't any lack of what to do with it. I guess I don't understand what you meant to say here.

Of course, if you can achieve backwards compatibility fairly easily, as you say, then certainly do see your point. And I think the FS2004 change to FSX is also a good analogy.

Ripcord

I am talking of way back , not now - hard to believe that F/A-18E is 11 years old ...

the code is still similar , Lock On, FC, FC 2.0, Black Shark - ME compatibility is not easy, but it can be done.

But is is not only the Mission Editor, there is so much that will be lost.

Let me think ... I want to make again a 60 mission campaign for LO FC 2., let's imagine I start today, a mission a week, when I am finished I have to cross check the missions, it will take me half a year to do that - then I have to write the Mission Briefings another 2 months or so ... in two years time I'll be ready to release it.

Of course I have to gain a complete understanding of the ME AI so I can predict outcomes and understand the AI ... it took me year to achieve that in LOFC ... so, let's make it in 3 years time.

The march of progress.

pfunk

not every change is good.

include me out.

So I guess the possibliity them providing a dynamic campaign for LO FC 2 is completely out?

Dude, ya know, I'll say this -- I kinda do feel your pain, being something of a mission builder/campaign creator for my favorite sim. And backward compability is something I also was vigorously defending in the TSH discussions. We did well to maintain it so far. But I also think it is something that we'll have to sacrifice at some point - and that day is getting closer, I think.

Will the carrier ops capabilities/mods get included in the new FC2?

Ripcord

TDW, I suggest put your money where you mouth is and show how 'easy' it is to make anything 'backward compatible' by rewriting your missions - all it takes is 'allocation of resources' and it's 'easy', right?

It's pretty easy to drop the e-word around when all you have to do is moan about something you once did being eclipsed instead of actually moving forward. I find it interesting that your work was somehow hard, while claiming that preserving backward compatibility isn't.

I'm sure one of your talented friends can write you a mission converted if you really do want it.

@Ripcord, there won't be a dynamic campaign for FC2. There's a lot more that needs to be done before a DC can be introduced to begin with; it's probably going to be a long-term goal with DCS.

Hey GG, that is a great idea ! ! ! Why don't you send me a preview copy of FC 2.0 so that I can start right now ! ! !

just kidding

sorry man, right now all my resources are allocated in supporting Eagle Dynamics's Community, the time I can spare, I am using to make skins for this other sim





thanks for the advise, I know it is well meant, I'll start inquiries for volunteers ASAP.



I am not moaning, but groaning

groan (grn)
v. groaned, groan·ing, groans
v.intr.
1. To voice a deep, inarticulate sound, as of pain, grief, or displeasure.
2. To make a sound expressive of stress or strain: floorboards groaning

have a nice day,
thank you for your understanding,
nice to meet you,
bye, bye
.

Why wouldn't they? I was fully expecting to install 2.0 separately.

And even if it didn't you could simply copy 1.12 to another folder first.

Nate

In fact I've read the FC 2.0 installer will let us choose to maintain a 1.12 separated installation. Sorry I can't find the link, but I'm pretty sure it was a dev/mod/whatever who said this.

I remember reading that too, when FC 2.0 was first announced.

Training track videos are appearing at the ED official youtube channel:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gE1aCkTN-iw

Correct if I'm wrong but after installing Flaming Cliffs you could still play the vanilla Lock On Install right? If I'm guessing right (purely guessing) then FC 2.0 should be the same. That way I can have the best of both worlds.