I did a mod for JF-18 that makes the default cockpit view have a little wider perspective than the stock view. Not to be confused with the "TSH wide view", this mod only changes the default view so that the default perspective is a little wider than stock. If you have TSH 3.06 you will still be able to zoom out to an even wider view.

I have a 24 inch monitor and I run JF-18 at 1920 x 1200. I like the hi resolution but I didn't like the fact that at that resolution, the cockpit was a little too big to fit on the screen. So I made the perspective a little wider and now I can run the game at 1920 x 1200 and the perspective is much better. I don’t know if many of you run JF-18 at such a hi resolution, but if you do, then you might like this mod.

Here are some pics.

Wide Cockpit 1 at 1920 x 1200 res.
http://news.webshots.com/photo/2639546650025714458ZtyRcY

Wide Cockpit 2 at 1920 x 1200 res.
http://news.webshots.com/photo/2432607580025714458HKjlVe

Slikk

Slikk,

I got your emails with the means to do this, but let's discuss here first.

Frenchy struggled to integrate wideview into TSHv3; for a long time he said he did not understand how it was originally implemented in TSHv1. But here it seems as if you've simply modified the default FOV setting, or something that controls the FOV, in a simple manner. No matter how you've done it, it is a wonderful achievement, because it gives JF-18 real widescreen support. Kudos to you.

Could you please post the hex address(es) you modified to change the FOV? I would love to have 16:9, 16:10, 15:9, 12:3 and 15:4 aspect ratios fully supported, without the screwiness of the windeview cockpit toggle.

Hey great news! I keep seeing all these wide screen monitors that I'd like to get, but I don't because I would not be able to fly this sim on it (or it wouldn't look quite right). Maybe now I'll finally take the plunge

Ripcord

Yeah... thanks, Slikk...

Just when I thought I'd be okay with this CRT monitor until it died, you have to go and do THAT, making it obvious that I now need a widescreen LCD monitor.

Alright, Mr. Smartguy, how about coming up with a way to explain to Mrs. Hedgehog why I need a widescreen LCD monitor?

Lol Hedgehog, looks like you're gonna have to do some extra stuff around the house so you can get on Mrs. Hedgehog's good side so you can get that wide screen LCD monitor.

Joe

It's been a while senses I worked on this mod, I've had it for a while now. I told a few people about it in HL when it was brand new but they didn’t seem too interested so I just kind of sat on it until now. If I remember correctly, not only did the cockpit FOV perimeters have to be altered but some of the other cockpit functions had to be altered as well. For example: The ADI that shows up in the MDI had to reattached, and the FLIR had to be altered as well or they wouldn’t follow the cockpit correctly when you pan your head around in the cockpit. Also, I had to do this the hard way because I didn’t have to original program that TSH used to open the .exe so I'm not sure if the info on how I did this would help or not, but here goes.

For the Wide cockpit 1: At line 10658 of the .exe I had to change this value (€) to this value (‘). This step was repeated at lines 20822 and 20846.

For the Wide cockpit 2: At line 10658 of the .exe I had to change this value (€) to this value (˘). This step was repeated at lines 20822 and 20846.

Hope this helps.

Slikk

so great,could u release it?if TSH can add zoom to 3D cockpit.that is perfect.

Slikk,

I've been playing around with this, and it looks like the first option is almost perfect in terms of keeping the original vertical FOV intact in a 16:10 resolution; the image is just the slightest bit Vert-, resulting in the bottom row of buttons in the left and right MDIs being only partially visible.

Unfortunately this modification to the original field of view does not survive wideview/normal toggles with the FLIR in use; this is the same problem exhibited in any resolution greater than 1024x768 with the FLIR in use. I tested in 1280x800, and without any wideview use it was great, and I could use the FLIR without problems. However, as soon as you switch to wideview and then back again while FLIR imagery is displayed, the FOV returns to default. To correct this problem and restore the modified FOV, you have to take the FLIR imagery off of the displays and then toggle wideview ON and OFF again.

One last problem is that the FOV changes but the HUD overlay stays the same size; the larger the FOV, the more the HUD overruns the HUD glass. For this reason I think your first FOV setting is much better than the second.

Overall I would say this works pretty well if you don't use wideview (and with a widescreen monitor the need for wideview is reduced). Personally I never use wideview as I find the resulting image too distorted. I will play around more and attempt to come up with the exact FOV to match the 4:3 default image. If I can do that we can put out a release with proper fields of view for 5:4. 15:9, 16:9, 16:10, 12:3, and 15:4 resolutions.

I have limited experience in hex editors. I show line 20822 to be "75", and it's the same in the unmodified TSHv3.06 executable as it is in your modified executable, so clearly I'm not looking in the right place (or using the right program to look).

I added your ICQ number to my buddy list but you're offline right now. I'd love to chat via IM for a few minutes so you could straighten me out.

Say, what exact character is this, anyway? I can't seem to reproduce it in on my keyboard. My apostrophe looks like this (') and the unshifted tilde character looks like this (`).

I won't even begin to think about typing the cent character.

Sorry Joe, but I must have sent you the wrong version of the wide view mod. As I said it's been a while sense I worked on it. I have sent you the right version of the mod and with this version you will absolutely be able to zoom out and then zoom back in again and the FLIR will follow. The correct version of the mod will allow you to have three levels of zoom. With the FLIR off, the zoom is extra wide. With the FLIR on the zoom is wide but is more useful than the extra wide view. The view reverts back to normal if toggled with the FLIR in the on position. The monitor that I use cannot achieve all of the different resolutions there are in the TSHv3Manager but the mod was tested with all of the resolutions that would work with my system. There might be slight differences at some resolutions but for the most part it worked without any problems.

Slikk

coolness

Hello, first of all greetings to everybody, my name is Devas and some time I have been following the progress of F/A 18 through the comunity it has done to grow

Now I have followed the footsteps of Slikk but the change in the line exe 20822 and 20846 have not managed to increase the FOV in the simulator.

The value of those lines as well notes Joe is 75 but to change the character indicating Slikk nothing happens, Slikk which would replace the value?

Thanks for the work done in this great simulator

Yeah, I still don't get it. Slikk, please explain your edits, because I think what you have edited and your descriptions do not match up.

After checking the latest version you sent me, it seems things are still screwy. As far as I'm concerned this isn't a very useful mod, because every time you use the FLIR your view snaps to the default FOV and you can't see enough. Very distracting and annoying IMO. The FLIR is integral to the Jane's F-18 experience.

Ok Slikk, testing whether now works correctly with these new values, thanks you!!

For HEX edits, line numbers are pretty useless (if you're really talking HEX edits that is...), can't you share the offsets instead?

Joe, you mind posting that mod on the FTP?

Joe

The edits that I originally posted were for the first version that I sent you. As I said before that version was incorrect. I revised the edits that I did for the wideview mod on the previous page. The step that was added on the previous page is the step that brings the cockpit back to normal view. I did not use a Hex editor. I used a simple file comparison program. This may be why what you and I see don't match up. I don't know what else to tell you, but the values that I posted on the previous page are what I changed in the .exe to make this work. I don't know why this is not working for you Joe, but it works for everyone else that I have sent this mod to. From the description that you give; it sounds like it's acting just like the first one that I sent you. Take a look at the dates of the files that I sent you, if they are the same then that would explain why it's not working. I had some of the guys that I sent this mod, to send me some pics just so I could see what it looks like to them, and it looks just as it should. Here are the pics that they sent me below. The pics show the original view, then the zoomed out view, then back to normal view.

http://news.webshots.com/photo/2037175510025714458APEQpS

http://news.webshots.com/photo/2358015180025714458LdGtUG

http://news.webshots.com/photo/2696375530025714458yvPWwe



http://news.webshots.com/photo/2649140630025714458cCuEbY

http://news.webshots.com/photo/2455312970025714458penzRo

http://news.webshots.com/photo/2882771110025714458QdOzLs


Devas and iam73

The file is not that big. If you give me your e-mail address I will send it to you.

Slikk

it works good for me, just as Slikk told me how it was going to look

THX Slikk!!! I'm sent my e-mail


THX AGAIN!!! Slikk

Devas

e-mail sent. Let me know if it works alright for you.

Slikk

yui

e-mail sent.

Slikk

yes it works.and wonderful,my resolution is 1280x1024.it seem no problem including FLIR。
thank u very much Slikk

this is my screenshot

Glad you like it yui.

iam73

e-mail sent.

Slikk

Thank you Slikk works fine, I will try to keep taking stability for a flight online

Can you tell me what this program is, or where I can get one that does the same thing? I see it's not hex editing, so I'm using the wrong tool. Sorry for being a boob; I simply don't know what sort of application we're talking about.

I don't want to put this on the TSH site until I know how to reproduce it. This is because I want to be able to make sure it can be done if the executable is further modified. Once we hex-edit, assembly-modify, or dll-inject F18.exe for another TSH release, this mod will disappear, and I need to make sure it can come back.

Hey Joe.

I meant the private FTP, in my personal folder or yours (/IAM). I'll be able to tell exactly what hex edits are required in the exe if I can have a look at the mod... but slikk is having some issues emailing it to me.

We can discuss further on the private forum if you wish and want to test the hex edits once identified.

Cheers!

Hi Joe hope this will help:



Number 80 corresponds to the original value exe, And you can see the exact location of the offset in the hexa editor

80 hexa = 128 decimal (original value)
A2 hexa = 162 decimal (moded version Slikk)
B9 hexa = 185 decimal (my version)

It seems that increasing the decimal value is far vision, but also note that HUD maintains the same size as the original vision, would be perfect find that value and put proportional according to the value of the FOV selected

See you

So:

offset 0x0F047F change byte from 80 to A2 or B9
offset 0x219F17 change byte from 80 to A2 or B9
offset 0x21C03B change byte from 80 to A2 or B9

Hmm, I have a 4th entry of that same byte string (A205 8042) @ offset 0x16BA5A, I wonder if it needs to be changed as well...

I'll test later on.

iam73

I sent the mod to the other e-mail adress that you gave me. You should have it by now.

Joe

I used a program called (Merge) to do the edits.

Slikk

Another thing that I noticed is that the Map, FLIR, and the ADI are not attached to the zoom out. This is how it was in the original TSH version. I have looked and looked but I have not been able to find the TSH extended zoom values in the .exe If any of you can find where the original TSH extended zoom is, The Map, FLIR, and the ADI need to be attached so that they follow the cockpit when you move your head. However, I did notice that if you hit the Zoom_MPCD button and then go head up again that the Map, FLIR, and the ADI are attached for some reason.

Slikk

Any news on this subject.

So far I have tested this mod with 3 pilots onlline and I did not notice anything unusual during the flight or mission.

Devas,

I am going to talk to Slikk about it shortly and I'm confident I will be able to put it on the TSH website soon.

Very good news Joe, I am attentive to the changes.

Wow. I really appreciate guys like Joe, Slikk and others who have the knowledge to keep improving this great Sim. I often plan my upgrade purchases on whether JF18 will still perform well. Thanks so much.

Hello all!

Who can I PM to get this?

Thanks!

Bump

Will this mod work for 22" widescrren (1680X1050) ?? If so where can I get it?

I'd also like to check this out!

Give me your e-mail address and I will send it to you.

Slikk

PM sent. Thanks a lot!

Bump...I really want to see how this view looks! Sorry, I'm a bit anxious!

Bump?

E-mail sent.

Slikk

Email received - thanks again!

I got an e-mail but, no link or attachment. Anyone get anything like that?

Does this mean if you have Triplehead2Go you can use three monitors??

I would like to get this Fix or patch --- jlaf2112 AT ComCast DOT Net


THNX Looks Great too by the way and if this Sim Now will work in a Triple Screen I will be thrilled as I am setting up a Triple Screen setup

See the TAW Forum Thread "MFD Info Needed" last couple pages..

The sim already works in triplehead; select the 1920x480 screen resolution using the TSHv3 Manager.

However, since the FOV doesn't change, and the use of the FLIR messes with the TSH wideview option, it is problematic in triplehead, to say the least. I was initially very excited about Slikk's work that he has documented for this thread, but I was never able to make any of his solutions work satisfactorily for me.

I saw the SimHQ review of the triplehead2go in another thread and saw the problems with JF/A-18

@UnderTheRadar

I sent the files to you directly, twice. I'm not sure but maybe your e-mail cant except .exe files.

You can now download directly from the links below.

http://www.4shared.com/file/90569260/b9eec12f/FA-18E_Cockpit_-_Wide_1.html

http://www.4shared.com/file/90569356/7a625dee/FA-18E_Cockpit_-_Wide_2.html

http://www.4shared.com/file/90569448/818e572d/FA-18E_Cockpit_-_Wide_3.html

NOTE: The install path for the installer will probably not work for you because my game is probably not in the same folder as yours is. So make sure that the installer is directed to your F-18 root directory and you'll be fine.

Be sure to make a backup of your (F18.EXE) file just in case you want you go back to the way it was before.

Enjoy!

Slikk

The downloads work great! Thank you SO much! This is something I've been wanting to see happen for a long time. You rock Slikk! Thanks again!

Hey, Slikk! Long time. Hope all is well.
I got a lost somewhere in this thread - remind me why there are three files?

@Eugene

Good to see you too bro.

Only one of the files is needed, it all depends on the resolution you use. Each of the files gives you a different aspect, so give each of them a try and see which one of them works best for you.

Slikk

Thanks, Slikk. Man, you are so creative!

Thanks a lot Slikk!

Slikk,

What do your installation files do? Do they modify F18.exe, or replace it with a modified version?

@Joe

1: The installation files simply install the F18.exe into your root folder.

2: The F18.exe that it installs dose not alter anything in the game except the aspect ratio. Other than that, the game play and every other aspect of the original F18.exe file is exactly the same.

Slikk

Ok, so it replaces the file.

I'm quite concerned about the part that I bolded. Did you base your modifications on the TSHv3.06 executable, or on the original F18.exe? That makes a big difference, and this thread needs to make clear what exactly is going on. I beleive from past discussions that this mod is actually based on the TSHv3.06 executable, which really means that TSHv3.06 is effectively required to use this.

@Joe

The wide view modifications are based on the TSHv3.06 executable, I fly on-line through HL with my squad, VMFA-323 Death Rattlers, and I also go on flights with some of the VFA-41 Black Aces. Both of these squads use TSHv3.06, and the wide view mod works when I fly off-line or on-line with no conflicts what so ever.

Slikk

Thanks for the clarification, Slikk. I know I didn't have as much luck with these in the past as other users did, but I'm going to have another go and take a harder look.

Slikk,

Whats the difference between the 3 executables? I just ran the first one and it seems to work fine.

Thanks again!

The three executables provide 3 different field-of-view values (i.e. three different degrees of wider views).

Ok, thanks Joe!

Thanks Slikk!!!

Working fine @ 1280x800. I'm using the first .exe and finally the widescreen on my laptop has some good use.

Help me out here: do I use all 3 or just one? What is the difference?

Only one of the files is needed, it all depends on the resolution you use. Each of the files gives you a different aspect, so give each of them a try and see which one of them works best for you.

Slikk

The term is field of view. Each executable gives you a different field of view (i.e. how "zoomed in" your view is).

Aspect, or aspect ratio, is a term that describes the height of an image relative to its width.

Jane's F-18 has a variable aspect ratio in-flight, which means that screen resolutions that differ from an aspect ratio of 4:3 (i.e. 800x600, 1024x768, etc.) will look correct - widescreen monitors will show proper scaling, meaning circular objects remain circular.

However, Jane's F-18 also calculates the field of view from the vertical resolution. This means that the wider the screen gets, the more vertical image is lost. Games that do this are referred to as being "Vert-" (vertical minus). What you want for proper widescreen support is "Hor+" (horizontal plus). Slikk's executables take Jane's F-18 in-cockpit view and restore varying degrees of the Hor+ attribute. Once again, there are three different options because there each one provides a different field of view. Choose the one that suits your preferences.

Thanks, Slikk, very useful mod. I'm using it in 1400x900 game resolution on my 24' monitor and with Multisampling AAx4 and AFx16 in nHancer the game looks awesome at true wider aspect.

Dirk.

Have to say a massive thank you Slikk. Now finally able to use a wide screen monitor. Happy to say that that my new BenQ 2400WD is working very nicely. 1920 x 1200 is a nice to way to see Jane's from a new angle

Cheers,

Bonkers

Hi Slikk,

I would like some help if you can point me in the right direction. I would like to get a TH2Go setp with 3 projectors. Now Joe has said that it will work sort of with the TH2Go and the SWView pit that is currently available. but I here there are some quarks.

I had read this entire thread and they say that in:

0x0F047F change byte from 80 to A2 or B9
offset 0x219F17 change byte from 80 to A2 or B9
offset 0x21C03B change byte from 80 to A2 or B9

Now I loaded up the Hex editor "xvi32" and opened the exe and searched for those values 0x0F047F... etc, but they did not find anything?? Now my question is what would I put in a search to find the above values needed to chage the FOV, or just the location File or exe to open??

I only need 1 more projector, I currently have 2 and need 1 bulb plus the TH2Go gizmo. Now in the meantime I would like to get my feet wet and try if possible to get the TH2Go and F18 working flawlessly. Now it might already work with your MOD as I read that all you need is a Widescreen rez for it to work with TH2Go and most of the games they got working are hacked versions of the FOV..


Perhaps somebody with the TH2Go and JF/A-18 can chime in and tell us of what is exactly wrong and what would need to be fixed to get it working properly?? I read that the FLIR or something is either screwed up or just looks out of place???

I would really appreciate and please feel free to ignore me and my ramblings hehe. but I would appreciate some assistance or perhaps a nod in the right direction or perhaps a book to read that will answer my noob Hex edit questions ..

THNX
Jerry

As I've said before, the TSH Wideview pit (toggled with the SWView command) gives a proper FOV for triplehead gaming. Slikk does not need to create a new FOV for this; we've already got it. However, I too would like some clarification about finding the hex address for this parameter.

The problem I've had with all FOV mods is when using the FLIR. It's not the FLIR that gets corrupted, it's that the FOV changes when operating the FLIR controls. You don't need triplehead to try this; it can be seen in action when using the TSH wideview pit in a single-screen resolution.

Fly with a FLIR, switch to wideview, and then operate the FLIR. My experience is that this causes the FOV to shirnk. It doesn't go all of the way back to the normal FOV, but it does change and is very distracting.

Before spending money on additional projectors and bulbs it would be prudent to consider all of the limitations JF-18 in triplehead has:
- FOV issues
- HUD symbology massive overbleed of the glass
- required resolution of only 640x480 per display

Hi, OK IF I can only use 640 x 480 which is unplayable this is a bust. But I was not asking Slikk to make another pit, I was going to tinker with the settings

Jane's F-18 is a DirectX 7 game, which means it is limited to a max resolution of 2048x2048. Practically speaking, this means that 1920x480 is the largest useable triplehead resolution. This equals 3 screens each at a resolution of 640x480.

Hi.
Reading through this topic, I understand that this is some kind of FOV patch, basically allowing me to see more of the cockpit on the screen.
Am I right? (2 comparable screenshot would be great)

If I am right, the next thing I realise, that patch is older than tsh4, and since its a replacement exe, I doubt its working anymore.
I hope there's a newer version, and I am just too dumb to find it I can live with some preaches around the usage of the search function, knowing that I can see the hud and the mfs at the same time on screen.
Thanks in advance.

There's a problem with what you realise in the next thing. You may want to try the mod with the latest exe from TSH. Just make sure to back it up before patching. I can't fly without it on my 16:10 aspect monitor. If you're on 4:3 don't bother.

Dirk.

Thanks Dirk for the answer.

I am on a 16:9 widescreen (1920x1080 native), so I need it bad.
Well, I'll give it a try, and report back.

TSH v3.06 and TSH v4.02 executable files are identical. These FOV mods will work with TSH v4.

This was the answer I hoped for, thanks for the clarification Joe!

Hi.
Sorry for refloating this thread, but the links for downloading the exe files are no longer working. I'm looking to fly JF18 again and I remember I really liked the change in FOV (the more subtle of the three, IIRC).

So, plz, could anybody upload the files again or email them to me?

Thx in advance.

Hi,
I will upload them this night when I get home, and let you know about it.

My 16:9 monitor and I will be really grateful.

Well, perhaps... as long as you don't mind the HUD text spilling off the sides of the HUD.

Hi, here is the link:

http://rapidshare.com/files/446982738/JF18Wide.zip

Sorry for being late, I had a quite complex evening yesterday.

Got it!

Thank you very much Staniol.

Any chance anyone can post these again?

By any chance, can someone host it permanently somewhere?

Here you go:
http://rapidshare.com/files/454525183/JF18Wide.zip

Thanks so much! Now if I could just get the TSH 4 land palette to be alittle darker (I kinda like the defaults) I'd be perfectly happy! I'm planning on trying the sim on my 55" TV now that I have a big TV.

As I've indicated a number of times, I would be happy to integrate these changes full-time into TSH v4 and host them on the TSH website. However, Slikk has never provided an adequate explanation of how the changes were made or how they can be made again for a different F18.exe file.

Sorry Joe, I've been away from this sim for quite a while. That saves me from trying to update the pal file though.

Sorrty tom,cat, I mssed your query about terrain colors. Look here; you should be able to find an option that suits you.
http://tsh.war-fighters.net/index.php?op...mp;limitstart=7
http://tsh.war-fighters.net/index.php?op...mp;limitstart=5

Thanks Joe, was wondering why there were so many landpals in the TSH folder but just made the connection after reading that link, appreciate it.

Hey Joe,

I checked the default no-cd 1.01f exe and the latest exe coming is TSH 4.02 and the offsets are the same for the FOV mod.

You'll find 3 instances where the FOV is defined (32bit float: A2058042): 0x16BA57, 0x219F14, 0x21C038.

This float value defines the FOV: A2058042 = 64.01100159.

All you need to do is patch the 3rd byte of that value to anything between 00 and FF at all 3 offsets mentione above to get different FOV within the sim.
The offsets should remain the same as long as code is NOT injected in the EXE above those offsets.

I've tested all kind of values but the higher it goes, the less good it looks.
I personlly use "C8" (200) with a 1920x1080 resolution and it looks pretty good but the HUD is not scaled correctly. The problem is, even if I was able to scale the HUD to match the cockpit with a higher FOV, it would become unreadable, even with the bigfonthud mod.:



Is French still around by the way? I'been away from Jane's and TSH private stuff for a loooooooooooooooooong time.

Good to see people in the know coming back.

Cheers,
Dirk.

Oh man, you have no idea.

So what's the scoop?

Would say there is any scoop to report, but our capabilities now are way beyond what you remember. Just lacking the team to do anything with it. I will send a PM.

Ripcord

iam,

Yeah, we need to get in touch for real. Please email me at jkeefe@verizon.net.

Thanks for the specifics. Can you point me to a program to use to accomplish this?

A bit more details about my earlier post... I did some more research on this last week.

From what I could see, there are only 2 offsets that need to be modified...

0x16BA57, this one is used in a function and I couldn't really find out exactly what it was used for in the game. I haven't spent that many hours on this though...
0x219F14, this one is data (in some table) and defines the overall cockpit FOV
0x21C038, this one is alose data (in some table) and defines the FLIR FOV

Of course, if the 2 offsets above (219F14 AND 21C038 do not match, FLIR display will be wrong... in my testing, the FLIR were displayed behind the cockpit.

All that to say that I was able to get a perfectly fine wide view with a working FLIR only by changing the 2 offsets mentioned above.
Oh by the way, this is a 4 bytes float, the first 2 bytes can be set to 0000 and it will just remove the decimals. At home, I'm testing/playing with this value on a 1920x1080 display: 0000C880

I might put a bit more time on this but I might have different priorities as far as Jane's F-18 is concerned in the next few weeks......

Hello guys,
I realize I'm fairly late to the party, but this mod is just about the last thing I need to truly get into this sim. The zoomed in HUD view is really frustrating for me coming from so many widescreen, wide FOV sims.
Can anyone help me to get my sim to look like that one in the picture? I don't really understand what he is doing to accomplish that. I'm not afraid to hack if someone can get me started.

Or, if someone can re-post the widescreen pit, I will stick it on my mediafire account forever and ever.

Toon do you need the widescreen pit or the FOV fix??

I have 3 widescreen pit exe which I believe are what is being talked about here..

To get the Wideview you need to map SW_VIEW in the controls to a key function that was you will get the pit like pictured.

I need the SW_View. I am looking everywhere, but I don't see what key command that is, nor can I find it so that I can assign a key to it.

I must be missing something...

Edit- I found it. I just had to find the google sweet spot. I have to say that the wide view is much more enjoyable. I'm looking forward to getting deeper into this sim finally.

Thanks,
Toonces

you can manually add it to the F18Keys.ini file.

KEY_COMMAND=SW_VIEW

Where KEY_COMMAND is what you want it to be.

I see that you've figured it out, but FYI this is documented here:
http://tsh.war-fighters.net/index.php?op...p;limitstart=11